Belt Help

Joined
Sep 3, 2023
Messages
499
Reaction score
1,460
Location
Missouri
I owned a Beltman bullhide gun belt for years. Great belt, but it mysteriously shrank over that time to where it no longer fits. Funny how that happens.

Anyway, I’ve been using a Kore tactical click belt and while impressive, it doesn’t/can’t seem to break in and is not that comfortable. Nothing like a leather belt that’s taken a “set” and conformed to the body.

I’m in the market for a hell-for-stout leather gun belt and am looking for suggestions on the toughest and best made. I carry some heavy handguns OWB so need a very sturdy belt.

Thanks for the help!
 
Register to hide this ad
I've said all my lengthy career: if someone needs a stout trousers belt for their holstered pistol, then instead he/she needs to buy a better holster. A well-designed holster does not rely on the belt to keep the pistol upright. E.g., most likely the holster is carrying the pistol too high above the belt. Many name brands do it no better than the others because they're still making the designs of the '70s when we all over-relied on the wide hippie belts of the time.

How about a look at the holster/pistol you're wanting to support better?
 
I bought 3 Versacarry belts this summer. 2-ply, well made, and the price is right, especially if you hit a sale. The last few weeks I've been carrying a PC 629 2-5/8 in a Kramer belt scabbard and you wouldn't even know its there.

I'm familiar with the shrinking belt phenomenon also, I had to replace my competition belt last year!
 
Last edited:
Beltman is still in business with new ownership and location. From what I've heard no difference in the quality of their belts.

Just ordered one. Never had one before but this one is a very high quality product. Ordered on the 22nd and received on the 25th. A pleasant transaction.
 
I've said all my lengthy career: if someone needs a stout trousers belt for their holstered pistol, then instead he/she needs to buy a better holster. A well-designed holster does not rely on the belt to keep the pistol upright. E.g., most likely the holster is carrying the pistol too high above the belt. Many name brands do it no better than the others because they're still making the designs of the '70s when we all over-relied on the wide hippie belts of the time.

How about a look at the holster/pistol you're wanting to support better?

Red, don't you think that some holsters are deliberately designed to carry the gun high above the belt, the intention being concealment? E.g., the Galco Combat Master or various other modern makers' pancakes. For such holsters, which are popular nowadays due to the prevalence of legal concealed carry, it seems to me a heavy, thick belt, fairly rigid, is helpful in comfortably stabilizing the gun, and keeping it tucked in close under the ribs.

Re leather belt recommendations: I have Mitch Rosen, Kramer and Beltman 1.5" belts. They are all good, with perhaps the edge going to Kramer, but the Beltman is lower priced and far, far faster delivery than the other two.
 
Last edited:
Check out the Mitch Rosen 'value line' models.

1.5" thick and sturdy for around $80. They ship pretty quick because they are pre-made.

Nothing fancy, like his non-value line items but a great sturdy belt.
 
Red, don't you think that some holsters are deliberately designed to carry the gun high above the belt, the intention being concealment? E.g., the Galco Combat Master or various other modern makers' pancakes. For such holsters, which are popular nowadays due to the prevalence of legal concealed carry, it seems to me a heavy, thick belt, fairly rigid, is helpful in comfortably stabilizing the gun, and keeping it tucked in close under the ribs.

Re leather belt recommendations: I have Mitch Rosen, Kramer and Beltman 1.5" belts. They are all good, with perhaps the edge going to Kramer, but the Beltman is lower priced and far, far faster delivery than the other two.
Darn it, I've been found out! I did NOT know about that functionality. Back to 70s holster school for me ;-)
 
I use the Aker Concealed Carry belt. Polymer lined, doesn't allow the holster to flop around. But, very comfortable. Around $81.

KAC
 
My first choice is Rick Garcia and he will do horse or cow hide. Second choice is Tucker but they have Looong delivery dates as of lately.
 
I've said all my lengthy career: if someone needs a stout trousers belt for their holstered pistol, then instead he/she needs to buy a better holster. A well-designed holster does not rely on the belt to keep the pistol upright. E.g., most likely the holster is carrying the pistol too high above the belt. Many name brands do it no better than the others because they're still making the designs of the '70s when we all over-relied on the wide hippie belts of the time.

How about a look at the holster/pistol you're wanting to support better?

You're the expert holster designer, and I'm not, I'm just a peon, but I can't agree with this. For over 40 years I've bought nothing but the best holsters from Sparks, Kramer, Rosen, and Null. They offer gun belts from 1 1/4" up to 1 3/4" and some places 2". Even the best newer holsters with a low carry axis don't carry very well with common clothing store belts.
So their belts are a waste of money and they are just trying to make an extra sale from the buyer? Tell me, please.
Every major holster maker says you need a dedicated gun belt. Ken Null was the first holster maker to reveal this to me as a neophyte when he was still in PA. decades ago. At first, I didn't take his advice, but over time I learned he was right. A K Mart belt affixed to the best holster still carries lousy, shifts around and becomes uncomfortable over the course of a day of carrying (unless the user is just strapping it on for a few minutes to get coffee and a doughnut at the 7/11 and removing his rig when he gets home). I never did buy the Null belt at $90 (at that time). I thought it was too expensive. Now I buy Kramer gun belts that cost $155 and although I wish they cost less, they are far better than a single layer belt I can get at Macy's or wherever.

I use the excellent Tony Kenealy designed Sparks made VM2 IWB holsters for large semi autos and revolvers, the Kramer IWB nos. 2 and 3 for small revolvers and small semi autos, Kramer belt scabbards for OTB holsters and the old Bruce Nelson designed Summer Specials (only occasionally now). Except for
the summer special, these are not ancient designs, and none of these are high axis designs like the Galco Silhouette or the Buchheimer semi shoulder holster. I don't think high axis holsters are very popular any more, at any rate.

