Shot 1# of titegroup. It was ok for jacketed, had leading with soft swaged HBWC in my .38. It burns very hot and melts bullets, accuracy was only average. I like bullseye better, but these days you have to take what you can get.
.38 SPL - How about TiteGroup or 700-X?
- Thread starter tacotime
- Start date
Looks like my testing in a 2in. J Frame and a swaged 158 showed TG accuracy with several loads was mediocre but one 700X load grouped very much like Bullseye, which along with a 231 load is still the best result so far.
TG also flopped with a Berry's 158 and 148 HBWC. Maybe it would do better with a longer barrel or other bullet.
TG also flopped with a Berry's 158 and 148 HBWC. Maybe it would do better with a longer barrel or other bullet.
Use what you have. Don't drink, sleep, watch TV, talk to anyone or smoke while reloading. Listen to a ball game.
As was noted. Pay attention.
As was noted. Pay attention.
I experienced severe leading in a half dozen .38 Special revolvers using Titegroup which showed no or very little leading using the same cast bullets and Bullseye, Unique and W231.
Stopped using Titegroup with anything except jacketed bullets.
Bkreutz
US Veteran
If you have some Titegroup, you can usually trade it with shooters that compete using major power factor. They will usually give you more than an equal trade, at least that's what I found. I didn't like the feel of TG in 9mm (too "snappy") so I traded 8# of Titegroup (minus a hundred grains or so, I told the other guy this) for 10# of CFE Pistol(which he didn't like). He was happy as .....(fill in the blank). 
If you know what your doing, this is a non issue.
Man has to know his limitations.
I loaded a bunch of .38 Special with 3.7grains of 700X under 125 grain JHP bullets. 700X metered without issue in my Dillon 650.
M3Stuart
Member
Per my books and the website load data, I load 5.0gr of Titegroup with 158gr Berry's plated FN's with very good, even great, results. It's a nice load, it all burns (little flash), recoil is moderate. It does not appear to be case sensitive. I use CCI550 (mag) primers.
Clovishound
Member
I've only been loading a few years. I have loaded several thousand .38s in that time. I have used TG, Universal, Power Pistol, PB, and CFE pistol in .38 spcl. All of them use only a small portion of the case. When I finish a session and need to empty my powder measure, I can put 3 to 4 throws or more in an empty case without running over the top with any of these powders.
Consider a powder check die, particularly if you are using a progressive or turret press.
Consider a powder check die, particularly if you are using a progressive or turret press.
m657
Member
While I've never used TG in a 2" anything, the 4 & 5 & 6 inch revos I have used in moderate loads have all worked quite well with no leading at all using 100% cast boolits over a decade with multiple recipes.
Haven't seen it on the shelf for about 3 years now but would buy more in a heartbeat.
Re: CFE is a 'new' powder to me, only loaded 1# recently. It worked wll in 38/9 so I'll be looking for more of it too. Seems to meter very well from a Dillon.
Haven't seen it on the shelf for about 3 years now but would buy more in a heartbeat.
Re: CFE is a 'new' powder to me, only loaded 1# recently. It worked wll in 38/9 so I'll be looking for more of it too. Seems to meter very well from a Dillon.
I'm with the Unique/Bullseye guys. If you want to useTG Berry's or another plated bullet is the best way to go in my experience.
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Here's a good target load I've been using in my Clark PPC revolver. Starting to like plated bullets for indoor shooting, less smoke!
Bullet: Bullet Works Copper Plated 148grn. DEWC w/ Cannelure
Powder: Hodgdon Titegroup 3.3 grs.
Primer: Federal 100 Small Pistol Match
Case: Federal .38 Special
LOAL: 1.220 (Taper Crimped)
A 5-shot groups at 25 yards off-hand.
Bullet: Bullet Works Copper Plated 148grn. DEWC w/ Cannelure
Powder: Hodgdon Titegroup 3.3 grs.
Primer: Federal 100 Small Pistol Match
Case: Federal .38 Special
LOAL: 1.220 (Taper Crimped)
A 5-shot groups at 25 yards off-hand.
I have had similar results with similar quantity of powder used.
I also use TG in 45 acp all with good results.
If you are that worried about overcharges you need to really examine your reloading procedures.
