Interesting questin: How many rounds?

[CommonCents]

There is a video of 3 thugs bursting into a mcdonalds, guns drawn, points a gun at a female, then one of them shoots an employee in the kitchen.

If you had the need to engage and protect yourself, you'll appreciate some extra capacity.

Depending on where you live and patronize, this is going to be a more common occurrence that it already is.

I think a fair amount of home invasions and armed robberies involve more than one thug.

 

[Biggfoot44]

I couldn't get the edit to behave on my blueberry , so I'll add the additional detail here.

In the second incident , with all the rounds flying in a crowded shopping center on the ground floor of an office building at lunch time , one bystander was non-fatally hit also. Bullet passed thru , and either wasn't recovered , or otherwise unable to make forensic determination who fired it. Was the wrong angle for my friend to have fired , but could have been any of the at least three BG's , or good guy #1 . Guess who was sued. Both good guys were deposed by plaintif lawyer, but their employer never shared any info about settlements , if any.

Bad guys often will make a tactic of using crowds as camoflague. In this case the BG's opened fire first , and it was shoot back or die on the spot.

 

[Smoke]

I think things have changed since that study, for one thing I think that you're more likely to be attacked by more than one person these days. I already said it but I generally carry two reloads. I don't really notice 2 6906 magazines or 2 4006 magazines on my belt, it's really not that much of a load to carry.

 

[Protected One]

I think things have changed since that study, for one thing I think that you're more likely to be attacked by more than one person these days. I already said it but I generally carry two reloads. I don't really notice 2 6906 magazines or 2 4006 magazines on my belt, it's really not that much of a load to carry.

The FBI says that the average number of home invaders is 3, but home invasions were not included in the odds spoken of in the video, assuming that is the "study" you are referring to.

Also, police in the Detroit area say that muggers/robbers have taken to wearing bullet-proof vest AND having their victims strip(in order to insure they aren't carrying). This trend MAY spread to other areas, so be vigilant guys.

 

[TexasArmed]

The FBI says that the average number of home invaders is 3, but home invasions were not included in the odds spoken of in the video, assuming that is the "study" you are referring to.

Also, police in the Detroit area say that muggers/robbers have taken to wearing bullet-proof vest AND having their victims strip(in order to insure they aren't carrying). This trend MAY spread to other areas, so be vigilant guys.

I was not aware that the average number are that many, expected maybe one or two. My revolvers only hold five or six rounds but I keep about three within reach. Will a bullet proof vest stop a 45 hollow point? Or a 44 HP. If not maybe I ought to buy a shotgun too for home defense. Even if there are three of them only one way in and one way out of my abode. If there are three of them with AK-47's most folks will be outgunned if they get inside. My home defense is a Smith & Wesson 625-5 Colt 45 loaded with six hollow points. So if your quoted FBI Stats are right, is my 45 Colt inadequate against
home invaders wearing bullet proof vests? If so what would
you recommend instead?

 

[Protected One]

I was not aware that the average number are that many, expected maybe one or two. My revolvers only hold five or six rounds but I keep about three within reach. Will a bullet proof vest stop a 45 hollow point? Or a 44 HP. If not maybe I ought to buy a shotgun too for home defense. Even if there are three of them only one way in and one way out of my abode. If there are three of them with AK-47's most folks will be outgunned if they get inside. My home defense is a Smith & Wesson 625-5 Colt 45 loaded with six hollow points. So if your quoted FBI Stats are right, is my 45 Colt inadequate against
home invaders wearing bullet proof vests? If so what would
you recommend instead?

The FBI stat is easily verifiable by visiting the their site.

The comments on body armour and stripping were related to "outside the home" robberies - not home invasions.
Also, I'd expect that if you hit a target, center mass with .45 OR 44 hollow points (whether they are wearing armour or not) you will AT LEAST have an opportunity to escape...or put more rounds on target...and then escape.

 

[Smoke]

Git you some of them thar nucular tipped Black Talon Bullits and dip 'em in Teflon they'll cut through them vestses like a hot knife through butter

I'm sorry, I just couldn't keep a straight face

 

[vito]

I don't think anyone reading this thread really expects to find a definitive answer that will resolve the issue once and for all. Since the reality is that most of us will go our entire lifetimes and NEVER need a gun to defend ourselves or our family. Carrying a 2-round Derringer probably is enough for most of the cases where a gun is needed (apart from the inherent safety risk of a Derringer).

Carry whatever makes you feel comfortable. Personally I feel sorry for those who are so fearful that they need to carry multiple guns, with several reloads, just to feel safe enough to go out grocery shopping. If the threat is truly that great, moving to another abode seems more reasonable than living every moment armed to the teeth. I think that carrying ANY firearm, even a small 22LR, is PROBABLY going to be enough to do the job for most folks in most situations. But this is about an individual's comfort level, plus to some degree a rationalization for buying multiple guns and spending countless hours at the range. If you accept that the most likely self defense scenario will be firing no shots, or one or two shots at point-blank personal defense range, then unless you just enjoy shooting and owning guns it would not make sense to own several, or dozens of different handguns and using tons of ammo and a significant part of one's free time devoted to shooting.

My guess is that most of us on this and related forums own and shoot guns for a multitude of reasons, some rational, some not so rational but emotional, so we enjoy the endless discussions of how many rounds, what is the best or minimum caliber needed, the comparisons of revolvers to semi-autos, and so on and so forth.

