686 to 696 conversion?

[Bushog]

Found a 686 mtn gun barrel to rebore to .44sp and a 5 shot 696 cylinder.

I'm hoping it's possible to find a 686 in either 6 or 7 shot configuration to build a 696 mountain gun like BCA had on their website quite some time ago.

Is the 6/7shot to 5 shot conversion doable?

What parts would be required?

I understand I'm not doing this myself...suggested Smith as Bowen no longer does the S&W work?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Hondo44]

I did this conversion.

The problem is that no one would bore the 357 barrel to 44 which surprised me because the barrel threads and diameter are the same on both barrels.
Have you found someone to bore your barrel yet?

The company I tried closed down. The new go to guy is:

BARREL RE-BORING
Alan Siegrist
8752 Turtle Road
Whittemore Michigan 48770
989-873-3929

Maybe he'll bore it for you.

Another alternative barrel now, is the Model 69 .44 Mag barrel. It's an L frame and offered with a 2 1/2" and a 4" barrel. And the price of the 69 barrel is likely not much more, if any, than cost to rebore and the long wait.

I went from 6 shot to 5 shot 44. The 696 cyl was a drop in. Didn't even have to change the hand, timing was right on which is common. Changing the hand only becomes a must, for example, when you go from a 6 shot to a 10 shot or visa versa.

Hope that helps,

 

[steelslaver]

Hondo, I don't think a model 69 barrel would not be an easy fit. It does have a different thread size than a 696 or 686. That is how they got the heavier section in forcing cone area. The 69 also has a 2 piece barrel so frame needs a notch to index the shroud. Plus the 69 uses a yoke area front lock vs the 696 and 686 using a under barrel lug. Trying to fit a 69 barrel would be a can of worms.

 

[THEmodelof1989]

I went from 6 shot to 5 shot 44. The 696 cyl was a drop in. Didn't even have to change the hand, timing was right on which is common. Changing the hand only becomes a must, for example, when you go from a 6 shot to a 10 shot or visa versa.

Hope that helps,

Is this correct? Does this mean I can drop a 686+ cylinder into a 686 and just like that I increased my capacity by one? No smithing outside of changing the cylinder out is needed?

I have very little smithing knowledge and always thought adding or subtracting a round throws off the timing without changing the corresponding innards as well.

 

[Bushog]

There are lots of threads on that conversion if you do a search....

Is this correct? Does this mean I can drop a 686+ cylinder into a 686 and just like that I increased my capacity by one? No smithing outside of changing the cylinder out is needed?

I have very little smithing knowledge and always thought adding or subtracting a round throws off the timing without changing the corresponding innards as well.

 

[Bushog]

I did this conversion.

The problem is that no one would bore the 357 barrel to 44 which surprised me because the barrel threads and diameter are the same on both barrels.
Have you found someone to bore your barrel yet?

The company I tried closed down. The new go to guy is:

BARREL RE-BORING
Alan Siegrist
8752 Turtle Road
Whittemore Michigan 48770
989-873-3929

Maybe he'll bore it for you.

Another alternative barrel now, is the Model 69 .44 Mag barrel. It's an L frame and offered with a 2 1/2" and a 4" barrel. And the price of the 69 barrel is likely not much more, if any, than cost to rebore and the long wait.

I went from 6 shot to 5 shot 44. The 696 cyl was a drop in. Didn't even have to change the hand, timing was right on which is common. Changing the hand only becomes a must, for example, when you go from a 6 shot to a 10 shot or visa versa.

Hope that helps,

Thanks,

I know Al and have that whole deal under control.

MANY S&W rebores on my custom SAs. Yeah, too bad about the passing of Jim and the demise of Clearwater...good folks...

That 69 barrel is a 2 piece deal I'm pretty sure and that is what I'm most certainly trying to get away from. I'm not even sure it would fit. I already have the mountain gun barrels and Al can certainly do the rebores. There will be a .41sp built too.

The question really was how much of an endeavor the fitting of the 5 shot cylinder would be and it sounds like I'm in fat city....

 

[THEmodelof1989]

There are lots of threads on that conversion if you do a search....

Riiiight... So I've been through several of those threads and only saw people arguing about whether new lock work was needed or not. There was no definite answer that I could see one way or the other.