Simmer down
Member
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I love me some titegroup. It flows in my garden variety RSBC powder measure the same each time once its set. It's not to costly and I can use it for several revolver loads. I prefer it in 44 S.
As for dropping multi-loads in a case, just don't do it.
As for dropping multi-loads in a case, just don't do it.
m657
Member
re: "700X metered without issue in my Dillon 650."
Great SCOTT!!!! In my 650 I can barely approximate 700x within a grain of intended charge and it takes constant fiddling....
Re: 'double/triple charges' for TiteGroup....Enter Now the fabled and maligned progressive press....so far not an issue.
From the 'odd how things work' file: I've been hoarding the last bit of my old 8# jug of TG used for years in various range games. Turned out I had nearly 1000 rounds worth in there....and when finally empty, on my next visit to the LGS he actually had a SINGLE #......I haven't seen it on any shelf within 50 miles of here, in the last 4-5 years.
I'm a fan of TiteGroup for a host of reasons.
Great SCOTT!!!! In my 650 I can barely approximate 700x within a grain of intended charge and it takes constant fiddling....
Re: 'double/triple charges' for TiteGroup....Enter Now the fabled and maligned progressive press....so far not an issue.
From the 'odd how things work' file: I've been hoarding the last bit of my old 8# jug of TG used for years in various range games. Turned out I had nearly 1000 rounds worth in there....and when finally empty, on my next visit to the LGS he actually had a SINGLE #......I haven't seen it on any shelf within 50 miles of here, in the last 4-5 years.
I'm a fan of TiteGroup for a host of reasons.
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Model 15-4ever
Member
I've been using 700-X for the past 45 years of reloading. It's a great powder for target loads and service-level loads in .38 Spl, .44 Special, .45 Auto and .45 Colt. I've found it consistently accurate, mild of recoil, and economical. I've also used it for 12 gauge target loads, back when reloading 12 gauge was actually economical. Never had a problem with inconsistent charges.
What's not to like?
Reloading 101: If you are using a powder measure - any brand - you need to FILL the hopper (not partway) and allow the powder to settle to get consistent thrown charges. This is true with ANY propellant. This may require 5-10 throws of the measure before it settles in. No powder will be consistent simply dumping it into the measure. The measure must also be solidly mounted, and your operating technique CONSISTENT.
Reloading 102: If you are using a powder measure with a progressive press, after the above procedures, you need to additionally run 5-10 rounds SIMULTANEOUSLY through the complete cycle - resizing, belling, charging, seating and crimping - to allow the powder to settle in the hopper, and be thrown under the same force conditions as you will be using in your volume loading. This is done AFTER you have adjusted the measure to throw the exact charge you want. This will require WEIGHING those 5-10 charges after you throw them.
Apparently, there are many ignorant (not a sin) and/or lazy (inexcusable) reloaders. Using the above well-known and proven reloading methods, you will not have a problem with consistency with 700-X. Have used it with great results in the Dillon 550, with extreme variations of 0.1 grain or less.
I've also used Titegroup in many similar applications, in addition to target and service loads in 9mm Luger. It's a great powder as well. Very economical, very accurate and consistent. I use the Dillon 550 and on every handle stroke, see the powder bar moving. I've never had a squib or double charge that way.
If you are hand-charging a loading block full of cases, it's true a bulkier powder will make it easier to tell if you mistakenly have double-charged a case, during your pre-seating inspection of the cases. I stopped using that technique my first year of reloading - it is too easy to make a mistake. If you are not using a progressive press, you are far better off and safer charging each case individually and THEN placing it in the loading block. This way, only charged cases go into the block, and YOU put it there AFTER charging it.
BTW... storing powder in the hopper is a bad idea. Some, like Titegroup, will etch the plastic container. Always empty it back into the original container after finishing reloading your batch.
Also... on the issue of leading & Titegroup. ANY fast burning propellant, at near-max levels, will cause leading, especially in rougher barrels. There are so many factors involved including bore/cylinder throat/forcing cone diameters, bullet hardness and diameter, and pressure level, that making a blanket statement about Titegroup - or any other propellant for that matter - is meaningless. I have had leading - and no leading - with all kinds of propellants. The loads I have used regularly with Titegroup have no leading, otherwise I would not be using it.
