Chambered or not?
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Smith-Nut
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Interesting reading. Only one actually mentions that the type of gun you carry might make a difference (and this is a revolver).
Professionally I've carryed a SIG 210 (SA only) for over 20 years. Except in direct war situations (Croatia 1995. Iarq 2003 and 2004) I've always carried the gun with out a round in the chamber. Today I carry a Beretta 92 FS and I always carry it with a round in the chamber.
Also situation is vital. Some people ought to carry a gun with out a round in the chamber. Any way the more inexperienced (rookie) the more you have a tendency to fire before thinking (I've trained hundreds of young unexperienced soldiers). In some situations the split second it takes to put a round in the chamber (with my SIG 210 it happens before I'm actually up and pointing at a target....guess it is a matter of practice) is what gives your brain the signal "DON'T FIRE!" (or "do fire" if needed). I think this in some situations have saved lives.
So I think there is no correct answer. It is all about gun, situation, experience, and "mental" state you are in.
If everyone just lived by the great rule: "Don't touch the tricker until you actually are 100 % sure you want/need to fire", carrying a round in the chamber or not, probably wouldn't be a interesting question.
Professionally I've carryed a SIG 210 (SA only) for over 20 years. Except in direct war situations (Croatia 1995. Iarq 2003 and 2004) I've always carried the gun with out a round in the chamber. Today I carry a Beretta 92 FS and I always carry it with a round in the chamber.
Also situation is vital. Some people ought to carry a gun with out a round in the chamber. Any way the more inexperienced (rookie) the more you have a tendency to fire before thinking (I've trained hundreds of young unexperienced soldiers). In some situations the split second it takes to put a round in the chamber (with my SIG 210 it happens before I'm actually up and pointing at a target....guess it is a matter of practice) is what gives your brain the signal "DON'T FIRE!" (or "do fire" if needed). I think this in some situations have saved lives.
So I think there is no correct answer. It is all about gun, situation, experience, and "mental" state you are in.
If everyone just lived by the great rule: "Don't touch the tricker until you actually are 100 % sure you want/need to fire", carrying a round in the chamber or not, probably wouldn't be a interesting question.
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66snub
Member
I think that the hidden nucleus of this conversation is people (perhaps subconsciously) not feeling feeling comfortable with carrying a gun. There may be a couple of reasons for this. Perhaps a gun that isn't fully trusted? Maybe not enough trigger time/training with that particular firearm?
An interesting and related topic to this, is back when another person at our sheriff's department was running for the position of sheriff. One of the things that he said he would change, is that single-action autos would not be allowed as off-duty weapons (1911's and Browning Hi Powers!). He said that it was because that they typically had light triggers and had a different protocol for use that was too different from our Sig 226's, complicating training. He also said that a trigger like this left little room for error. (All triggers leave little room for error.)
Naturally, all of the gun-people at the department balked at this and told him that it was ridiculous. Some of these people had been shooting single action autos longer that double action (one particular deputy for sure!). He wasn't elected, but this topic is still discussed at the department.
To me, if a gun is to be carried, it must be carried in a manner that makes it immediately available to deploy and utilize. Like someone stated earlier, I also carry a revolver, so an empty chamber is a non-issue to me, but I have and do carry autos often and have never carried with an empty chamber. In an unpredictable and rapidly evolving encounter with a bad guy, there will be a number of details that will command my attention. I do not want to add "racking the slide" to that number of details.
An interesting and related topic to this, is back when another person at our sheriff's department was running for the position of sheriff. One of the things that he said he would change, is that single-action autos would not be allowed as off-duty weapons (1911's and Browning Hi Powers!). He said that it was because that they typically had light triggers and had a different protocol for use that was too different from our Sig 226's, complicating training. He also said that a trigger like this left little room for error. (All triggers leave little room for error.)
Naturally, all of the gun-people at the department balked at this and told him that it was ridiculous. Some of these people had been shooting single action autos longer that double action (one particular deputy for sure!). He wasn't elected, but this topic is still discussed at the department.
