38 Special +P FBI load - yesterday same as today ?

[Waywatcher]

I have tried Speer and Rim Rock 158 LHP bullets, combined with Power Pistol, AA#5, H. Universal, and HS-6. I tried both std and mag primers with HS-6.

By far and away, my best results were with Rim Rock 158 LHP w/gc and Power Pistol. 5.4 grains (low end +P) launches the bullet with very respectable velocity, no leading, and great accuracy. I use std primers and get amazingly low ES and SD.

I chronoed this load in three different guns one cold winter day:
S&W M15-4 with 4" barrel: 960fps
S&W Pre-27 with 5" barrel: 920 fps
Ruger GP100 with 4.2" barrel: 900fps

I was surprised and impressed by the results, and this load has become a keeper. I am going to try 5.0 and 5.2 grains some day just to see how it performs, but 5.4 grains of Power Pistol with a Rim Rock 158 LHP is great!

 

[PR24]

I'm sure the Feds & the UN say at all lead SWCHP's are too dangerous to the receiving party.....you know, lead poisoning?

 

[11shooter]

Note: On using Alliant 2400 for .38 special FBI load.

I love 2400 for stout .357 magnum loads, but it doesn't work as well for "modern" .38 special +P loads because 2400 does not burn as efficiently in smaller charges. It leaves granules behind that can get stuck in the star extractor. An extremely heavy crimp helps, but does not solver the problem. I have gone as low as 8.8 grains of 2400 behind a 158 grain Speer L HP bullet. Not a consistent load, and lots of granules left behind. I got better results with 9.4 grains, and the best with 10.5 grains. I occasionally load up a few of these bullets with 10 grains of 2400 (which is considered too hot by today's standards). It gives 875 fps in my 2" Rossi 5-shot revolver. It's all steel, but I wouldn't fire very many of this load through it, or through any alloy .38 special gun. I've sort of given up on loading my own FBI loads. I can afford Buffalo Bore loads, as long as I don't shoot 'em! I'll carry the BBores, and shoot a few a couple of times a years to rotate my stock. For practice I settle for a heavy dose of Bullseye even though it will not match the BBore loads.

Just my 2 cents worth. Good luck, all.

 

[bmcgilvray]

For your amusement, here's more information on some of the topics above, resurrected in this hoary old thread I stuck up here a few years back.
http://smith-wessonforum.com/ammo/144598-some-38-special-chronograph-tests.html

 

[Rule3]

What FBI Agent uses a revolver "today"

 

[rwsmith]

I like the heaviest.....

I like the heaviest bullet that I can get to or above 1000 fps. I don't think you have to worry about a 158 gr bullet, soft or hard cast, being pushed to fast and breaking up out of a .38, or even a .357 for that matter.

 

[Rule3]

As we are doing Necro threads,

If I carried a snub I would have the Treasury load.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/ammo/108345-38-p-110gr-jhp-treasury-ammo-test.html

 

[Calliope]

I'm sure the Feds & the UN say at all lead SWCHP's are too dangerous to the receiving party.....you know, lead poisoning?

You dug up a 2 year old thread for that?
Since we're on the subject, the RCMP also used the FBI load and they reported excellent results with it when euthanizing large animals including moose. IIRC, they had 5" model 10s.

I thought I would just mention the Magnus swaged 158 LSWC-HP as an alternative to the Speer & Hornady offerings. It seems like a much better bullet with a wider nose and better hollow point. Very accurate in my .357 at .38 +P velocities.

 

[USSR]

Sorry, but I've got to resurrect this thread one more time.
Spent most of the day doing load development and testing of the FBI load in my newly purchased S&W 19-4 snubbie. Came up with 3 loads that probably generate 900fps out of the 2.5" barrel: 7.0gr of HS-6, 6.4gr of AA#5, and 5.6gr of Unique. Wasn't too concerned about running them over the chronograph, as what I really wanted to do was see what the hollowpoint bullets I cast did.

I cast them really soft (about 35:1) so that they would expand at 800-900fps velocities. I then had an idea that I tried for testing them for expansion. I bought a large plastic cooler at Walmart and cut a "window" in the one end of it for the bullets to go thru, and then taped a replaceable piece of plastic over the window. At the far end of the cooler, I placed a piece of sheet metal to prevent any bullet from going out the back end of the cooler. I then filled it full of water and then shot thru the window from a distance of 10'. I had hoped that 2 feet of water would stop the bullet, but it banged into the sheet metal at the far end, and the bullet was damaged. I am going to have to find something replaceable that is a little harder that I can insert into the water filled cooler to slow the bullet down. Any ideas? Only thing I can think of is something like 1/4" luan floor underlay or something like that.

Don

PS - ArchAngelCD, love that HS-6 load.

 

[Rule3]

Almost any HP bullet will expand in just water, It is not a viable test of anything really. Like milk jugs or wet newspaper, fun perhaps but not relevant, If you do not want to spend time and money on ballistic gel, see if you can get a big ham from the store that has not sold by date. They end up destroying them anyway, Befriend the meat department guys.

I am sure those bullets will put a serious hurt on whatever they hit!

Refer to the sticky on the FBI load above

 

[USSR]

Almost any HP bullet will expand in just water, It is not a viable test of anything really.

Uh, No. You can pretty much cast solids with whatever alloy and get away with it. But, hollowpoints need the alloy matched to velocity. Too hard of an alloy and they will either not expand or fracture upon expanding, depending upon the velocity and the medium.

Don

 

[just for fun]

In a snub nose only Unique will get you the "FBI" load with the Alliant powders with 38 spl data but the recoil is harsh. You can get 792 to 813 fps with the others if you don't mind a lighter load. .I don't have the new PP.

Using data from Speer Reloading Manual #10 Page 363 shows 158 JHP and 10 grains of 2400 (+P load) at 929 FPS fired from a 6 inch Ruger. Used this data with 158LSWCHP and got 924 FPS from 2 inch Taurus 85SS. Heavy recoil, cases fell out primers were CCI Standard and looked good. Very tight group at 10 yds. and is current carry load in my 36 J frame.

 

[Rule3]

Uh, No. You can pretty much cast solids with whatever alloy and get away with it. But, hollowpoints need the alloy matched to velocity. Too hard of an alloy and they will either not expand or fracture upon expanding, depending upon the velocity and the medium.

Don

OK, then you deal with expansion versus penetration. No expansion over penetration and the opposite.
Still maintain that water is not a good test medium, It does not compress and is almost a solid when something going fast enough hits it. Even though a body is a mostly water there are all those other pesky parts in the way.

FBI no longer uses lead bullets anyway.