Is the Slide fire going to be history?

[Drm50]

I am divided on this issue. On one hand I never want to give the
Anti Gun crowd an inch. On the other hand you have to look at
what's been going on with gun ownership. There is a new breed
of people that own guns. Some have bought guns for personal
protection, some for the preppers, but the ones that worry me
the most are the gamers who graduate into buying real guns.
Go on YouTube and you can view countless idiots doing all kind
of things a real gun person or Hunter would never do. People
at this IQ are scary without being mental. The general public
sees this stuff and it worries them. As in most "situations" if
you don't police yourself, it won't be long before someone is.
Because of this incident the suppressor issue will not be brought
up. Having nothing to do with the tragedy doesn't matter. There
are a lot of honest people that are afraid of guns because they
don't own any, there family never had guns, ect. These people
have no hidden agenda but are easily swayed by Anti Gun crowd.
I don't know how to react to this. My opinion is to outlaw such
devices as the bump stock and other devices to simulate full auto
fire. These devises are novelties and toys with no practical use.
There are other things on the market now that have no value as
to any practical purpose, just novelties and toys. When one of
these "things" end up connected to one of these tragedies it never fails to give Anti Gunners more ammo.

 

[Arik]

I am divided on this issue. On one hand I never want to give the
Anti Gun crowd an inch. On the other hand you have to look at
what's been going on with gun ownership. There is a new breed
of people that own guns. Some have bought guns for personal
protection, some for the preppers, but the ones that worry me
the most are the gamers who graduate into buying real guns.
Go on YouTube and you can view countless idiots doing all kind
of things a real gun person or Hunter would never do. People
at this IQ are scary without being mental. The general public
sees this stuff and it worries them. As in most "situations" if
you don't police yourself, it won't be long before someone is.
Because of this incident the suppressor issue will not be brought
up. Having nothing to do with the tragedy doesn't matter. There
are a lot of honest people that are afraid of guns because they
don't own any, there family never had guns, ect. These people
have no hidden agenda but are easily swayed by Anti Gun crowd.
I don't know how to react to this. My opinion is to outlaw such
devices as the bump stock and other devices to simulate full auto
fire. These devises are novelties and toys with no practical use.
There are other things on the market now that have no value as
to any practical purpose, just novelties and toys. When one of
these "things" end up connected to one of these tragedies it never fails to give Anti Gunners more ammo.

What do those gamer YouTube individuals have to do with a man in his 50s who killed 59 people for reasons yet unknown?

I agree I see no PRACTICAL use for it but I can also guarantee you that you own something I see no PRACTICAL use for

Where exactly is the connection?

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[jag312]

....Remember your pretty blued and Walnut hunting rifles are just long range sniper rifles capable of killing from miles away and chambered in calibers capable of bringing down an elephant! Those can kill several people with one bullet. What civilian needs that?....

In California the new definition of Assault Weapon is any semiauto rifle with a detachable magazine. That includes Winchester, Remington, Browning hunting rifles. Even a Winchester Model 1905 hunting rifle.

Some of the anti-gun cultists wave talked about banning telescopic sights on rifles. "A rifle with a telescopic sight is a sniper rifle, and nobody needs a sniper rifle."

Some have talked about banning lever action rifles. "Look at Chuck Connors. He fires that rifle like a machinegun. We need to ban these lever action machineguns."

I'm afraid that the tragedy in Las Vegas will be a turning point in gun rights. Just like the tragedies in the 60s lead to the 1968 Gun Control Act.

 

[ChattanoogaPhil]

This is the problem with gun owners.

Yes, too many gun owners have adopted the anti-gun mantra... No one needs...

 

[Warren Sear]

...I also have no problem limiting centerfire rifle mags to 10 and pistol mags to 10, 12 or 15

You are in agreement with the late Bill Ruger then.

 

[Arik]

And there ladies and gentlemen is our problem.

What does a 15 round mag do that a 30 can't. How long does it take to reload a different mag? Two seconds? One? Less? Only difference becomes owning two instead of one!

Bushmaster, if you're concerned about the rate of fire from a magazine you should really stick with muskets. 2-4 a min sounds reasonable? Or still too fast?

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[old tanker]

Agreed. Essentially, this bozo was engaging "area targets" rather than aiming at any specific individual. Note that only about 10% of his victims were killed out of more than 500 actually hit (not to make light of the horrors of this violent attack, just commenting on the differences between accurately aimed fire and massive numbers of rounds launched into groups of people).

It is unlikely anyone will say, or if anyone has even tried to determine, how many injuries were caused directly by bullets, and how many were a result of the stampede to escape? How much of the panic he caused can be attributed to just the sound of gunfire, akin to yelling "Fire" in crowded theater?

