Experience checking a firearm In Newark, NJ

Left NJ years ago, best move I ever made.
In '96 the AF started phasing the C-141s out of Charleston as the C-17 were being delivered. The Flight Engineers could follow the planes to either of two locations- McGuire AFB in NJ, or McChord AFB in Washington.

When the first shirt asked me which one I wanted I actually laughed out loud, told him to PLEASE send me to WA, told him I had family there (which was true) and made it very plain I did not want anything to do with Jersey.

Got to WA in '97 and never left.
 
I have seen posts on this forum about people who would wave about the airline firearms policy in an aggressive manner, thus earning them a trip down the rabbit hole. Lesson learned. Go with the flow . . .

I just had to write about my experience just this morning 05/17/2021 checking a firearm in at the United Airlines Terminal at Newark Liberty International Airport.

As many have heard checking a firearm in NJ can gain a person a non scenic ride to a nearby Jail. That was not my experience: HOWEVER CAUTION CAUTION CAUTION: I am a retired Law Enforcement Officer and I was carrying my 45 M&P Shield under the protection of the LEOSA "HR 218" Federal Statue.

Here is what I did and how it went: (By the way I have checked guns in at DFW Ft. Lauderdale, Las Vegas, Miami, West Palm Beach, Philadelphia, Oklahoma City, Omaha, NE, Tuscon and many other airports around the country.)

1. Unloaded my pistol at the hotel, unloaded all magazines and placed all ammo in its original box. Because I was in NJ I did not want to become a test case of their ban on magazines holding more than 8 rounds nor keeping hollow point ammo. (I believe NJ is way out of bounds on this but like I said I did not want to be the test case. Sure I think I could beat the rap but not the ride to jail.

2. Placed my gun and magazines in a solid hand gun case and locked both sides with an approved TSA COMBINATION case. Placed that gun case in a "roll aboard, and locked it too with an approved TSA lock.

3. When I arrived at the airport I told the ticket agent I had a firearm to declare. He directed me to gate 5 Terminal C where I met another ticket agent.

4. Told her I had a firearm to declare and she requested my ID. I gave her my DL so she could look up my flight info. My wife waited with me . As she was bringing up my flight information and had found it, I showed her my retired Police Department Issued ID along with the approved and issued badge my agency provided me. MY ID and Badge clearly indicate "RETIRED" but she asked me If I was going to fly armed. I know that is illegal under LEOSA and said "NO I am checking it."

5. She filled out my firearms declaration and instructed me to put it inside my "roll aboard" That is where I always put it but I thanked her anyway.

6. She made a phone call and I thought it would be to the Port Authority Police. I could not hear what she said. Soon another United employee arrived and called someone on the radio. There was a brief exchange but after than she said, just wait here she will be down in about ten minutes. I expected to see a Port Authority female officer and a few moments later I saw the distinct flashing lights of a Port Authority Police vehicle outside the Terminal but:

7. Within five minutes a very polite United employee arrived and asked me if I was waiting for assistance. I told her about the firearm and she asked me if my declaration was in the case. She said follow me and took my roll aboard and said she would escort me to TSA. On the way there she asked me if I had ever checked a gun at Newark and when I said no she apologized and said the process was different at each airport. Frankly, just the way she said things made me think I was being taken to a Port Authority Police Office. I told her I had flown armed on many occasions (when on active duty on official business) and she seemed surprised but asked me no questions.

8. We got on an elevator and went upstairs to the second level and she came to a locked door and said wait here I will take it inside, should be about ten minutes or less. She entered and I am expecting the swat team to descend on me at any moment. Five minutes later she says, "You're all good to go and your bag and is locked and so is your gun case. Have a great flight and TSA Pre Check is right there" as she pointed out the entrance to Pre Check which I have.

9. Two hrs and 25 minutes later we landed at our destination, waited for 30 minutes and my bag was third through the the doors of baggage claim. The gun was in its case, the case was locked and all was well. No muss no fuss. I wonder if showing the ticket agent my badge and ID negated the calling of the PAP.?
 
My simple rule, sure would not work for everyone but fits me fine, no transportation that flies or floats.