 

[TexasArmed]

I don't think anyone reading this thread really expects to find a definitive answer that will resolve the issue once and for all. Since the reality is that most of us will go our entire lifetimes and NEVER need a gun to defend ourselves or our family. Carrying a 2-round Derringer probably is enough for most of the cases where a gun is needed (apart from the inherent safety risk of a Derringer).

Carry whatever makes you feel comfortable. Personally I feel sorry for those who are so fearful that they need to carry multiple guns, with several reloads, just to feel safe enough to go out grocery shopping. If the threat is truly that great, moving to another abode seems more reasonable than living every moment armed to the teeth. I think that carrying ANY firearm, even a small 22LR, is PROBABLY going to be enough to do the job for most folks in most situations. But this is about an individual's comfort level, plus to some degree a rationalization for buying multiple guns and spending countless hours at the range. If you accept that the most likely self defense scenario will be firing no shots, or one or two shots at point-blank personal defense range, then unless you just enjoy shooting and owning guns it would not make sense to own several, or dozens of different handguns and using tons of ammo and a significant part of one's free time devoted to shooting.

My guess is that most of us on this and related forums own and shoot guns for a multitude of reasons, some rational, some not so rational but emotional, so we enjoy the endless discussions of how many rounds, what is the best or minimum caliber needed, the comparisons of revolvers to semi-autos, and so on and so forth.

Two revolvers hold less rounds than your one semi. My revolvers are not likely to jam and me have to clear them.
A second revolver provides me the opportunity of drawing from
two locations pocket or hip, and is faster than using a speed
loader. But if you carry one semiautomatic and have to carry
only a seven round magazine then the semi would equal
one revolver. If it carries 15 rounds then it equals two revolvers in capacity, is the way I look at it.

 

[Old cop]

During my 30 yr. LEO career I once emptied my service revolver twice during a fight in a parking lot, but I'm no longer an LEO. There are extremes of everything and I now carry my 442 w/a single speed strip. If that's not enough I may have gone somewhere where I should not be in the first place. I would not have been in that parking lot if I'd not been an LEO at the time.

If carrying a bigger gun w/more rounds on board makes you comfortable than go for it, nothing wrong w/doing that.

 

[Fastbolt]

I've sometimes found myself in the position of idly wondering why some non-LE/CCW-type folks seem to feel the need to carry more weapons and more ammunition on their persons than I did when working in my LE career.

Not my business or problem, of course. Just something I've noticed from time to time.

 

[Protected One]

I've sometimes found myself in the position of idly wondering why some non-LE/CCW-type folks seem to feel the need to carry more weapons and more ammunition on their persons than I did when working in my LE career.

I've heard people (Non-LEO's) say that they carry multiple guns for several reasons:
-Backup in case of failure of primary gun
-Backup in case of loss of primary gun
-To arm another person in some "extreme" scenario
Considering that it is not possible to be prepared for every possible scenario, at some point we must ask ourselves "What is reasonable/rational/logical?"... and people tend to come up with different answers to that question.
I surely hope that the people carrying all that ammo have a round in the chamber, because THAT is likely to be more important in an actual self-defense encounter than how many rounds one has.

 

[Rastoff]

I once talked with a fellow who thought 8 rounds in his gun and one 8 round mag was inadequate. When asked why he responded that he was in a gun fight and ran out one time. So, I asked what the situation was where he ran out. Turns out it was a security detail in a foreign country and the diplomat he was protecting was attacked. If I was in a situation like that, I'd want more ammo too.

 

[Rastoff]

-To arm another person in some "extreme" scenario

I've heard this too. Can anyone tell me a situation where a normal person might want to arm someone else would be? I mean, if that other person didn't already have their own gun, they probably aren't ready to use your back up.

 

[Rebel Soul]

Fun thread to read.

I wear wing tips to work - not combat boots, so I feel just fine with 5 rounds.

I carry a revolver, some times with no extra rounds on my person - my pockets are full as is.

Do I feel inadequately armed? Heck no! As a civilian, I feel I outgun 99.99% of the people I encounter on a daily basis.

The truth is - carry what makes you feel safe.

 

[Protected One]

Really? How so?

Lets just say...by "limiting" what I can carry

 

[Protected One]

I once talked with a fellow who thought 8 rounds in his gun and one 8 round mag was inadequate. When asked why he responded that he was in a gun fight and ran out one time. So, I asked what the situation was where he ran out. Turns out it was a security detail in a foreign country and the diplomat he was protecting was attacked. If I was in a situation like that, I'd want more ammo too.

It always makes me chuckle when people equate situations such as that with those faced by civilians in everyday life

 

[Protected One]

I've heard this too. Can anyone tell me a situation where a normal person might want to arm someone else would be? I mean, if that other person didn't already have their own gun, they probably aren't ready to use your back up.

Here's one:
Take a situation like the Aurora movie theatre. My friend (a county sheriff) is allowed to carry in theatres...I am not. He and his wife, along with my wife and I frequently attend movies together. If a situation breaks out he could arm me with his backup gun.

 

[Protected One]

The truth is - carry what makes you feel safe.

In that case, I need to carry a SEAL team!

 

[Fastbolt]

My point was that when you peruse the internet gun forums, there are an amazing number of folks who seemingly feel the need to lug around more armament and ammunition during the course of their regular daily activities than the cops who patrol the same areas.

That, and the interesting statistic that reportedly no more than 20% of actively employed cops even carry a weapon when off-duty. Imagine how that number may drop upon retirement and return to the ranks of the private person.