A little Texas historical story - A. W. Brill Holsters

[arabensburg]

Attached are photos received yesterday of Stan Nelson's Rabensburg-made "Brill" holster. It carries Stan's initials in lieu of the A W Brill maker mark. This holster was made for Mr. Nelson during the early 1950s and is now in possession of a life-long fellow gun owner, associate and friend living in Minnesota.

Stan Nelson was the author of the "Stan Nelson article" published in January 2008 for the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association. The article carried an interview with N J Rabensburg concerning his contact with Captain John R Hughes and the 1906 design for the "Sunday" holster.

The gentleman in possession of Stan Nelson's holster plans to donate this holster and a copy of Volume 22, Issue No. 1 dated January 2008 of the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association to the Texas Rangers Hall of Fame and Museum in Waco, Texas.

This publication features the Stan Nelson article.

Submitted Neale Rabensburg

 

[arabensburg]

Banner Press Newspaper Article for the Zwiener and Rabensburg Saddlery Exhibit

The attached photos are copies of the Fayette County Historical Commission (FCHC) "Footprints" article on the Zwiener and Rabensburg Saddlery Exhibit held at the Fayette Heritage Museum and Archives in La Grange, Texas. The exhibit was on display for about six (6) months beginning 2018 and ending in 2019.

The article was written by Rox Ann Johnson, who is currently an archivist and the former Chairperson for the FCHC.

The attached was a rewrite of the same article and published in the Banner Press newspaper located in Columbus, Colorado County, Texas.

Submitted by Neale Rabensburg

 

[arabensburg]

Missing Page of Banner Press article 1/10/2019 on Zwiener & Rabensburg Saddlery

In case you did not notice, I was missing the last page of the Banner Press newspaper article dated January 10, 2019 in my previous Post No. 202 submitted recently. The article was written by Rox Ann Johnson for "Footprints" under the direction of the Fayette County Historical Commission.

Unfortunately, I deleted the Banner Press article in error before making a complete copy. I searched again online but without success.

I finally found the missing paper last night and made a copy of the missing last page and uploaded it to the attachments of Post No. 202. Please see my previous post and read at your convenience.

Rox Ann Johnson noted that this same article had been printed in five (5) area newspapers, namely, the Fayette County Record of La Grange, the Schulenburg Sticker, the Flatonia Argus, the Weimer Mercury and the Banner Press of Columbus.

Submitted by Neale Rabeensburg

 

[bmcgilvray]

Thank you Neale. I'm continuing to follow this thread with interest.

 

[rednichols]

Attached are photos received yesterday of Stan Nelson's Rabensburg-made "Brill" holster. It carries Stan's initials in lieu of the A W Brill maker mark. This holster was made for Mr. Nelson during the early 1950s and is now in possession of a life-long fellow gun owner, associate and friend living in Minnesota.

Stan Nelson was the author of the "Stan Nelson article" published in January 2008 for the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association. The article carried an interview with N J Rabensburg concerning his contact with Captain John R Hughes and the 1906 design for the "Sunday" holster.

The gentleman in possession of Stan Nelson's holster plans to donate this holster and a copy of Volume 22, Issue No. 1 dated January 2008 of the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association to the Texas Rangers Hall of Fame and Museum in Waco, Texas.

This publication features the Stan Nelson article.

Submitted Neale Rabensburg

Very cool. We, including you, have long had this holster's images; and Stan had another, shorter one, too. Perhaps ask your contact what happened to the other one? Some larger images of the Nelson holsters by N.J., which have been posted many times on this forum.

The longer one that you're showing is likely an SA; it appears on page 15 of Witty's and my 2018 book "Holstory":





The shorter one appears to be for a DA:





Nelson's article states that N.J. made one for Stan and one for his brother Bill but both of these holsters have Stan's initials on their cuffs.

With their provenance these two holsters will be worth a motza some day . The images of Nelson's scabbards were sent to me by the MWCA's board, perhaps even the same person who has sent yours; and the images included them on a belt -- that c/b a Brill belt, too? I have only the backside views.

 

[rednichols]

Neale, according to Ancestry, Stan Nelson's brother Bill appears to still be living; he is 4 years younger than Stan. Have you thought about asking your source at MWCA to hook you up with Bill? Might be the very 'second source' you've been wanting to fill in the blanks about their visit to Austin where they met N.J.

