Feds vs iPhone

oldguyshoot said:
It's as if you didn't read what I wrote and just wanted a cheap shot snarky quote to hang your hat on. It's all or nothing with breaking this encryption. You can't do what the FBI is asking "just this once" and expect to keep YOUR privacy.
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No I read your post and I understand your position - I just believe that when you take multiple lives you no longer have any rights, and IMHO the FBI isn't doing anything that everyday hackers don't do to phones and computers everyday anyway. They are just asking Apple to assist them. I wasn't trying to be "snarky" - just trying to make my point that these people don't deserve to have any rights - they're terrorists. I'm not concerned about "My" privacy as I don't put anything out on my phone or computer that needs to be "protected".

Pete99004
 
Pete99004 said:
No I read your post and I understand your position - I just believe that when you take multiple lives you no longer have any rights, and IMHO the FBI isn't doing anything that everyday hackers don't do to phones and computers everyday anyway. They are just asking Apple to assist them. I wasn't trying to be "snarky" - just trying to make my point that these people don't deserve to have any rights - they're terrorists. I'm not concerned about "My" privacy as I don't put anything out on my phone or computer that needs to be "protected".

Pete99004
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With respect, this is not about one manufacturer being asked to backdoor their OS and make it available to federal LE for one device under warrant. This is about the federal government enforcing its will on all manufacturers of encrypted devices to force those manufacturers to engineer a backdoor and make that code available, on demand, in perpetuity.

For those who support this in the present case, I empathize with your views. That said, where does this stop? Not at one device. Nor does it stop with LE. Do you truly believe that the federal government can keep that code safe? The federal government has "lost" the PII of millions of its employees repeatedly, either to foreign governments (ask OPM about that one) to hackers or through incompetence.

Once written, do you think that code remains in some super-inaccessible safe? Open Pandora's box at your peril. Google industrial espionage and form an opinion. Apple, Google, et.al. are not appreciably better...and they write the code. Do you trust them? Oh, and guess where the Apple hardware is built? Not within these shores.

Put nothing you are unwilling to lose on a networked device.
Put nothing on the Internet that you are unwilling to have used by somebody for something to which you don't agree.
Document the tragic boating accidents ;)
 
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Good for Apple. One of the reasons I bought my iPhone was for its secure encryption. I don't want anyone or any government hacking into it.

The two people who carried out the SB attack are dead. Case closed. The government can access their phone and data records through their respective carrier and doesn't need to get into the actual phone. The government doesn't need to bully Apple into compromising our privacy and denigrating their encryption.
 
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There's a lot going on, its not just one issue. First, we have the problem of Apple not even being willing to help, and defying a court order. The judge or magistrate should be properly incensed. And then start jailing everyone at apple he can get in his court room. Yes, things might be a bit different if the top cats at apple get to cool their heels until the "try" to help instead of defying the court. Maybe its time in this country for the executives of a major corporation to spend some jail time for their refusals.

And then the issue of that one phone. Maybe the FBI should give them an adequate time to help, then go to the ruskies and Chinese and ask for their help. With everyone understanding that since Apple refused the chance to help, when the others come up with a way, they're going public with it.
 
rburg said:
There's a lot going on, its not just one issue. First, we have the problem of Apple not even being willing to help, and defying a court order. The judge or magistrate should be properly incensed. And then start jailing everyone at apple he can get in his court room. Yes, things might be a bit different if the top cats at apple get to cool their heels until the "try" to help instead of defying the court. Maybe its time in this country for the executives of a major corporation to spend some jail time for their refusals.

And then the issue of that one phone. Maybe the FBI should give them an adequate time to help, then go to the ruskies and Chinese and ask for their help. With everyone understanding that since Apple refused the chance to help, when the others come up with a way, they're going public with it.
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This response is what the phrase "going off half-cocked" was meant for. Apple has cooperated up to but not past this point.