Option 3 ;)

71537359_Beech18belowbehind.jpg.f0039a5c9e8bf6b8cd562562be9eb4b5.jpg
 
Beautiful Beech @delcrossv

I was on the ramp at KAEG some years ago, and two Beech B18's with turboprop conversions taxied up. IIRC, they were based in Virginia, and were in transit to Southern California where they were going to work a couple of weeks dropping sterile fruit flies on crops. I have always been amazed at the number of ways that folks make a living in aviation.
 
Newark

My only comment is concerning the use of TSA locks on the gun case itself. The regs specifically state that the person checking the firearm is the only person to have either the keys or combination to the lock(s) used to secure the firearm, and and TSA lock does not meet that test since it can be opened by TSA keys that are available to any Tom, Dick, or Harry.

Yes, the bag in which the gun case was placed should have a TSA lock, but the gun container itself should be more secure. This is a common misunderstanding, but one that could cause a person to run afoul of the federal regs.

The problem is that the TSA website, linked below, actually has some conflicting language that runs afoul of the regs themselves. They state on the website: "Only the passenger should retain the key or combination to the lock unless TSA personnel request the key to open the firearm container to ensure compliance with TSA regulations.", but then confuse things with" "You may use any brand or type of lock to secure your firearm case, including TSA-recognized locks."

The US Code cite is 49 CFR § 1540.111, which clearly states "(iv) The container in which it is carried is locked, and only the passenger retains the key or combination." This is not possible using a TSA lock.

Transporting Firearms and Ammunition | Transportation Security Administration

49 CFR SS 1540.111 - Carriage of weapons, explosives, and incendiaries by individuals. | CFR | US Law | LII / Legal Information Institute
I actually believe your understanding of the reg and the guidance is incorrect. This has been an ongoing debate for ever on this and other sites. The TSA can legally access any bag for inspection. I think you would agree with that. If my TSA lock can be opened by TSA then I have not violated the law. The TSA has keys to open any TSA lock, but they do not have the combination. I have that and if I use a key type TSA lock I have that key. The purpose is to prevent YOU from opening my case not TSA. Their guidance is good. I have travelled well over 50 times with TSA locks and I have not had one TSA agent question the use of the lock. It would be nice if the reg said Keep the Keys, combination or use a TSA lock but they do not. Many airports send the bags to the baggage room but all bags are screened by TSA prior to be loaded. They are scanned by Xray and if TSA sees something suspicious the bag is opened. If it has a lock the owner is contacted to come back to a specific location to open it. If the bag is locked with a TSA approved lock it is opened and a note left that it was inspected (should happen but does not always happen) and this applies to any bag not even containing firearms. Nothing prevents anyone from using a lock that is not TSA approved, it will just inconvenience you when you do. I doubt if you will agree because those who take your position seem to be wedded to it no matter what is said but at least I tried.
 
Newark

So you, retied law enforcement, were expecting subterfuge on the part of law enforcement?

Makes ya think huh? ;)

I agree with the comment. Yes, get stopped by a cop in Texas and you have a firearm they will generally talk guns with you. Get stopped in blue states with anti gun laws and they treat you like a gang banger. The problem is most of those guys grew up in an anti gun culture and adopted it because they were literally brain washed. So yeah. I dont trust them to say, "Hey I believe in the Constitution I took an oath to uphold. They click their heels, throw out their right arm and scream they were only doing their job enforcing the law.
 
I actually believe your understanding of the reg and the guidance is incorrect. This has been an ongoing debate for ever on this and other sites. The TSA can legally access any bag for inspection. I think you would agree with that. If my TSA lock can be opened by TSA then I have not violated the law. The TSA has keys to open any TSA lock, but they do not have the combination. I have that and if I use a key type TSA lock I have that key. The purpose is to prevent YOU from opening my case not TSA. Their guidance is good. I have travelled well over 50 times with TSA locks and I have not had one TSA agent question the use of the lock. It would be nice if the reg said Keep the Keys, combination or use a TSA lock but they do not. Many airports send the bags to the baggage room but all bags are screened by TSA prior to be loaded. They are scanned by Xray and if TSA sees something suspicious the bag is opened. If it has a lock the owner is contacted to come back to a specific location to open it. If the bag is locked with a TSA approved lock it is opened and a note left that it was inspected (should happen but does not always happen) and this applies to any bag not even containing firearms. Nothing prevents anyone from using a lock that is not TSA approved, it will just inconvenience you when you do. I doubt if you will agree because those who take your position seem to be wedded to it no matter what is said but at least I tried.

You are correct, I do not agree with you.

