Is the Slide fire going to be history?
- Thread starter Jessie
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PPS1980
Member
The media are decidedly ignorant about firearms as we all know too well. Apparently so are most of their "experts".
The photos that have emerged thus far show tripods with cameras attached for videoing the event by the shooter, not tripods for mounting weapons. Also, at least two weapons have been shown with BIpods attached with the expected limited length typical of them for prone shooting.
Remember that the media raced to the conclusion that these were "automatic weapons" and "converted to full automatic". I told my son, after listening to audio of the shooting, that it was either binary triggers or slam fired weapons but decidedly not fully automatic fire that was occurring.
Remember, in every mass shooting the media has been completely and utterly wrong on nearly every "fact" relating to the weapons in the first 48-72 hours. Wait, be patient, and be skeptical at this point.
I'm by no means an expert, however, the Slide Fire is, to the best of my knowledge, a form of a "bump stock".
Perhaps you are more knowledgeable then me and can help educate me on what exactly the Slide Fire is, if not a "bump stock"?
Kleenex/tissue . . .
ChattanoogaPhil
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Endless so-called experts have been running their mouths for a couple days... I'm not sure how many of them know what they're talking about.
For example, John Lott was interviewed by the media. He was convinced it was automatic gunfire and went into explanations about the NFA and how difficult is was to acquire these type of guns. Ex Secret Service, Don Bongino, did the same.
But while I was listening to these guys I'm thinking that the rate of fire sounded slow and uneven for automatic gunfire and sounded more like a Slidefire, and because of the extended round count during firing I thought something like Magpul's drum or Surefire's 60/100 magazines were used. Just passing thoughts really, not like I had given it any serious thought like these so-called experts supposedly do. Sure enough, the pics recently released show that's what it was.
Quite frankly, I'm rather suspicious of commentary about firearms in the news, even from pro gun 'experts'.
For example, John Lott was interviewed by the media. He was convinced it was automatic gunfire and went into explanations about the NFA and how difficult is was to acquire these type of guns. Ex Secret Service, Don Bongino, did the same.
But while I was listening to these guys I'm thinking that the rate of fire sounded slow and uneven for automatic gunfire and sounded more like a Slidefire, and because of the extended round count during firing I thought something like Magpul's drum or Surefire's 60/100 magazines were used. Just passing thoughts really, not like I had given it any serious thought like these so-called experts supposedly do. Sure enough, the pics recently released show that's what it was.
Quite frankly, I'm rather suspicious of commentary about firearms in the news, even from pro gun 'experts'.
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phoebeisis
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AR'S on gun deals-jumped up $100
I check slick deals gun deals daily
ARs immediately went up about $100
but some didn't
Same story after poor Steve Scalise was shot
But after a few weeks prices dropped to even lower levels
The days when the gun sellers could reap windfall profits from gun scares are over
Rep president Rep congress
only a fool would buy High now
Now the slide fire devices-yeah they will stay up
who cares-if I ever have to use my AR-don't hunt so it would be self defense
I won't want to spray 5-10 rounds at a time
and my guess is I will probably grab a hand gun-middle of suburbia don't want to carry 1000 yards kill neighbors or neighbors pets
plus handgun a lot easier to manipulate-not as easy to grab
granted much less lethal-but good enough
I check slick deals gun deals daily
ARs immediately went up about $100
but some didn't
Same story after poor Steve Scalise was shot
But after a few weeks prices dropped to even lower levels
The days when the gun sellers could reap windfall profits from gun scares are over
Rep president Rep congress
only a fool would buy High now
Now the slide fire devices-yeah they will stay up
who cares-if I ever have to use my AR-don't hunt so it would be self defense
I won't want to spray 5-10 rounds at a time
and my guess is I will probably grab a hand gun-middle of suburbia don't want to carry 1000 yards kill neighbors or neighbors pets
plus handgun a lot easier to manipulate-not as easy to grab
granted much less lethal-but good enough
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LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
Agreed. Essentially, this bozo was engaging "area targets" rather than aiming at any specific individual. Note that only about 10% of his victims were killed out of more than 500 actually hit (not to make light of the horrors of this violent attack, just commenting on the differences between accurately aimed fire and massive numbers of rounds launched into groups of people).
