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My guess would be marketing. Most shooters associate 32 with weak handgun rounds.
Federal Introduces New .30 Super Carry Ammunition
- Thread starter peyton
- Start date
My guess would be marketing. Most shooters associate 32 with weak handgun rounds.
Model 15-4ever
Member
30 Super Carry is a Vista Outdoor fantasy island dream:
1) No brass, no primers and no suitable bullets available
+
2) Factory practice ammo @ $40/50 and defensive rounds @ $30/20
=
3) Even higher record profits (their last reported quarter profits increased over 400%)
The Vista Outdoor Way: Stop taking orders for primers, which kills handloading. Stiff the LGS by selling most of their production either to big box retailers or direct to consumer (at full retail). Restrict production of standard calibres to keep demand high (haven't seen a round of .38 Spl, .357 Mag, .44 Spl, .44 Mag or .45 Colt at the LGS in almost a year). Introduce new cartridges for which there is only their own factory ammo. Use the record profits to buy new product line companies, not invest in more capacity.
They're no longer an ammunition company. Just a big corporation that happens to make ammunition, and is a near monopoly. There's a couple of articles out there describing the situation, and Vista Outdoors strategy to maximize investor profit. Guess what? It doesn't include satisfying the demand for ammo.
1) No brass, no primers and no suitable bullets available
+
2) Factory practice ammo @ $40/50 and defensive rounds @ $30/20
=
3) Even higher record profits (their last reported quarter profits increased over 400%)
The Vista Outdoor Way: Stop taking orders for primers, which kills handloading. Stiff the LGS by selling most of their production either to big box retailers or direct to consumer (at full retail). Restrict production of standard calibres to keep demand high (haven't seen a round of .38 Spl, .357 Mag, .44 Spl, .44 Mag or .45 Colt at the LGS in almost a year). Introduce new cartridges for which there is only their own factory ammo. Use the record profits to buy new product line companies, not invest in more capacity.
They're no longer an ammunition company. Just a big corporation that happens to make ammunition, and is a near monopoly. There's a couple of articles out there describing the situation, and Vista Outdoors strategy to maximize investor profit. Guess what? It doesn't include satisfying the demand for ammo.
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otis24
Member
I just learned of this round last night.
If I had a Shield (or something similar) I would not trade it for a mere 2 round capacity increase. At some point we have to ask "at what point is my handgun good enough?". For me and my situation 10-12 rounds in a compact handgun is sufficient for my needs. Anything more is overkill. YMMV!
Some in the shooting community would question the effectiveness of the .380 as an acceptable self-defense caliber. Not me.
The potential benefit I see from the.30 SC is for those who are recoil sensitive (age, arthritis, women). Taking a smaller round and bumping it up to 9mm performance levels without the recoil of the 9mm would have many advantages to an entire group of shooters. It's something that I would like to try. Am I going to sell all of my guns and switch to it? No. But it is something certainly worth keeping an eye on.
It would be interesting to see if any manufacturers will chamber a revolver in this round with moon clips and what the capacity would be in a revolver.
If I had a Shield (or something similar) I would not trade it for a mere 2 round capacity increase. At some point we have to ask "at what point is my handgun good enough?". For me and my situation 10-12 rounds in a compact handgun is sufficient for my needs. Anything more is overkill. YMMV!
Some in the shooting community would question the effectiveness of the .380 as an acceptable self-defense caliber. Not me.
The potential benefit I see from the.30 SC is for those who are recoil sensitive (age, arthritis, women). Taking a smaller round and bumping it up to 9mm performance levels without the recoil of the 9mm would have many advantages to an entire group of shooters. It's something that I would like to try. Am I going to sell all of my guns and switch to it? No. But it is something certainly worth keeping an eye on.
It would be interesting to see if any manufacturers will chamber a revolver in this round with moon clips and what the capacity would be in a revolver.
I wouldn't be surprised to see someone run with your revolver/moon clips idea. But, then again, to what real purpose? Doesn't the .32 H&R Magnum almost equal and the .327 Federal Magnum exceed what the .30 Super Carry could deliver in a revolver?
sipowicz
Member
You can tell people at the range it's not a 9mm or 380. It's a SUPERCARRY. After that you are on your own to explain further.
Beemer-mark
Member
I'd like them to make existing ammo and especially primers. Why they need to divert resources to a new pistol round is beyond me. In a few years it will join the 45 GAP.
otis24
Member
If the .32 H&R Mag is so great, why the .327 Mag? I'm not well versed on the .327, but I have heard that it is a very LOUD round. It it is only chambered in revolvers. Makes me wonder what kind of sound the 30SC makes.