To me, if a gun is to be carried, it must be carried in a manner that makes it immediately available to deploy and utilize. Like someone stated earlier, I also carry a revolver, so an empty chamber is a non-issue to me, but I have and do carry autos often and have never carried with an empty chamber. In an unpredictable and rapidly evolving encounter with a bad guy, there will be a number of details that will command my attention. I do not want to add "racking the slide" to that number of details.
photoman
Member
I have been in situations where I have had to carry a Glock without a holster. I will NOT carry chambered in those situations. Everyone has to work out there own plan of self defense and it is often not as simple as we want it to be.
Thanks for sharing the insight. It sounds like it really boils down to the following: type of gun, personal comfort, situation and training. Not trying to simplify because each of these will be different for everyone. I'm fairly new to concealed carry and want to be as safe and aware as possible.
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Smith-Nut
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If you already told us I'm sorry for asking but what do you carry?
CW, being new to CC, I know this is a serious issue to you. That said, it's a very well worn path. Pretty much every new guy asks. As you get more comfortable carrying, so will the notion of being cocked and locked. Which brings us to the question. Yes, you should, just as soon as you're comfortable doing so.
Faulkner
Member
If you are uncomfortable carrying with a round in the chamber you are probably not doing it right. I probably wouldn't carry a round chambered in a Glock with Mexican carry, but then again, I don't carry that way either.
66Park
Member
There are always exceptions. Photoman pointed out one. If you can't carry in a holster for some reason, and there is more possibility that the gun would go off by accident with its five pound trigger than that you would have to use it, your odds are probably in favor of not carrying with a round in the chamber. That is a special case, and I bet Photoman more often than not does carry with one in the chamber.
Violent incidents can happen so quickly that you would be lucky to even get your gun out of your holster before you are killed in a lot of circumstances. Your opponent isn't going to stand still while you take a second or two to rack your slide, if you still even have two usable hands to rack it with. That is standard procedure. But, as Photoman pointed out, and his was a good example, sometimes you don't get to do what you'd like to do and decide that it is better to have a gun with the round not chambered than to not have the gun.
If you are not comfortable carrying with a round chambered under ideal circumstances, meaning normal everyday carry in a good holster, you need to get comfortable with it. Start carrying around the house with a chambered round until you can wrap your head around the concept. All of this supposes you have a normal carry gun that is in common use for self defense. If you are carrying a Single Action Army, for instance, carrying with a round under the hammer is not a good idea at all!
Violent incidents can happen so quickly that you would be lucky to even get your gun out of your holster before you are killed in a lot of circumstances. Your opponent isn't going to stand still while you take a second or two to rack your slide, if you still even have two usable hands to rack it with. That is standard procedure. But, as Photoman pointed out, and his was a good example, sometimes you don't get to do what you'd like to do and decide that it is better to have a gun with the round not chambered than to not have the gun.
If you are not comfortable carrying with a round chambered under ideal circumstances, meaning normal everyday carry in a good holster, you need to get comfortable with it. Start carrying around the house with a chambered round until you can wrap your head around the concept. All of this supposes you have a normal carry gun that is in common use for self defense. If you are carrying a Single Action Army, for instance, carrying with a round under the hammer is not a good idea at all!
Ivan the Butcher
Member
I will say this, I have had the sound of racking the slide save my beacon, at the time I was on a empty chamber and have since always carried with a loaded chamber. But I am willing to use the slide sound,if I think it will keep me from having to shoot some dumb punk. Ivan
Der Biermeister
Member
Interesting comments so far.
I try to simplify things. I always have all my weapons chambered - when carrying or just in the vault. If I went the other way, I am afraid I would lose valuable seconds in a "use of force" situation - probably by the adrenaline causing me to first pull the trigger and then realizing it wasn't chambered and then having to rack it.
At least with it always chambered I don't have to guess and I know to ALWAYS be careful in handling my weapons.