I wish everyone thinking about this topic could realize the magnitude of what the judge "ordered" them to do. This is the kind of stuff that keeps me up at night - people with good intentions causing irreparable havoc upon the greater good. Isn't that what everyone reading this thread typically associates with the liberal mindset? Sacrifice your freedoms so I don't have to live in fear? The liberal wants your 30-round AR mag for the same reason you want a backdoor to my iPhone. I'm sorry, but I hope to hell neither liberals nor you get your wish.

People, the FBI wants Apple in essence to destroy EVERYTHING they've worked toward, which is keeping your and my personal data safe from criminals - and this is what should hit you in the head like a ton of bricks - the government is full of criminals. We all know it. It's impossible in such a large organization to keep out the bad apples. So anything the government owns, criminals own. Think about that a while. Apple is being asked not to go into some dark room, extract the info, and bringing out to the FBI and then poof the way they did it's gone. They're being asked by proxy to CREATE something that currently DOESNT EXIST - a way to hack ALL IPHONES. Obama (yes he's the one explicitly on record as behind this - no tin foil required) wants to PAY APPLE to HACK THEIR OWN SECURITY and leave Apple and all iPhone users holding the bag.

Wake up, everyone!
 
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Some of you guys are missing the point. There is no way to open it. Apple never made a "key" . Which is what they are now being asked to do.

Hackers don't count because you have to open their link and download their maleware. The cannot just upload to you willy nilly.

What the FBI is asking is to make a master key.

The gov can hack it that was never the problem. What they can't stop is the data wipe if the password is wrong and this is what they want changed. To do that the operating system has to be changed and re written. Las time I checked all operating system updates are wireless. See where this is going? One cell phone = every Apple cell phone
 
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Pete99004 said:
No I read your post and I understand your position - I just believe that when you take multiple lives you no longer have any rights, and IMHO the FBI isn't doing anything that everyday hackers don't do to phones and computers everyday anyway. They are just asking Apple to assist them. I wasn't trying to be "snarky" - just trying to make my point that these people don't deserve to have any rights - they're terrorists. I'm not concerned about "My" privacy as I don't put anything out on my phone or computer that needs to be "protected".

Pete99004
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But we're not talking about the rights of the dead terrorists, are we? We're talking about the fact that if Apple engineers a way to defeat their own security on he iPhone, that means that if mine's stolen (or lost and found by a criminal), they will have a way to access everything on my device.

Do you know why I own an iPhone? Because if I lose or have it stolen, I can remotely wipe the device, and if not (theif turns it off), I know that if they try my passcode 10 times and fail, my data is erased forever.

If law enforcement needs unfettered access to our phones to do its job, it's time for new leadership in law enforcement. This latest attempt by the FBI to strong arm Apple is in part because they are deeply embarrassed by recent failures and are under enormous pressure to assure us of our safety.
 
Here's a good example. BlackBerry didn't have this encryption and the NSA was able to remotely install an update to the Operating System where they could turn on your phone speaker and camera even though your phone maybe be off. The only way to stop it would be to pull the battery out.

Luckily this happened to citizens of another country but that phone was also sold in the US so who can say if our citizens were spied on
 
I worked with encryption while in the service many years ago and if it is anything like that used by the military it may not be able to be read by anyone but who the messages were sent to ..

one on one encryption no one else has the keys ..
 
Dollars to donuts this case has gone to court because a certain other three letter agency does not want to admit that they can do it.
 
3dots said:
This prevents even us from being able to perform a "Chip-Off" recovery wherein we trigger a raw data dump from the bare NANDs to access and rebuild the logical data (files). Other than Apple, I would say that 20% of the other NAND RAM based devices out there are hardware encrypted and soon all will be. There is NO WAY to get past this.
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Couldn't you do a bit recovery of the data off the memory chips, load into a new iPhone and enter 10 passcodes, if the data wipes, rinse repeat until you've brute forced a decrypt?

With a 4 digit code it would take time and you'd need a bunch of sacrificial iPhones or a breadboard version to constantly reload from you golden copy but why wouldn't that work?
 
Here's their man,,,he'll Get R Done! ;)

FarSide.jpg
 
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