 

[arabensburg]

Stan Nelson's brother Bill

Neale, according to Ancestry, Stan Nelson's brother Bill appears to still be living; he is 4 years younger than Stan. Have you thought about asking your source at MWCA to hook you up with Bill? Might be the very 'second source' you've been wanting to fill in the blanks about their visit to Austin where they met N.J.

I called the gentleman in Minnesota during the afternoon about Bill Nelson and have spent some of today and this evening looking for Bill's obituary. According to the gentleman, Stan Nelson outlived his siblings (including Bill) and wife.

Bill was reportedly a college professor, an artist (illustrator) and musician. The gentleman also said Stan was an artist and musician as well. I will reverify those points.

I do expect a package from the gentleman within a few days and will post that information when received.

The gentleman thought that Bill's college associates split up his personal items including the other holster. The gentleman is aware of the "S N" initials on both; however, he did not want to venture a guess, since this subject was never discussed between Stan and himself.

I did ask these questions:

1. Could there have been three (3) holsters?
2. Was the shorter holster an immediate gift for his brother Bill?
3. Did N J Rabensburg make a mistake with the initials thinking both holsters were for Stan only?

(The gentleman had no comment with the above questions since nothing was discussed on the initials in the past.)

Whoever has the shorter holster may have an answer about the initial.

Stan Nelson's two children (a boy and girl) were not interested in his personal items including his holster.

Submitted by Neale Rabensburg

 

[oldiegoldie]

Mr. Rabensburg; i've had a continuous smile on my face while reading this thread. your style of writing does not exist anymore. thank you for taking the time and effort in keeping all of us informed and entertained. your pictures are as much appreciated as your stories.

i'm nearly 10 years older than you and spent alot of my early years in the proximity of your Grandfather's home. we bought our saddles from a shop in Columbus, but cannot remember the name. the smell of a saddle shop still takes me back to those unique times.

thank you again.

 

[arabensburg]

Thank you!

Mr. Rabensburg; i've had a continuous smile on my face while reading this thread. your style of writing does not exist anymore. thank you for taking the time and effort in keeping all of us informed and entertained. your pictures are as much appreciated as your stories.

i'm nearly 10 years older than you and spent alot of my early years in the proximity of your Grandfather's home. we bought our saddles from a shop in Columbus, but cannot remember the name. the smell of a saddle shop still takes me back to those unique times.

thank you again.

Oh, my God! Thank you.

Neale Rabensburg

 

[arabensburg]

Stan Nelson, who interviewed N J Rabensburg, was a US Marine during WWII

Stan Nelson held an interview with N J Rabensburg in Austin, Texas during the early 1950s. An attached photo taken about eight to ten years earlier shows Mr. Nelson as an active US Marine on board a landing craft in Tokyo Bay, Japan on or after August 30, 1945.

Nelson is a member of the 1st Machine Gun Squad, 2nd Battalion, 4th Marine Raiders.

Nelson published a ten (10) page essay in the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association on the issue of weapons during World War II. He was ninety-two (92) years old at the time of release of this essay in January 2017. The title was WWII "Guns of the Pacific"-My Experience.

"I was 19 years old when I joined the Marine Corps in early 1943, and with a mob of other Midwest teenagers, got a free train ride to San Diego, California......."

A copy of the essay will follow soon.

Submitted by Neale Rabensburg

 

[arabensburg]

Stan Nelson was a Regular to Texas and Contributor to the Haley Center in Midland

According to the January 2008 article by Stan Nelson, N J Rabensburg, as a very young holster maker, met in about 1906 with Captain John R. Hughes and presented his design for the "Sunday" holster, which was adopted by Hughes and his fellow Texas Rangers.

During Nelson's visit to Texas and Austin, Rabensburg made holsters for both Nelson and his brother Bill. One of these holsters accommodated a single action "Sheriff's Model" revolver.

Nelson and his brother traveled to the southwestern part of the United States including Texas on a number of occasions in search of the history of the "Old West".

Midland, Texas, the oil and gas capital of West Texas and the Permian Basin, was an important stop along the way, particularly, the Nita Stewart Haley Memorial Library and J. Evetts Haley History Center. This Library houses more than 25,000 books, manuscripts and other printed material documenting US western history.