Reason being, I can purchase a set of keys on Ebay that will open every TSA lock in the country, including those with combinations. As such, using a TSA lock invalidates the regulatory requirement that only the person checking the firearm have the key or combination.

Second, when you check the firearm, they want you to be available to open the firearm case should the need arise. Whenever I have flown, they have told me to stand by while the bag passes inspection, then notify me that I am good to go to my gate. This would not be necessary if a TSA lock was used, but is necessary since I am the only person who should have the keys.

Yes, common practice is that many use TSA locks without difficulty every day, but do you want to chance being held up because of the odd TSA agent who actually knows the regs?
 
Thanks for the comment. I really, really would have liked to make their ban on 8+ and hollow points an issue but I also know the court system up there is not conducive to gun rights and I did not want to leave it to SCOTUS to decide a case since they are reluctant to take gun cases. I also dont have the money to hire those kinds of lawyers....

I wrote the piece hoping to generate more comments from people who have flown through Newark or any of the NY metro airports to see what they have experienced.

I don’t know why anyone would take the risks of flying into/out of NY, NJ, etc. with a gun in the first place, unless they are in law-enforcement or are retired LE. It’s just begging for trouble and bankruptcy.
I stay away from places like those on general principles anyway, and plan to stay away from them for the rest of my life.
I fail to see why you people that live and work in those places put up with that ****, and fund it all with your tax money.
I won’t.
Ever.
 
Last edited:
TSA

You are correct, I do not agree with you.

Reason being, I can purchase a set of keys on Ebay that will open every TSA lock in the country, including those with combinations. As such, using a TSA lock invalidates the regulatory requirement that only the person checking the firearm have the key or combination.

Second, when you check the firearm, they want you to be available to open the firearm case should the need arise. Whenever I have flown, they have told me to stand by while the bag passes inspection, then notify me that I am good to go to my gate. This would not be necessary if a TSA lock was used, but is necessary since I am the only person who should have the keys.

Yes, common practice is that many use TSA locks without difficulty every day, but do you want to chance being held up because of the odd TSA agent who actually knows the regs?

Well I was correct you did not agree. I will try one last logical argument but I doubt if you will still agree. Here we go. Each agency in the government writes their own (regulations called Guidance.) Guidance is the governing policy of how that agency enforces or interprets the regulations. If you read the TSA web site you will see that under the subject of firearms TSA indicates TSA locks are approved. That is how they interpret the regulation and issue guidance to their inspectors (TSA personnel). I know what the regulation states: To that we do not disagree. I know what TSA declares the regulation to be, and that is TSA locks are approved. Your other arguments not withstanding about buying master keys on EBAY are good but do not in any way make me a violator. I do not give my keys to anyone nor do I give out the combination. If you choose to buy a master set of keys on Ebay I have not defacto given you the key. So I suggest you go read the TSA statement. You may disagree that they are applying correct guidance, that is your perogative, but I am not violating the regulation regardless of how you interpret the regulation. The law says you can not posses illegal substances, there is no Federal Law that says if the police conduct an illegal search the evidence is not admissible in court: That was done by a SOCOTUS ruling, so even though you had the illegal substance you wont get convicted. There is big difference in a regulation and how one applies that regulation. If TSA did not say I can use a TSA lock then I would like you find another locking method. I personally believe TSA has it right in their guidance but I would grant you that a reading of the regulation would give me concern if it was not stated by TSA.
 
Thought this was settled long ago…

…and it was; but here we go again.

I taught the course re: carrying a gun in one’s checked bag…and personally aboard an aircraft…in the early days when policies were evolving post-9/11. Instructed in multiple states all across the country.

From the jump, TSA locks for checked bags were okay. Fact. Period.

That was personally confirmed by me in consult with cognizant Department of Homeland Security personnel. That has previously been noted in other related threads. It was also ‘proven’ by my personally checking a bag containing a gun scores of times and in scores of airports.

Just be aware the protocols in your home airport likely will be different in other airports. Same regulations; simply different physical arrangements. (e.g. In some airports you physically accompany your bag to a TSA baggage checkpoint. At other airports it goes on a belt immediately. Your bag is ALWAYS screened beyond you declaring it to an airline agent. Fact.)

In addition, never had a gun stolen. Or a piece of luggage ‘lost.’

Just go with the flow…you and your gun will be just fine.

Be safe.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top