Any era holster benefits from a good gun belt
 
Last edited:
The O.P. states he carries heavy handguns. He needs a good gun belt even if he has the best modern designed holster, regardless of the belt width.
You can get away with a crappy single layer belt if you are carrying a lightweight small gun, not a gun weighing approx. 32 oz. or more and of large size.

I prefer the Kramer horse hide 1 1/2" belts over other brands. I have several but even the first one I bought in the early 90s is still solid.

For me, the Sparks belt in cow hide is a disappointment. I also have 2 of them. The oldest one, about the age of my first
Kramer, is as floppy as a wet noodle. Sparks will tell you the arc they cut
their belt to, mimics a comfortable broken in regular belt. This also means it's kind of already pre-worn. They also just don't measure well compared to a straight cut belt you can break in yourself over time.
I have found that whatever my waist size is, the Sparks belt will require about a 2" longer belt than what I normally need, even knowing how to correctly measure the belt, whether using for IWB or OWB. Their shaped belt is just a gimmick to me. The Sparks holsters themselves are very good.

I carry every day for hours at a time, for what it's worth.
 
Last edited:
Hands down the absolute best gun belt that I've discovered is the Gingerich western line. Best looking too. Available at most any western wear store.

Under $50 and American made, 3/16" thick solid leather. They outshine every other belt I've ever worn. Very high quality, comfortable leather.

I carry some heavy iron too. Everyday, everywhere.

attachment.php
 

Attachments

  • IMG_3309.jpg
    IMG_3309.jpg
    83.6 KB · Views: 427
You're the expert holster designer, and I'm not, I'm just a peon, but I can't agree with this. For over 40 years I've bought nothing but the best holsters from Sparks, Kramer, Rosen, and Null. They offer gun belts from 1 1/4" up to 1 3/4" and some places 2". Even the best newer holsters with a low carry axis don't carry very well with common clothing store belts.
So their belts are a waste of money and they are just trying to make an extra sale from the buyer? Tell me, please.
Every major holster maker says you need a dedicated gun belt. Ken Null was the first holster maker to reveal this to me as a neophyte when he was still in PA. decades ago. At first, I didn't take his advice, but over time I learned he was right. A K Mart belt affixed to the best holster still carries lousy, shifts around and becomes uncomfortable over the course of a day of carrying (unless the user is just strapping it on for a few minutes to get coffee and a doughnut at the 7/11 and removing his rig when he gets home). I never did buy the Null belt at $90 (at that time). I thought it was too expensive. Now I buy Kramer gun belts that cost $155 and although I wish they cost less, they are far better than a single layer belt I can get at Macy's or wherever.

I use the excellent Tony Kenealy designed Sparks made VM2 IWB holsters for large semi autos and revolvers, the Kramer IWB nos. 2 and 3 for small revolvers and small semi autos, Kramer belt scabbards for OTB holsters and the old Bruce Nelson designed Summer Specials (only occasionally now). Except for
the summer special, these are not ancient designs, and none of these are high axis designs like the Galco Silhouette or the Buchheimer semi shoulder holster. I don't think high axis holsters are very popular any more, at any rate.

Any era holster benefits from a good gun belt

Look, I'm actually trying to teach something here. There's the old joke about the kid encountered banging a post on the ground. "Why are you banging the post on the ground?", he's asked. "To keep lions away".

"But there are no lions here!".

"See, It works!".

Stiff wide gunbelts are promoted by people who don't know any better, because the belts appeared in the '70s and they haven't learned a darned thing since the '70s. They even make the same holsters. So Tony at Sparks and I nearly came to blows over this one, because he only learned what Milt knew; and Milt only knew what he'd copied from Andy; and Andy only knew what he'd learned in the Fifties!!. But I've been part of the making of tens of millions of holsters and never stopped learning.

Great example: the Askins Avenger of the '70s. JB and I created this one and JB insisted on making it very high riding. But to keep it from tipping outward, a heavy belt had to be used. So the myth of 'get a good gunbelt' appeared. My final version of an Avenger? Not topheavy in the slightest, use any belt you like, guaranteed to fit right out of the box.

Since that time I've created many, many, many new models of holsters for many, many more companies than Bianchi. Because I can't make myself copy. Which then drives innovation. And during that process I learned new things, like how to position the holstered pistol 'just right' vertically so that a wide belt is not needed. I literally used a WalMart belt I bought for the purpose. I call it 'floating the pistol' and the Sparks people, on another forum, were furious. We ended up in court!

All that's needed from a waistbelt is (1) a holster with an ideal center of gravity design, (2) a belt tunnel the same width as the belt's width, and (3) stiffness ACROSS the width of the belt only. Thickness is irrelevant, stitching only prevents stretching. You will find that a curved belt is best on men and women; mine was triple curved, like a snake. Wear one every day.

Yes, I know all these gunleather makers personally, and I'm saying that there's a LOT they don't know about their trade. Their business? Well, that they do know.

I no longer build becasue I declined to be a part of the striker-fired pistol fiasco; none of these makers declined that business yet the likes of Safariland, who once used to be a premier maker, compounded the problem when they created their lightbearing holsters. These people DO know their BUSINESS, but they aren't concerned with yours.
 
I appreciate your kind and reasoned reply.
I'm not sure I agree with ignoring belt design when pairing with a holster, but I wanted your take on it.
Thanks,
Mike
 
Last edited:
Back
Top