MOP gold monogram 38 Lemon squeezer stocks value

[Nicksterdemus]

What would be a rough value for a set of gold S&W monogram pearl stocks for the RB 38 Lemon squeezer? I know condition plays a role, yet these are solid w/maybe half the gold anyway. There's no mistaking them for silver. They seem to be in good shape. A couple of really small chips on the butt and small cracks around the monogram, but nothing large or long.

I was guesstamating a couple of hundred, yet I've nothing to base that on.

Thanks in advance.

 

[glowe]

38 S&W monogram pearl stocks don't come up for sale too often and do have value. These stocks will fit several 38 top-breaks, so there is also good demand. As for condition, those little chips and cracks can affect the value quite a bit. Collectors want perfection and that is where the highest price would be obtained. I think $200 is possible at auction, but if perfect, quite a bit more would be expected.

 

[Nicksterdemus]

Thanks Gary for your time, expertise and sharing. I'm not qualified to grade, but to me they appeared better than decent for the age. As par for the course one side exceeds the other and they're affixed to a shooter that's been gussied up at some point w/nickel bath from stem to stern. As a shooter it's value lies in the set of stocks.

Rather than start another thread I'll post a SN pic here of squeezer in question. I'd be entertained w/what others think that have looked at a few. My speculation is based w/o actual experience.

I see five numbers w/second & fourth being small/different style and/or buffed almost to oblivion. And/Or the first, third and fifth have been restruck before nickel and/or/maybe the die is a larger slightly different style.

Whilst always possible that the butt was used as a tack hammer it seems to suggest a lanyard or swivel of some type was employed some time before the last finish.

Maybe after buffing some of the numbers were enhanced, first/third/fifth positions, to maintain proper SN legibility.

Last, ne'er least, what numeral is the last number representing?

 

[glowe]

Chips on a pearl stock could be compared to chips on a collector plate or figurine. If visible, a chip on a plate or figurine could result in the piece being worth only half that of a pristine example.

It does appear that the butt had a lanyard ring and maybe the hole was filled with a threaded rod?? I would also guess that the ring installation would be post-manufacture. I would also guess that there is a missing serial number where the hole was. Maybe the serial number is 191X83?

Check the back of the cylinder and under the latch. There also should be a serial number under the latch stamped on the back of the barrel top latch frame.

 

[Nicksterdemus]

Thanks again sir for the insight. I don't possess the collective wisdom of the pistolero aficionado. As an accumulator my bar is set much lower. On the plus side if I'm burned it's only centinaia di dollari.

It does appear to be a threaded rod/cut bolt that's been ground and finished. Very plausible that a number was lost in accessorizing. The cylinder and latch six digits match more or less. The last two cylinder numbers are half-strikes or more than likely lower half buffed out of existence. Top halves could match the last two latch numbers, yet even then the twain cannot match the frame as no trey in sight.

As well, a small trigger stop has been tapped into the back of the trigger guard [pic MOP R]. So, I've a chopped up shiny .38 shooter that quite possibly could have been used at a local cowboy competition. It's a stab at explaining the tiny trigger stop except I think it should be about twice the diameter to withstand a lot of use.

In a somewhat flashy non-original BBQ wannabe status I speculate it might fetch one & half to two bills, sans pearls, in a Jay Scott/Ajax reasonable facsimile.

Is the .38 S&W top break an I-frame?

 

[Nicksterdemus]

Not to bump my own thread, yet could someone point me to link or provide me w/stamping on top of the barrel? I've noticed this barrel seems to have been cut and instead of a pinned sight someone has cut a groove and slapped in the front sight.

I see outside, front & back, of the two line name & pat'd dates a cross that is basically four triangles. The guy said 3" barrel & I figured it was really 3 1/2". Behind the improvised sight:

SS. U.S.A.
L 9, 1889.

Shouldn't there be "Smith & Wesson Springfield MA" to finish out top line and several patented dates on the second line w/April 9. 1889 being the last?

This hammerless is like peeling an onion and I keep finding layers that are making me cry.

ETA: Looking at two pics it appears the sight is a fifth model. The rib is almost flush w/top of the barrel and you barely see the angles on the front and back. Look at the insert on the fifth model. The front sight angles to a pedestal.

Maybe a 5" barrel of the fifth model. The integral sight was cut off flush w/small Dremel style cutting wheel or hacksaw. Then the barrel was lopped off at 3" w/homemade crown. Shallow angle drill bit was used to stagger holes and the cut-off wheel connected/cut the dots. Since the sight was cut off most of the pedestal base is now inside of the barrel.

Poor technique and tolerances make for a less than desirable fit. This gap was stuffed w/steel wool and the nickel held temporarily. After many years the steel wool oxidizes and combined w/barrel heating up expanding & contracting starts to flake exposing the poor craftsmanship.

Sounds plausible to me anyway.

 

[mmaher94087]

You're correct about the cut barrel; it should have Smith & Wesson Springfield, Mass. on the top rib. As for the Lanyard ring "plug".; take the stocks off (carefully) and see if the complete serial number is stamped on the left frame. If so, this ring was installed at the factory. If not; it was after market. It would make a nice carry piece but any collector value has been lost unless it is proven to belong to John Dillinger or Pretty Boy Floyd. Mike #283

 

[Nicksterdemus]

The complete serial number is indeed stamped on the left grip frame under the stocks. Was the lanyard similar to the model 1917?

Maybe some low level gangster owned it as, Chico el hombre gordo, No nose Tony the four corners enforcer or a poor riverboat gambler, One arm Louie the Mississippi dandy.

SN 1912XX

 

[mmaher94087]

"Was the lanyard similar to the model 1917?" Similar but not the same. The ring is smaller and the post running into the frame is threaded whereas the 1917 is larger and held in place by a pin and allowed to swivel in the frame. Mike #283

 

[Nicksterdemus]

Thanks for the information. I find the lanyard notion interesting as the .38 S&W didn't pack a whole lot of punch. However, if weight was a factor it would ride nicely enough w/o holster. Small. light and more versatile than a derringer as long as you had more than a vest pocket.

Snooping around it seems the S&W .38 hammerless of today is the 351-C. Right around 200'lb of ME, two more shots and a lanyard.