Stan Nelson was a primary contributor over the years (1997 to 2008) to this institution donating numerous archival documents including the "Stan Nelson essay" titled "Some Thoughts on Gun Leather", which was issued January 2008 in the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association, Volume 22, Issue No.1.

Please note, that the above essay on gun leather contains Stan Nelson's interview with Newton Joseph Rabensburg in Austin during the early 1950s.

If you are new to this thread, please note that N J Rabensburg was the maker of the A W Brill holster from 1932 forward and, according to the Stan Nelson interview, Rabensburg was also the creator of the "Sunday" holster worn by the Texas Rangers during the years following 1906.

Besides archival documents, artifacts are also welcomed and displayed within the Haley Center. Included among these items is a 1878 model, double action Colt "Sheriff's Model" revolver and holster, which were contributed by Stan Nelson and his wife Barbara.

This particular 1878 revolver was one of 274 and featured a 4 inch barrel with a blued finish. The accompanying holster was a custom hip pocket design, and the two had been a duo.

Both were worn by the renown Texas Ranger and southwestern lawman, Jeff Milton. The revolver and holster had been a gift in 1957 to Stan Nelson by Milton's widow, Mildred nee Taitt. Nelson had visited with Mrs. Milton at her home in Tucson, Arizona.

Submitted by Neale Rabensburg

 

[rednichols]

It's a fun thread, Neale, and you can be forgiven for thinking of it as 'your' thread even though another member started it.

But I don't think your first paragraph is correct in light of all that has been learned since Nelson's article was first published. We can't even prove that N.J. was there for the creation of the Sunday scabbard that became known as the Kluge scabbard; Nelson doesn't actually say more than that the saddlery was the same one that N.J. worked at and surely that was Kluge Bros in Austin near Capt. Hughes, and Master Saddler Charles Kluge headed up that project.

I don't say this lightly; Chapter One of my book with turnerriver "Holstory" claims it was N.J. and so it took the Second Edition to correct this error in its all-new Chapter Ten:

 

[arabensburg]

Character Reference on Stan Nelson Author and Antique Gun Collector

As promised, the material presented in my two previous posts (See Post Nos. 210 and 211) was received by mail this past week from Mr. Dale H. Peterson of Minneapolis, Minnesota. Peterson is an antique gun collector. He wrote also a personal letter dated June 18, 2022 referencing Stan Nelson, which in part reads as follows:

"I'll try to answer some of your questions and give you a little background on Stan Nelson. I had known Stan for many years as I first met him in the mid-1960s when he operated a bookstore on 4th Street South in Minneapolis. In the 1970s, he moved to Harris, Minnesota, about 40+ miles north of me, and I would try to visit him at least 2 or 3 times a month. Stan often talked about his and brother Bill's trips to the southwest as they were both interested in old west history. They also visited with Mildred Taitt Milton, Jeff Milton's wife, who gave a Colt Sheriff's Model to Stan; see the MWCA (Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association) issue that has Jeff's picture on the cover. Enclosed is a copy of the Haley Library Newsletter with a picture of Stan and his wife Barbara when he donated that Colt to the Library. They also visited with Ed McGriven, author of "Fast & Fancy Shooting", from Montana in the 1950s….

….The article that Stan wrote on the Rabensburg Holster was never published before, to the best of my knowledge, as I was involved with the cleaning up of some of the pictures used in the article. One of Stan's early articles he wrote on Merwin Hulbert Pocket Army revolvers was published in the Gun Report issue of February 1960, we published it in (one) of our publications.

I don't believe any of the family had any of Stan's notes on the articles and or visits out west. Most of the relatives were passed with the exception of a few nephews. Most of them were not in close contact with him until the last few years of his life.

Stan was actively writing right up to (the) 2019. His last article was published in our January 2020 issue. He thoroughly researched everything he wrote and had a great mind for recalling his pass (past) experiences while growing up and his service in the Marines. His last year he had started an article but his eyesight was so bad he tried to write on ¼" lined paper with a magic marker. It didn't work so he quit. I visited with him about week or so prior to his passing….."

"Regards,

Dale H Peterson"

 

[arabensburg]

How does a Minnesota guy, Stan Nelson, impact "Brill-type" holster making within central Texas?