We are sure to hear of legislative proposals to regulate or ban bump stocks, semi-auto firearms in general, magazines over certain capacities, and every other knee jerk reaction following horrific acts of insane violence.
Republicans are saying they have no issue banning them so it will probably happen the first time they get a chance to vote on it.
Could be prohibited in many states
Might even get done in by Congress
Don't have one and would be fine to see it go
I also have no problem limiting centerfire rifle mags to 10 and pistol mags to 10, 12 or 15
Might even get done in by Congress
Don't have one and would be fine to see it go
I also have no problem limiting centerfire rifle mags to 10 and pistol mags to 10, 12 or 15
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Arik
Member
Why?
This is the problem with gun owners. Anti gunners are united in their quest to disarm everyone. Meanwhile gun owners are ok with things getting banned as long as it's not something they're into. I don't have one either. Nor do I have an Taurus Judge or a Shockwave or any other useless gimmick (in my opinion) but I have no problems with their existence or people owning them.
Remember your pretty blued and Walnut hunting rifles are just long range sniper rifles capable of killing from miles away and chambered in calibers capable of bringing down an elephant! Those can kill several people with one bullet. What civilian needs that?
Have you seen what destructive power a shotgun has at close range? Not to mention that each shot has the potential to kill at least 8 people. That's like a full auto! What civilian needs that?
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GF
Member
I think the slide fire will go away. As in legislated away.
And if the suppressor bill has been tabled too, the camel's nose is definitely Under the Tent.
GF
And if the suppressor bill has been tabled too, the camel's nose is definitely Under the Tent.
GF
I am divided on this issue. On one hand I never want to give the
Anti Gun crowd an inch. On the other hand you have to look at
what's been going on with gun ownership. There is a new breed
of people that own guns. Some have bought guns for personal
protection, some for the preppers, but the ones that worry me
the most are the gamers who graduate into buying real guns.
Go on YouTube and you can view countless idiots doing all kind
of things a real gun person or Hunter would never do. People
at this IQ are scary without being mental. The general public
sees this stuff and it worries them. As in most "situations" if
you don't police yourself, it won't be long before someone is.
Because of this incident the suppressor issue will not be brought
up. Having nothing to do with the tragedy doesn't matter. There
are a lot of honest people that are afraid of guns because they
don't own any, there family never had guns, ect. These people
have no hidden agenda but are easily swayed by Anti Gun crowd.
I don't know how to react to this. My opinion is to outlaw such
devices as the bump stock and other devices to simulate full auto
fire. These devises are novelties and toys with no practical use.
There are other things on the market now that have no value as
to any practical purpose, just novelties and toys. When one of
these "things" end up connected to one of these tragedies it never fails to give Anti Gunners more ammo.
Anti Gun crowd an inch. On the other hand you have to look at
what's been going on with gun ownership. There is a new breed
of people that own guns. Some have bought guns for personal
protection, some for the preppers, but the ones that worry me
the most are the gamers who graduate into buying real guns.
Go on YouTube and you can view countless idiots doing all kind
of things a real gun person or Hunter would never do. People
at this IQ are scary without being mental. The general public
sees this stuff and it worries them. As in most "situations" if
you don't police yourself, it won't be long before someone is.
Because of this incident the suppressor issue will not be brought
up. Having nothing to do with the tragedy doesn't matter. There
are a lot of honest people that are afraid of guns because they
don't own any, there family never had guns, ect. These people
have no hidden agenda but are easily swayed by Anti Gun crowd.
I don't know how to react to this. My opinion is to outlaw such
devices as the bump stock and other devices to simulate full auto
fire. These devises are novelties and toys with no practical use.
There are other things on the market now that have no value as
to any practical purpose, just novelties and toys. When one of
these "things" end up connected to one of these tragedies it never fails to give Anti Gunners more ammo.
Arik
Member
What do those gamer YouTube individuals have to do with a man in his 50s who killed 59 people for reasons yet unknown?
I agree I see no PRACTICAL use for it but I can also guarantee you that you own something I see no PRACTICAL use for
Where exactly is the connection?
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jag312
Member
In California the new definition of Assault Weapon is any semiauto rifle with a detachable magazine. That includes Winchester, Remington, Browning hunting rifles. Even a Winchester Model 1905 hunting rifle.
Some of the anti-gun cultists wave talked about banning telescopic sights on rifles. "A rifle with a telescopic sight is a sniper rifle, and nobody needs a sniper rifle."