I try to simplify things. I always have all my weapons chambered - when carrying or just in the vault. If I went the other way, I am afraid I would lose valuable seconds in a "use of force" situation - probably by the adrenaline causing me to first pull the trigger and then realizing it wasn't chambered and then having to rack it.
At least with it always chambered I don't have to guess and I know to ALWAYS be careful in handling my weapons.
ChattanoogaPhil
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While you're getting familiar with your carry gun and gear, I believe it's perfectly fine to carry with an empty chamber until you're more comfortable and confident. You managed to stay alive this long without carrying a gun, so my guess is you will survive a period of time carrying a gun without a round in the chamber if that is what you choose.
IMO, the best thing you can do for the safety of yourself and others while carrying is to learn to keep your paws off the gun. Leave it holstered! Don't be the jackwagon who yanks his gun out for show and tell. The less handling of a loaded gun in and out of the holster the better.
I carry autoloaders having no safety with a round chambered. That is how they are designed to safely carry... in a proper holster.
IMO, the best thing you can do for the safety of yourself and others while carrying is to learn to keep your paws off the gun. Leave it holstered! Don't be the jackwagon who yanks his gun out for show and tell. The less handling of a loaded gun in and out of the holster the better.
I carry autoloaders having no safety with a round chambered. That is how they are designed to safely carry... in a proper holster.
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triumphmaster
Member
Chambered
I have a Smith M&P 9mm, No safety, so unless I am going to a bad section of a city I dont have one chambered, but I will chamber one if I feel the need too.
I have a Smith M&P 9mm, No safety, so unless I am going to a bad section of a city I dont have one chambered, but I will chamber one if I feel the need too.
Maze 686
US Veteran
Not carrying chambered is simply dumb.
Next time your in a store, at the bank, or buying fast food look around you. The people that could bring out a weapon are already on top of you. If their weapon is already out why would they wait for you to put a bullet into the chamber.
If they have attacked you with a knife or blunt object like a bat you might need that support hand to block the attack instead of going to your gun to chamber a round. In law enforcement there is a reason shooting from retention (within arms length) is taught and practiced.
You can not determine what someone else is going to do, you can only react to it.
Practice drawing and carrying with an empty chamber and you will gain the confidence you need to do it for real.
Next time your in a store, at the bank, or buying fast food look around you. The people that could bring out a weapon are already on top of you. If their weapon is already out why would they wait for you to put a bullet into the chamber.
If they have attacked you with a knife or blunt object like a bat you might need that support hand to block the attack instead of going to your gun to chamber a round. In law enforcement there is a reason shooting from retention (within arms length) is taught and practiced.
You can not determine what someone else is going to do, you can only react to it.
Practice drawing and carrying with an empty chamber and you will gain the confidence you need to do it for real.
I have read that carrying a single action with one chambered is not the safest thing to do, the mp9 is basically single action. There is no long pull like a hammer type handgun. How do you feel about carrying chambered in the mp9 and other striker fire types with no safety.
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photoman
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venomballistics
Member
then you need a gun you feel safe with.
an empty chamber is a forfeit in a gunfight. this is dictated by reality and must be entered into ones consideration.
Striker fired is a good bit different from a true SA such as a 1911
A true SA's trigger is right there, give or take some creep in some implementations there of. they rely upon the use of the safety.
a striker system does have some take up, although much lighter than most revolvers, and usually shorter as well, but it is there. these rely upon the trigger being guarded while carried.
The thing to bear in mind with empty chamber carry, is that despite your best efforts, you may very well have an injured, disabled, or otherwise occupied limb, by the time you realize you need your gun.
I don't care if your a newcomer or a seasoned Navy SEAL. this can happen to you.
Arlington is full of those it did happen to.
You may still lose the fight, but it should never be because you adopted an over complicated system that fails under pressure.
your attacker will not wait to shoot, shank, bludgeon, incinerate, slash, electrocute, crush, decapitate, disembowel, hang, strangle, pepper spray, or do any number of other not nice things to you, not limited to forced exposure to Beyonce songs.
forrestinmathews
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