fredj338
Member
Title pretty much says it. In that scenario, 12ga against your 5 shot snub. Would you want something else for your EDC?
5 shot snub & recent MD shooting
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Bohica793
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"There is nothing more terrifying than hearing multiple people get shot while you're under your desk and then hear the gunman reload."
After reading this, I had two thoughts: Firstly, if you can hear he is reloading, why aren't you doing something to prevent him from shooting again and, secondly, If you have the 5 shot snubby, you would have a decent answer to question number one.
After reading this, I had two thoughts: Firstly, if you can hear he is reloading, why aren't you doing something to prevent him from shooting again and, secondly, If you have the 5 shot snubby, you would have a decent answer to question number one.
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Media reports state the murderer blocked newspaper staff from fleeing by blocking exit doors. I have no insight as to the security policies of the newspaper building, but I suspect this is yet another example of a protection system failure (if they even bothered developing one) and "gun free zone" shooting.
If he was expecting armed opposition (even with only 5 rounds of .38 Special) he might have left himself an escape route, or not tried anything at all.
If he was expecting armed opposition (even with only 5 rounds of .38 Special) he might have left himself an escape route, or not tried anything at all.
washerman
Member
That 5 shot snub is just as deadly as that 12 gauge
First rule of a gunfight. HAVE A GUN. Doesn't matter which as long as You use it properly.
Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!
OP
fredj338
Member
Really? So if you had a choice you would go 5 shot snub vs a 12ga?
I am mostly playing devil's advocate. A pistol vs long gun is tough to start with. Then a less than optimum pistol at that. I know, have a gun, but nothing wrong with a "better" gun for these small % chance encounters.
Incidents like this should give all of us that ccw pause & evaluate what & how we carry & how much training, practice & what our skill level is. This was not a punk mugger but stone cold killer. I doubt he would have been chased off by a couple rounds coming his way. He had a purpose & was going to go thru with it. These are the 1% predators that require a more serious approach to EDC imo. yes small %, but not to the 5 dead.
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Beats a stapler or toner cartridge...or listening to the shooter reload and hoping you are not the next victim.
Knowing I was up against a man with a shotgun, my preference would be an M-60 with a very long belt. Being as that is not practical, I would use whatever I had, be it a 5-shot snubby, G17, or single-shot derringer. Your other option is to die without a fight.
GF
Member
I carried a Model 60 for a lot of years. In the last several years I have put it up and now either carry a Glock 19 or a Beretta Nano.
I think the point you're trying to make is a 5 shot revolver is less than optimum in a gunfight.
That may or may not be true, but as other posters have said the main thing in a gunfight is to have a gun.
GF
I think the point you're trying to make is a 5 shot revolver is less than optimum in a gunfight.
That may or may not be true, but as other posters have said the main thing in a gunfight is to have a gun.
GF
jwk
Member
Personally I'd want a battalion of Uncle Sam's Misguided Children, A10 close air support some tanks and whatever else I could get. In the absence of that because of daily life I carry a J frame. Hope if bad stuff ever comes my way I have the skill and fortitude to stop it. If a J frame isnt enough a Glock 19 w extra mags might not be enough either. Thoughts and prayers for the victims and their families.
A 5 shot J-frame in my pocket trumps the 29-2 in the presentation box in my safe nearly every time. Depending on circumstances I may have a Shield or a 1911. But that old J-frame is better than reaching in your pocket and pulling out lint.
Mindset, judgment and tactics are always more important than marksmanship and firearm. That said, while I rarely carry my Model 37, my tactic would be to close the distance to within 15 yards and attempt to deliver an accurate kill shot. With an active shooter, no verbal warning is necessary. You need to execute or profoundly disable him, not engage him in a gun battle.
And yes, you first need to ascertain whether or not the shooter is wearing armor or at least appears over-dressed for the season. You can't afford to shoot into a vest.
Most people would not have the presence of mind, unless they have been trained, to use a reloading interval as an opportunity to attack the gunman. If he has an autoloading pistol and has some training, well, he can reload in a heartbeat.
And yes, you first need to ascertain whether or not the shooter is wearing armor or at least appears over-dressed for the season. You can't afford to shoot into a vest.
Most people would not have the presence of mind, unless they have been trained, to use a reloading interval as an opportunity to attack the gunman. If he has an autoloading pistol and has some training, well, he can reload in a heartbeat.
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^^^^^
This...all day everyday.
Of course no one would choose to go up against a pump shotgun with a Chiefs Special, but put in a situation where that choice is made on your behalf by some murderous miscreant, I'd damn sure make the most of it.
Inusuit
Member
I put my job at risk by carrying a Kahr .380 to work every day before I retired.
Bohica nailed it. I would rather die fighting than under my desk pleading for my life.
Sure, I would have preferred my 1911, but my situation demanded deep concealment or unemployment. And thank the Lord, I never needed the .380.
Bohica nailed it. I would rather die fighting than under my desk pleading for my life.
Sure, I would have preferred my 1911, but my situation demanded deep concealment or unemployment. And thank the Lord, I never needed the .380.
okiegtrider
Member
washerman
Member
So if the bad guy has a bigger gun than you then you are going to just hide under a desk and wait till you get shot? Even though you have a lethal revolver in your pocket? Sure can't follow that logic. Think I'd be inclined to cock the hammer on my 638 and aim between is eyes on the first shot at least.