 

[bushmaster1313]

Senator Feinstein is introducing a Bill to ban Bump Fire and Trigger Cranks.

I am okay with this, but it should be combined with some pro-2A stuff like national concealed carry and allowing the shipment of handguns and ammo through the Post Office.

 

[HARDWARE]

i'd trade em for a supressor..

 

[Drm50]

What do those gamer YouTube individuals have to do with a man in his 50s who killed 59 people for reasons yet unknown?

I agree I see no PRACTICAL use for it but I can also guarantee you that you own something I see no PRACTICAL use for

Where exactly is the connection?

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If you read post there is no connection to Vegas. The point is
these idiots are seen by the public and are bad examples of
gun ownership. The subject is the banning of Bumpfire and
like accessories. Which leads to the kind of shooters who would
buy such things. Bingo, gamer types and kids. These type devices
have no practical purpose for any use. They are toys & novelties.
The public are the ones that need honest information, the Anti
Gun people are happy to spread misinformation. I think we need
to stand firm on 2nd adm. But use common sense.

 

[Dave Lively]

I am divided on this issue. On one hand I never want to give the
Anti Gun crowd an inch.

For about 3 decades I have been trying explain to people that "assault rifles" are not machine guns and cannot be easily converted to full-auto. I realize a slide stock is not true full-auto. But there is no way I will ever be able to convince anyone that heard the video that this guy did not successfully convert his gun to full auto. The effect was certainly the same.

The general public is so opposed to full auto guns being available a ban on sales of devices designed to simulate full auto is inevitable. Probably not with the current president and congress but Republicans are not going to be in power forever.

Rather than fight a losing battle I would rather see the Hearing Protection Act amended to include a ban on future sales of slide stocks and cranks. Most of the gun enthusiasts I know always oppose giving up anything but in this case we would be gaining more with suppressors than we would be giving up with Slide fire stocks. I doubt the NRA would support any sort of compromise but Trump does like to make deals.

 

[Arik]

If you read post there is no connection to Vegas. The point is
these idiots are seen by the public and are bad examples of
gun ownership. The subject is the banning of Bumpfire and
like accessories. Which leads to the kind of shooters who would
buy such things. Bingo, gamer types and kids. These type devices
have no practical purpose for any use. They are toys & novelties.
The public are the ones that need honest information, the Anti
Gun people are happy to spread misinformation. I think we need
to stand firm on 2nd adm. But use common sense.

What common sense? That these things are toys and gimmicks? I agree that they are but not with the common sense .... because like I said, what's rational to you is a gimmick to me. Case in point....the Shockwave shotgun, the Taurus Judge....all gimmicks. All toys....TO ME! Obviously not to others. I bet if you list all the firearms you have I'll find at least one gimmick toy. So by your own words it should be common sense that this is banned?

What about accessories such as scopes? Common sense tells us we don't need them.

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[Arik]

For about 3 decades I have been trying explain to people that "assault rifles" are not machine guns and cannot be easily converted to full-auto. I realize a slide stock is not true full-auto. But there is no way I will ever be able to convince anyone that heard the video that this guy did not successfully convert his gun to full auto. The effect was certainly the same.

The general public is so opposed to full auto guns being available a ban on sales of devices designed to simulate full auto is inevitable. Probably not with the current president and congress but Republicans are not going to be in power forever.

Rather than fight a losing battle I would rather see the Hearing Protection Act amended to include a ban on future sales of slide stocks and cranks. Most of the gun enthusiasts I know always oppose giving up anything but in this case we would be gaining more with suppressors than we would be giving up with Slide fire stocks. I doubt the NRA would support any sort of compromise but Trump does like to make deals.

We wouldn't gain anything. We get a suppressor which not everyone wants. I have no use for one. I have shot plenty of them, here's one of me shooting just this weekend.

Still....I have no interest in one. I'd rather pay $20 for hearing protection. Now, this doesn't mean I'm against people owning them. What I'm against is giving something up to own them. Because it's slide fire today, it's mag capacity next time. Eventually it's your suppressor and everything else. Remember 1968? 1994?

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[Arik]

Senator Feinstein is introducing a Bill to ban Bump Fire and Trigger Cranks.

I am okay with this, but it should be combined with some pro-2A stuff like national concealed carry and allowing the shipment of handguns and ammo through the Post Office.

So the simple act of shipping trumps mag capacity and accessories? In that case I'm all for it as long as there are no more semi auto rifles in rim or center fire. Reasonable common sense. Ship your single shot any which way you like!

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[codenamedave]

I'm by no means an expert, however, the Slide Fire is, to the best of my knowledge, a form of a "bump stock".

Perhaps you are more knowledgeable then me and can help educate me on what exactly the Slide Fire is, if not a "bump stock"?

If I am more knowledgeable than you, it's in the area of basic English skills, specifically reading comprehension.