Be safe. Reloading is a great hobby, but requires time and careful attention.
What's not to like?
Reloading 101: If you are using a powder measure - any brand - you need to FILL the hopper (not partway) and allow the powder to settle to get consistent thrown charges. This is true with ANY propellant. This may require 5-10 throws of the measure before it settles in. No powder will be consistent simply dumping it into the measure. The measure must also be solidly mounted, and your operating technique CONSISTENT.
Reloading 102: If you are using a powder measure with a progressive press, after the above procedures, you need to additionally run 5-10 rounds SIMULTANEOUSLY through the complete cycle - resizing, belling, charging, seating and crimping - to allow the powder to settle in the hopper, and be thrown under the same force conditions as you will be using in your volume loading. This is done AFTER you have adjusted the measure to throw the exact charge you want. This will require WEIGHING those 5-10 charges after you throw them.
Apparently, there are many ignorant (not a sin) and/or lazy (inexcusable) reloaders. Using the above well-known and proven reloading methods, you will not have a problem with consistency with 700-X. Have used it with great results in the Dillon 550, with extreme variations of 0.1 grain or less.
I've also used Titegroup in many similar applications, in addition to target and service loads in 9mm Luger. It's a great powder as well. Very economical, very accurate and consistent. I use the Dillon 550 and on every handle stroke, see the powder bar moving. I've never had a squib or double charge that way.
If you are hand-charging a loading block full of cases, it's true a bulkier powder will make it easier to tell if you mistakenly have double-charged a case, during your pre-seating inspection of the cases. I stopped using that technique my first year of reloading - it is too easy to make a mistake. If you are not using a progressive press, you are far better off and safer charging each case individually and THEN placing it in the loading block. This way, only charged cases go into the block, and YOU put it there AFTER charging it.
BTW... storing powder in the hopper is a bad idea. Some, like Titegroup, will etch the plastic container. Always empty it back into the original container after finishing reloading your batch.
Also... on the issue of leading & Titegroup. ANY fast burning propellant, at near-max levels, will cause leading, especially in rougher barrels. There are so many factors involved including bore/cylinder throat/forcing cone diameters, bullet hardness and diameter, and pressure level, that making a blanket statement about Titegroup - or any other propellant for that matter - is meaningless. I have had leading - and no leading - with all kinds of propellants. The loads I have used regularly with Titegroup have no leading, otherwise I would not be using it.
Be safe. Reloading is a great hobby, but requires time and careful attention.
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Scharfschuetzer
Member
If I were starting out loading 38 Special cast bullets for target shooting now, I would use Tightgroup. As it is, I've enough Bullseye to last quite a while. Still, TG provides equally as good performance in my revolvers as Bullseye and I've not noted any leading.
Tightgroup also gives extremely small extreme spreads and good accuracy in my 45 Colt when using 240 grain cast bullets and again, absolutely no leading. Its extreme spreads are a third of what I can achieve with 231 and Unique and case orientation does not affect velocities like it does with Unique and 231.
I've not noted hot burning either after several pounds of TG, but I only use it in target loads using cast bullets. This is probably what the powder was formulated for.
All the above were tested using a chronograph over several range sessions.
Someday I'll try it in the 45 ACP in both revolvers and 1911s, but as it is, I'm not about to run out of Bullseye, Unique or 231 so I'll just keep using those powders for now.
Tightgroup also gives extremely small extreme spreads and good accuracy in my 45 Colt when using 240 grain cast bullets and again, absolutely no leading. Its extreme spreads are a third of what I can achieve with 231 and Unique and case orientation does not affect velocities like it does with Unique and 231.
I've not noted hot burning either after several pounds of TG, but I only use it in target loads using cast bullets. This is probably what the powder was formulated for.
All the above were tested using a chronograph over several range sessions.
Someday I'll try it in the 45 ACP in both revolvers and 1911s, but as it is, I'm not about to run out of Bullseye, Unique or 231 so I'll just keep using those powders for now.
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Both will work fine. You need to check the powder on each load. The truth is no powder is going to fill much on a 38 Special and double charge will pretty much fit with most powders but is easy to spot if you are looking.
cowboy4evr
Member
I loaded and shot both . My preference is 700X . I have " ZERO " metering problems . Regards Paul