Answer: On a visit to Texas during the early 1950s, Nelson had a one-on-one, personal interview with Newton Joseph Rabensburg at his Austin home workshop. Rabensburg's early holster making career was discussed.

Was this interview published?

Answer: Yes, in the Minnesota Weapons Collectors Association in January 2008.

What does this document say?

Answer: "One day he (Captain John R. Hughes of the Texas Rangers) stopped at the saddle shop where Mr. Rabensburg was employed and asked to have a particular style of holster made. Hughes wanted a holster that his men could wear on a trouser belt, under a coat at times and yet allow for a quick draw when necessary. Combining the requirements and practical ideas of an experienced gun handler with the skill of a fine leather craftsman resulted in the "Sunday" holster seen in the photographs accompanying this article. These are sturdy, practical, and beautifully made; form following function exemplified. To the discerning eye, comparison of these holsters with the much later Threepersons/Myers and Keith/Lawrence styles show almost identical profile and forward pitch."

Is there a problem today with this article?

Answer: Yes, there is a new interpretation of the "Sunday" holster, which now gives credit not to N J Rabensburg as the holster maker but rather to Charles W Kluge.

Is there an attempt to discredit Stan Nelson on this DWalt thread.

Answer: Yes, Stan Nelson's recall ability has been placed into question.

Was Stan Nelson recall abilities impaired?

Answer: No, not according to Mr. Dale H Peterson of Minneapolis, Minnesota, who in a character reference letter dated June 18, 2022 said the following:

"Stan was actively writing right up to 2019. His last article was published in our January 2020 issue. He thoroughly researched everything he wrote and had a great mind for recalling his past experiences while growing up and his service in the Marines."

What is my position?

Answer: To protect my grandfather, N J Rabensburg, from disinformation, which could negatively affect his character and/or his active years as a holster maker.

Has N J Rabensburg been negatively affected?

Answer: Yes, according to the new interpretation and on this DWalt thread, N J Rabensburg's active making holster career prior to 1932 has not only been placed into question but totally refuted.

The Playbill so far by others has been as follows:

1. Wait for Stan Nelson to die
2. Discredit Nelson's recall ability
3. Cast aspersions at Rabensburg's living grandson
4. Label N J Rabensburg as a liar

The lack of proper recall by Stan Nelson at the time of the publication of the "Stan Nelson article" has now been refuted by a letter of character reference by Dale H. Peterson. The limelight thus shifts to N J Rabensburg as the interviewee.

Since Stan Nelson's recall was clear and his character is above reproach, then Rabensburg's message to Nelson had to be a fabrication and thus a lie.

My mother used to say to me when I was kid and being ornery:

"Don't be silly".​

Some of the behavior on this thread has become childish.

Submitted by Neale Rabensburg

 

[StrawHat]

This started as an enjoyable thread. I learned a bit about the history of the Sunday Scabbard.

To me, it seems unlikely that an apprentice or even a journeyman would be asked to consult with a potential client. Maybe he was, does it matter? What is clear to me is there was an idea of what was wanted and those ideals were interpreted by at least a dozen craftsmen to produce scabbards to meet the pattern. We're they identical? No. We're there improvements made? Perhaps, it depends on how you define improvements.

It now seems this thread has run it's course with both sides presenting research and presuming their research is correct. I wish someone would find the Rangers ledger and read the part that explains to whom he spoke about the scabbard. Unfortunately, it is doubtful such a ledger exists.

But, this thread was enjoyable to read but appears to have run it's course.

Kevin

 

[arabensburg]

I agree.

I agree 100%.

Submitted by Neale Rabensburg

 

[boykinlp]

[ame]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MjoMQJf5vKI[/ame]


Larry

 

[turnerriver]

Thread is closed. No aspersions have been cast, no noses need be out of joint, it's all been a discussion on Holstory.
I met a man at the Tulsa gun show years ago, he was a member of the MGCA and had written about holsters. Was it Stan Nelson ? Yeah, maybe.
Maybe not.
I co-wrote a book on the subject, have a ridiculously large collection of gun leather and related ephemera and moderate a forum about it and I've made several mistakes today, forgotten what happened last week and sometimes misspell Heiser (but never Myres…). We're all fallible, most importantly we are all interested in collecting, seeing and discussing gun leather.
Carry on, but not in this thread on this subject.
Regards,
Witty