That being said, I figured this was a great opportunity to ask an expert commentator his opinion. I still hope he answers.

 

[Loyaljeeper]

Why not just buy a new 2.75" model 69? It's probabbly one of the best current production S&Ws available.

 

[Protocall_Design]

Is this correct? Does this mean I can drop a 686+ cylinder into a 686 and just like that I increased my capacity by one? No smithing outside of changing the cylinder out is needed?

I have very little smithing knowledge and always thought adding or subtracting a round throws off the timing without changing the corresponding innards as well.

I've done some of these conversions. Sometimes the cylinder will drop in and work fine. Sometimes the same hand will work for both cylinders. Sometimes not. I've seen about a 50/50 chance of working or not.

This all has to do with minor variations in the parts involved due to machining tolerances. Sometimes the parts were made years apart and tooling or even manufacturing methods have changed. We are talking about only a few thousandths of an inch here and there. A sheet of copier paper is four thousandths (.004) thick. It is much to S&W's credit that a lot of parts work together with no hand fitting, having been made decades apart. There's no way to tell in advance if parts will drop in. You have to get the parts and see how they fit.

 

[Hondo44]

Hondo, I don't think a model 69 barrel would not be an easy fit. It does have a different thread size than a 696 or 686. That is how they got the heavier section in forcing cone area. The 69 also has a 2 piece barrel so frame needs a notch to index the shroud. Plus the 69 uses a yoke area front lock vs the 696 and 686 using a under barrel lug. Trying to fit a 69 barrel would be a can of worms.

steelslaver,

Thx for your informed information. It was a naive suggestion on my part w/o knowing the facts of the 69 barrel.

 

[Hondo44]

Is this correct? Does this mean I can drop a 686+ cylinder into a 686 and just like that I increased my capacity by one? No smithing outside of changing the cylinder out is needed?

I have very little smithing knowledge and always thought adding or subtracting a round throws off the timing without changing the corresponding innards as well.

1st, are the cyls the same diameter? If so, I have no reason to believe it wouldn't work. Worse case scenario, you stone the top of the hand to shorten it slightly,or order the 7 shot hand made for the 7 shot cyl if in fact it's even a different part #.

In my experience adding one chamber can use the same hand, i.e., the same hand will work or is close enough to work with slight fitting simple enough for anyone to do.

 

[Hondo44]

1st, are the cyls the same diameter?

I only ask this question because I learned on this forum that the Mod 627 8 shot N frame has a larger diameter cyl with an increased axis to chamber ctr radius to fit 8 chambers.

The barrel location was also raised in the frame to accommodate the larger cyl.

 

[k22fan]

I only ask this question because I learned on this forum that the Mod 627 8 shot N frame has a larger diameter cyl with an increased axis to chamber ctr radius to fit 8 chambers.

The barrel location was also raised in the frame to accommodate the larger cyl.

You are correct in that to fit two extra chambers into the 627 the threaded hole for the barrel is higher in the frame and the chambers are further out from the cylinder axis but it is my understanding that the cylinder diameter was not increased. The outside walls of the chambers are thinner. I do not own an 8 shooter to put my 2" micrometer on but I'd bet a nickle my memory is good.

Multiple members have posted that they use both 6 and 7 shot cylinders in the same Model 686. Cylinder diameter is not an issue.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

The diameter of my 327TRR8 & 627PC, both 8-shot, are the same outside diameter as any of my other N-frame revolvers, ~1.710". Only the length varies by cartridge.

I believe they moved the chambers a tad more outward (closer to the cylinder's edge) to get the clearance they needed between them, not increase the cylinder's diameter, to get the extra rounds to fit. That necessitated the barrel's bore center be moved higher accordingly.

Additionally, all L-frame cylinders are the same outside diameter (~1.560"), even the M69's 44 Magnum cylinder. Only the length of the M69 is slightly longer than a M686's.

Oddly the M686's L-frame 357 Magnum cylinder length is longer than that of a M627/327 N-frame's 357 Magnum cylinder (1.625" -vs- 1.575") making it easier to utilize longer nosed bullets, with a longer COAL", in it.

Heck, even the K-frame M66-8 and J-frame M360J 357 Magnum cylinders are longer, 1.669" and 1.590" respectively. Go figure.

(Yes, I keep all these "need to know" numbers in my spreadsheet. )

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