All Slide Fires are bump fire stocks, not all bump fire stocks are Slide Fires.

Or did you really think that Jessie meant that only Slide Fires would be banned, and not any other bump fire stocks?

 

[Arik]

Here's how I look at this. You give up something to get something. Some apparently are willing to give up a lot more than others. Who needs that many rounds?

Well...... anyone remember the Dunblane Massacre in 1996? Not that long ago! The killer used a Browning HiPower and a S&W model 19!!! What happened then? England lost their rights to firearms! Now look at their knife acts! Their knives are treated almost like our handgun laws.

Look at the US gun control act of 1968. That started because of a surplus bolt action rifle. We keep letting things slide and soon enough the next one will be the loss of hunting rifles because some nut job used one to kill

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[moralem]

Senator Feinstein is introducing a Bill to ban Bump Fire and Trigger Cranks.

I am okay with this, but it should be combined with some pro-2A stuff like national concealed carry and allowing the shipment of handguns and ammo through the Post Office.

You really want to ship your guns through the post office....I can barely get my mail delivered to the right mail box and rarely do my packages ever escape unscathed.....not to mention the stolen items from our rural boxes the postal inspectors simply shrug at..........no thanks. I will stick to FedEx.

 

[BB57]

Could be prohibited in many states
Might even get done in by Congress

Don't have one and would be fine to see it go

I also have no problem limiting centerfire rifle mags to 10 and pistol mags to 10, 12 or 15

You do realize that this is pointless right? With a little practice you can reload a magazine fed rifle or pistol in not much more than a second.

So...once that becomes obvious and someone does a mass shooting with low capacity magazines, they'll be screaming to ban semi-auto rifles and pistols (if they don't get the Axe this time around.

The irony here is that I actually enjoy shooting semi-auto pistol qualification courses with a revolver. I drop a single point on the FBI Q course on stage 3 with the 8 rounds in 8 seconds at 7 yards as I have to do a reload. I can shoot it cleanly however with a 7 shot 686+.

So...once semi-autos are banned and someone does a mass shooting with a revolver, they'll ban speed loaders, and perhaps also "high capacity" revolvers that hold more than 6 rounds.

-----

Then of course after all this banning we'll still have a problem. Yesterday, I checked the Australian Bureau of Statistics data on homicides in 2016. Despite the gun ban being in place for 20 years, fully 31% of homicides were committed with firearms.

The fact that law abiding citizens turn in firearms when they are banned while criminals do not explains much of that. It also explains why the violent crime rates in Australia have increased since 1996. For example, the rate of sexual assault has risen from 74 per 100,000 in 1996 to 100 per 100,000 in 2016 in Australia, compared to just 24 in the US, where the rate has been steadily decreasing.

The decreasing rate of sexual assault in the US is interesting when you consider that the fastest growing demographic for concealed carry permits is black women, followed closely by women and blacks in general. Just guessing here, but armed women may be harder to assault than unarmed women - or perhaps men just don't even try when the woman is packing.

Banning high capacity magazines isn't going to address the underlying issues that lead to shootings like this, it'll just lead to more and more people being disarmed and less able to defend themselves.

 

[BB57]

You are in agreement with the late Bill Ruger then.

It wasn't just Bill Ruger.

Significant portions of GCA 1968 were brought to us and fully supported by our very own American gun companies. As an industry, they saw the GCA 68 importation restrictions as a way to reduce competition and improve their market share - and lobbied accordingly.

 

[BB57]

If you read post there is no connection to Vegas. The point is
these idiots are seen by the public and are bad examples of
gun ownership. The subject is the banning of Bumpfire and
like accessories. Which leads to the kind of shooters who would
buy such things. Bingo, gamer types and kids. These type devices
have no practical purpose for any use. They are toys & novelties.
The public are the ones that need honest information, the Anti
Gun people are happy to spread misinformation. I think we need
to stand firm on 2nd adm. But use common sense.

In the context of bump fire stocks I agree with you. I have no purpose for them, and they fill no real sporting purposes other than dumping ammo (inaccurately) at the range.

On the other hand....

I shot M14s and M1As in service rifle matches in the 1980s and switched to the M16 in the early1990s. I also built a flat top AR-15, heavy barrel varmint rifle in the same time frame - and at the time we were milling off A1 carry handles and attaching a weaver rail.

That made the AR-15 one of the most useful rifles I owned for "sporting purposes" - yet I constantly heard that the AR-15 had no "sporting purpose", by people who personally did not use them for sporting purposes.

In fact, the NRA sold the black rifle crowd down the river when they accepted the AWB in exchange for some guarantees on hunting access for their predominantly Elmer Fudd membership.

And that's the problem with deciding that something has no sporting purpose just because it doesn't trip your trigger (pun intended).