Somebody help me out here. Did someone in the newsroom actually have a snubby? Or is this just more revolver hate. News flash. You're at a huge disadvantage when it's long gun vs short gun. I don't care if the short one's a Glock 17 with a 50rd drum.
kevh481
Member
A Chief's Special in the hand or on your person is much more valuable than any other gun that you left at home, in your car, or locked in a drawer.
I subscribe to the Ed Lovette thinking of a J-frame is something you'll like take everywhere with you and thus be armed. It needs to be learned and mastered though. I think a well trained and practiced man with a Chief's Special and a will to survive is more than a match for a ******* with a shotgun.
I subscribe to the Ed Lovette thinking of a J-frame is something you'll like take everywhere with you and thus be armed. It needs to be learned and mastered though. I think a well trained and practiced man with a Chief's Special and a will to survive is more than a match for a ******* with a shotgun.
What would you recommend?
sigp220.45
US Veteran
This "stone cold killer" was hiding under a desk when the cops showed up. I think my 5 shot snub would have worked just fine.
just plain joe
Member
When the music starts, you dance with whom you brung.
Hopefully, you have practiced with the firearm that you have in your possession and can prevail in this deadly force encounter. If not, better to go down fighting and stop/limit further carnage on the part of the perp.
During summer months I carry a 340PD with at least one speed-loader. It's a compromise between concealment/lethality. I practice regularly with this platform and feel confident in my abilities.
I prefer to carry a Springfield Pro or a S & W Model 13 3" when clothing/climatic/mission requirements permit.
JPJ
Hopefully, you have practiced with the firearm that you have in your possession and can prevail in this deadly force encounter. If not, better to go down fighting and stop/limit further carnage on the part of the perp.
During summer months I carry a 340PD with at least one speed-loader. It's a compromise between concealment/lethality. I practice regularly with this platform and feel confident in my abilities.
I prefer to carry a Springfield Pro or a S & W Model 13 3" when clothing/climatic/mission requirements permit.
JPJ
31FordA
Member
If I'm being given a choice in facing a guy with a shotgun then I'll pick calling SWAT, and while they deal with the goof I'll go to lunch.
I would be fine engaging the shotgun armed bad guy with a snub nose revolver, but I'm biased. I still carry snub nosed revolvers on the job, and have confidence in my ability to prevail in a gunfight with them. My opinion is you should carry whatever firearm you have confidence with. The main thing, as mentioned by others, is to have a gun. Even a NAA mini revolver or a .25 automatic is better than a sharp stick.
I would be fine engaging the shotgun armed bad guy with a snub nose revolver, but I'm biased. I still carry snub nosed revolvers on the job, and have confidence in my ability to prevail in a gunfight with them. My opinion is you should carry whatever firearm you have confidence with. The main thing, as mentioned by others, is to have a gun. Even a NAA mini revolver or a .25 automatic is better than a sharp stick.
American1776
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This occurred in Maryland. Nobody gets a carry permit there. So for them, what kind of pistol to use would be a non-starter issue.
The next best thing would be to slit the shooter's throat if or when the opportunity presents itself.
The next best thing would be to slit the shooter's throat if or when the opportunity presents itself.
jimbo728
Member
If we are going to speculate, 2 or 3 people with J frames would have been what I would have liked to see. Too bad the odds of that happening are slim and none.
I cant understand why more people have no desire to protect themselves.
Jim
I cant understand why more people have no desire to protect themselves.
Jim
Of course I would, it's a silly question. I would rather have a rifle or shotgun. But if that's what I have to defend myself with then that's what I'll use and use it to the best of my ability.
The alternative is "I only have a snubby so I'll just lay here and wait to die." That is not an option I would chose.
Fatboy01
Member
I'll take whatever I've got over NOTHING but a prayer! 22 LR, 25 ACP, .380, 9mm or my carry Shield 2.0 .357 Sig. Also, I don't give a damn what the *** has - I'll prevail (mindset). These ***'s are base cowards - when confronted they will soil themselves or hide under a desk. Just bring something!
Most shotguns are 5 shot. Unless you practice, it can take some time to reload the mag fully. A 5 shot revolver would IMO be sufficient to take the shooter out while reloading.
I agree with a statement made above that the building was probably a gun free zone. If two people in that office had a ccw and were carrying,it could have been game over for the shooter.
I carried a revolver for years on duty and did not feel outgunned or concerned that I could not handle any situation if needed.
Also, I understand that the newspaper had received threats before.
In my mind it's the "It will never happen here syndrome ".
My prayers and sympathy go out to all involved!
I agree with a statement made above that the building was probably a gun free zone. If two people in that office had a ccw and were carrying,it could have been game over for the shooter.
I carried a revolver for years on duty and did not feel outgunned or concerned that I could not handle any situation if needed.
Also, I understand that the newspaper had received threats before.
In my mind it's the "It will never happen here syndrome ".
My prayers and sympathy go out to all involved!
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OP
fredj338
Member
Did i say that??? *** is wrong with people? I asked a question, valid question. You want to roll around in the school yard, try someone else.
My point, most of ccw carry something comfy, for the mugger. This required a bit more. Reality, not much harder carrying a g26 vs j-frame, more rds, easier to shoot, better chance of surviving. Events should make us think about how we do things, not shrug your shoulders & talk tough. There are better tools, denying that is more than miopic.
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