Some have talked about banning lever action rifles. "Look at Chuck Connors. He fires that rifle like a machinegun. We need to ban these lever action machineguns."
I'm afraid that the tragedy in Las Vegas will be a turning point in gun rights. Just like the tragedies in the 60s lead to the 1968 Gun Control Act.
ChattanoogaPhil
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You are in agreement with the late Bill Ruger then.
Arik
Member
And there ladies and gentlemen is our problem.
What does a 15 round mag do that a 30 can't. How long does it take to reload a different mag? Two seconds? One? Less? Only difference becomes owning two instead of one!
Bushmaster, if you're concerned about the rate of fire from a magazine you should really stick with muskets. 2-4 a min sounds reasonable? Or still too fast?
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What does a 15 round mag do that a 30 can't. How long does it take to reload a different mag? Two seconds? One? Less? Only difference becomes owning two instead of one!
Bushmaster, if you're concerned about the rate of fire from a magazine you should really stick with muskets. 2-4 a min sounds reasonable? Or still too fast?
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It is unlikely anyone will say, or if anyone has even tried to determine, how many injuries were caused directly by bullets, and how many were a result of the stampede to escape? How much of the panic he caused can be attributed to just the sound of gunfire, akin to yelling "Fire" in crowded theater?
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Senator Feinstein is introducing a Bill to ban Bump Fire and Trigger Cranks.
I am okay with this, but it should be combined with some pro-2A stuff like national concealed carry and allowing the shipment of handguns and ammo through the Post Office.
I am okay with this, but it should be combined with some pro-2A stuff like national concealed carry and allowing the shipment of handguns and ammo through the Post Office.
If you read post there is no connection to Vegas. The point is
these idiots are seen by the public and are bad examples of
gun ownership. The subject is the banning of Bumpfire and
like accessories. Which leads to the kind of shooters who would
buy such things. Bingo, gamer types and kids. These type devices
have no practical purpose for any use. They are toys & novelties.
The public are the ones that need honest information, the Anti
Gun people are happy to spread misinformation. I think we need
to stand firm on 2nd adm. But use common sense.
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For about 3 decades I have been trying explain to people that "assault rifles" are not machine guns and cannot be easily converted to full-auto. I realize a slide stock is not true full-auto. But there is no way I will ever be able to convince anyone that heard the video that this guy did not successfully convert his gun to full auto. The effect was certainly the same.
The general public is so opposed to full auto guns being available a ban on sales of devices designed to simulate full auto is inevitable. Probably not with the current president and congress but Republicans are not going to be in power forever.
Rather than fight a losing battle I would rather see the Hearing Protection Act amended to include a ban on future sales of slide stocks and cranks. Most of the gun enthusiasts I know always oppose giving up anything but in this case we would be gaining more with suppressors than we would be giving up with Slide fire stocks. I doubt the NRA would support any sort of compromise but Trump does like to make deals.
Arik
Member
What common sense? That these things are toys and gimmicks? I agree that they are but not with the common sense .... because like I said, what's rational to you is a gimmick to me. Case in point....the Shockwave shotgun, the Taurus Judge....all gimmicks. All toys....TO ME! Obviously not to others. I bet if you list all the firearms you have I'll find at least one gimmick toy. So by your own words it should be common sense that this is banned?
What about accessories such as scopes? Common sense tells us we don't need them.
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Arik
Member
We wouldn't gain anything. We get a suppressor which not everyone wants. I have no use for one. I have shot plenty of them, here's one of me shooting just this weekend.
Still....I have no interest in one. I'd rather pay $20 for hearing protection. Now, this doesn't mean I'm against people owning them. What I'm against is giving something up to own them. Because it's slide fire today, it's mag capacity next time. Eventually it's your suppressor and everything else. Remember 1968? 1994?
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Arik
Member
So the simple act of shipping trumps mag capacity and accessories? In that case I'm all for it as long as there are no more semi auto rifles in rim or center fire. Reasonable common sense. Ship your single shot any which way you like!
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codenamedave
Member
I'm by no means an expert, however, the Slide Fire is, to the best of my knowledge, a form of a "bump stock".
Perhaps you are more knowledgeable then me and can help educate me on what exactly the Slide Fire is, if not a "bump stock"?