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You would probably gain 1 round in small revolvers, same as going from 38 to 32 H&R.
Depending on the exact dimensions of the cartridge it might even be possible to use 30 Super in 327 Federal revolvers with moon clips. I have seen the pressure limit for 30 Super listed as 50,000, "near 50,000" and 45,000. The pressure limit for 327 is 45,000 PSI. And they both use .312 bullets. The 30 Super would be about halfway between 32 H&R and 327 Federal in terms of power. And probably muzzle blast. The 327 may have the same peak pressure but can maintain that pressure longer due to its longer case and greater powder capacity.
But Federal might have added some taper so the 30 is wider at the back end or otherwise changed the dimensions just to make sure you cannot use 30 Super in an existing revolver. Putting it into a 327 cylinder designed to handle 45,000 would be fine.
Dropping it into a 32 H&R cylinder designed for 21,000 PSI or even worse a 32 S&W long cylinder designed for 12,000 PSI could be a disaster. And the 30 Super case would be short enough to fit both.
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DWalt
Member
I have often wondered the same thing. The .38 ACP (direct ancestor of the .38 Super) pre-dates the 9x19mm, and is clearly its ballistic superior. The only significant dimensional difference is that the case is 4mm longer. So why didn't the .38 Super keep its lead over the 9x19?
cmj8591
Member
The 38 Super is a semi-rimmed cartridge, hence it has difficulty in double stack magazines without diddleing around with it. That's why the 9mm has taken off and the 38 Super has watched from the sidelines. All things being equal, the 38 Super has a lot more potential than the 9mm. It's just that it is finicky with feeding from a double stack.
ironhead7544
Member
A S&W Model 32 sized revolver in six shot that uses moon clips would be nice in 30 Souper Carry. 32 ACP looks like it also could be fired with clips. A Scandium version would be super light. Might be able to set it up to use the other 32 cal cartridges too. A concealed hammer and 3 inch versions would also be nice. And a 4 inch Kit Gun version. 32 S&W to 327 Magnum. A person could pick the amount of recoil they wanted for the day. AND, a new chapter for S&W collectors!
What's not to like?
What's not to like?
mscampbell2734
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No
The OVERALL LENGTH of the loaded round is close to 45 ACP length. This requires a grip frame the same size as 45.
9mm overall length is significantly shorter, allowing a smaller grip frame, and a comfortable grip to people of smaller stature. Which means more people find 9mm frames fit their hand then 38 Super frames.
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Smokester653
Member
Before I Even...
Before I even entertain the idea of trying or buying this caliber I will have to see many different ammo companies and firearm manufacturers coming on board. The ammo will have to be reasonably priced and multiple choices of handguns available like the 9mm is and until that happens it's a hard no for me...pretty wishful thinking on my part I guess....
Before I even entertain the idea of trying or buying this caliber I will have to see many different ammo companies and firearm manufacturers coming on board. The ammo will have to be reasonably priced and multiple choices of handguns available like the 9mm is and until that happens it's a hard no for me...pretty wishful thinking on my part I guess....
Eddie Southgate
Member
Amazing thing to me is , they can't supply the market that they already have but they think coming out with something new is a good idea. I'd be working on supplying current ammo and component demand rather than bringing out a new cartridge I won't be able to supply .
Buy a large stock of cartridges before you even think about buying anything to shoot them in .
Buy a large stock of cartridges before you even think about buying anything to shoot them in .
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From an ammo company's point of view increasing demand is always a good idea. If you rest on your laurels when demand is high you get left behind when demand slows down. Increased demand means even higher prices. If demand suddenly falls off like it did in 2016 they would be kicking themselves for not establishing new products now.
This new round will have no real impact on how much 9mm, 223, etc, they are pumping out. Since nobody has a 30 Super it will not take a big run to make all the 30 people will need for the near future. A drop in the bucket if that.
It's not like they are pulling people off the manufacturing floor to design new rounds. If its like the companies I have worked for they have a separate design team. And the marketing folks might as well be working on ads for 30 Super, they don't need to beg people to buy 9mm right now.
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otis24;141361263 Taking a smaller round and bumping it up to 9mm performance levels without the recoil of the 9mm would have many advantages to an entire group of shooters..[/QUOTE said:
DWalt
Member
Yep - conservation of momentum in action.