If I am more knowledgeable than you, it's in the area of basic English skills, specifically reading comprehension.
All Slide Fires are bump fire stocks, not all bump fire stocks are Slide Fires.
Or did you really think that Jessie meant that only Slide Fires would be banned, and not any other bump fire stocks?
Arik
Member
Here's how I look at this. You give up something to get something. Some apparently are willing to give up a lot more than others. Who needs that many rounds?
Well...... anyone remember the Dunblane Massacre in 1996? Not that long ago! The killer used a Browning HiPower and a S&W model 19!!! What happened then? England lost their rights to firearms! Now look at their knife acts! Their knives are treated almost like our handgun laws.
Look at the US gun control act of 1968. That started because of a surplus bolt action rifle. We keep letting things slide and soon enough the next one will be the loss of hunting rifles because some nut job used one to kill
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Well...... anyone remember the Dunblane Massacre in 1996? Not that long ago! The killer used a Browning HiPower and a S&W model 19!!! What happened then? England lost their rights to firearms! Now look at their knife acts! Their knives are treated almost like our handgun laws.
Look at the US gun control act of 1968. That started because of a surplus bolt action rifle. We keep letting things slide and soon enough the next one will be the loss of hunting rifles because some nut job used one to kill
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You really want to ship your guns through the post office....I can barely get my mail delivered to the right mail box and rarely do my packages ever escape unscathed.....not to mention the stolen items from our rural boxes the postal inspectors simply shrug at..........no thanks. I will stick to FedEx.
You do realize that this is pointless right? With a little practice you can reload a magazine fed rifle or pistol in not much more than a second.
So...once that becomes obvious and someone does a mass shooting with low capacity magazines, they'll be screaming to ban semi-auto rifles and pistols (if they don't get the Axe this time around.
The irony here is that I actually enjoy shooting semi-auto pistol qualification courses with a revolver. I drop a single point on the FBI Q course on stage 3 with the 8 rounds in 8 seconds at 7 yards as I have to do a reload. I can shoot it cleanly however with a 7 shot 686+.
So...once semi-autos are banned and someone does a mass shooting with a revolver, they'll ban speed loaders, and perhaps also "high capacity" revolvers that hold more than 6 rounds.
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Then of course after all this banning we'll still have a problem. Yesterday, I checked the Australian Bureau of Statistics data on homicides in 2016. Despite the gun ban being in place for 20 years, fully 31% of homicides were committed with firearms.
The fact that law abiding citizens turn in firearms when they are banned while criminals do not explains much of that. It also explains why the violent crime rates in Australia have increased since 1996. For example, the rate of sexual assault has risen from 74 per 100,000 in 1996 to 100 per 100,000 in 2016 in Australia, compared to just 24 in the US, where the rate has been steadily decreasing.
The decreasing rate of sexual assault in the US is interesting when you consider that the fastest growing demographic for concealed carry permits is black women, followed closely by women and blacks in general. Just guessing here, but armed women may be harder to assault than unarmed women - or perhaps men just don't even try when the woman is packing.
Banning high capacity magazines isn't going to address the underlying issues that lead to shootings like this, it'll just lead to more and more people being disarmed and less able to defend themselves.
It wasn't just Bill Ruger.
Significant portions of GCA 1968 were brought to us and fully supported by our very own American gun companies. As an industry, they saw the GCA 68 importation restrictions as a way to reduce competition and improve their market share - and lobbied accordingly.
In the context of bump fire stocks I agree with you. I have no purpose for them, and they fill no real sporting purposes other than dumping ammo (inaccurately) at the range.
On the other hand....
I shot M14s and M1As in service rifle matches in the 1980s and switched to the M16 in the early1990s. I also built a flat top AR-15, heavy barrel varmint rifle in the same time frame - and at the time we were milling off A1 carry handles and attaching a weaver rail.
That made the AR-15 one of the most useful rifles I owned for "sporting purposes" - yet I constantly heard that the AR-15 had no "sporting purpose", by people who personally did not use them for sporting purposes.
In fact, the NRA sold the black rifle crowd down the river when they accepted the AWB in exchange for some guarantees on hunting access for their predominantly Elmer Fudd membership.
And that's the problem with deciding that something has no sporting purpose just because it doesn't trip your trigger (pun intended).
