Old Police Rifles

[RABULL]

I have worked for 3 Police Departments and one Sheriff's Department in my career. When I started back in the mid-1970's in a City Police Department, our patrol cars carried Remington 870 shotguns and we had access to a Thompson SMG and an M-2 carbine. We later obtained an Uzi and an early l Colt AR-15 rifle.

The Sheriff's Department was back in the early 1980's and we carried only Remington M-870 shotguns and were not allowed to carry any rifles at all.

The second Police Department I worked at, when I got there, we had Winchester Model 94 .30-30 carbines and by the time I left 10 years later, we were carrying H & K MP-5/40 SMG and/or M-14 .308 rifles in the Patrol Cars.

My present Police Department, in the patrol cars, we double rack mount a Colt M-4 .223 carbine and Benelli M-1/M-4 14" Entry shotguns. We also have access to H & K MP-5/40 SMG and some M-14 rifles for special assignments.

I also have a personal owned Springfield M1A .308 Scout rifle that I sometimes carry and also have a personally owned Remington Model 700 BDL Varmint .223 Bolt Rifle with a 3X-9X Scope and an FN PBR .308 Bolt rifle with a Leupold 4.5X - 14X Scope for more accurate shooting.

 

[Gun-runner]

I remember in the early 1980s the Oklahoma Highway Patrol had Mini-14s with factory folding stocks carried upside down in metal brackets screwed to the drivers door. At the time there was news that they were one, of very few State Police agencies that had standard issue rifles in every car.

Obviously those Okies were smarter than the rest! +1

 

[greenmachine]

I'm no LEO, but I have a nice old police gun brought back from a hunting trip to Wyoming years ago. We stopped at a small gun shop in Sioux City and saw six model 64 carbines sitting on the rack, all in .30-30. Story was that the local police department had traded them in for six AR's. We brought all six of them home with us and I eventually ended up with the best of the lot - the stock is marked TRAFFIC-DEPT S.C. and also has what appears to be a catalog number. The others were carried in squad cars and were a little rough but in great mechanical condition.

 

[bobcat]

When I went throught the BP academy and during my time in, we had 870 shotguns & Remington slide action .308's. We did get some MP-5's the last couple of years I was in, however they couldn't be checked out with out the Chief's ok, so we just got to qualify with them once a year.

 

[ecam8000]

This may not fit here, but I own a Colt Lightning pump rifle in .44 (something) that says SFPD. I think the were used around 1900, but not carried in the squad cars.

 

[Iggy]

WHP issued 870s.
I carried an Armalite AR-180 squeezed down under the headrest on the seat of my patrol car, and a 300 H&H Magnum in the trunk.

A shot gun just don't have long enough legs for some things that go on in Wyoming

 

[HeloMt]

When I started with the Patrol we had a wide variety of issue long arms. Everyone got a Winchester 94 plus a shotgun which could have been one of the following: Winchester 97, Winchester 12, Winchester 1200 or a Remington 870. So much for standardization!. There were also Ruger M-77's in .308 at every district office.

Shotguns were all changed to the 870 in the late 80's, but we lost the Model 94's which were replaced by surplus M-14's (everybody like those a bunch). As of late, the agency dropped the M-14's and went to AR-15's, some mixed feelings about that, but so it goes.

As a side note, we also had in the armory a very cool Remington Model 8, 35 Remington, from the early days of the patrol. It had one of the St. Joesph Police supply 15 round stick magazines. Same thing you see in some of the old photos of the people who took down Bonnie and Clyde.

 

[Faulkner]

Here's a picture that a newspaper reporter took of me a couple of years ago. It was my day off when I got a call on my cell phone from dispatch that a on-duty officer was in pursuit of a armed suspect not far from my home and was asking for backup. With most of my gear always in my take home patrol car, I grabbed my duty belt and vest and headed out to help.

Later, as I was standing on the side of the road I got out my M1 carbine in M1A1 configuration. A newspaper reporter from the local paper came up to ask me a few questions about what was going on (none of which I would answer, I don't like talking to reporters), he then asked "what kind of new fangled assualt rifle do you have? I've never seen anything like that before." I told him it was a M1 carbine, it was designed over 60 years ago and used in WWII and the Korean War. Amazingly, he then asked, "will a gun that old still kill people?"

 

[TxShooter]

Faulkner, that pic seems familiar, maybe from GlockTalk. Are you the guy who outfitted his department with Israeli surplus M1s, fitted with M2 magazine catches to better handle the weight of the 30 round mags?

 

[Crazy K38]

will that gun still kill people.... my answer would have been no, that people now days are getting bulletproof skin

 

[Wickahoney]

It may be a northwest thing but we carried 870s at nearly every department I worked at.

All also carried at least one centerfire rifle and often 2. If it was 2 then it was almost always a semi/full auto and a scoped bolt gun.

ISP first M2s and then m16s (this is back when LEAA was pouring stuff in to LE)

OSP M16s.

WCSO M16 and a scoped Model 70 in 30-06

MCSO Winchester 94 carbine and a scoped Remington 700 in 300 Win Mag.

HCSO M16, scoped Remington 700 in 338 Win Mag.

Feds various M16s, HK91s, HK93s etc.

RWT

 

[Faulkner]

Faulkner, that pic seems familiar, maybe from GlockTalk. Are you the guy who outfitted his department with Israeli surplus M1s, fitted with M2 magazine catches to better handle the weight of the 30 round mags?

Yep, my department purchased 60 surplus M1 carbines almost 10 years ago. I spent several months reworking them for duty use and we got very good service out of them. Still have a dozen or so in service, the rest were offered for sell to the deputies recently.

 

[perpster]

Later, as I was standing on the side of the road I got out my M1 carbine in M1A1 configuration. A newspaper reporter from the local paper came up to ask me a few questions about what was going on (none of which I would answer, I don't like talking to reporters), he then asked "what kind of new fangled assualt rifle do you have? I've never seen anything like that before." I told him it was a M1 carbine, it was designed over 60 years ago and used in WWII and the Korean War. Amazingly, he then asked, "will a gun that old still kill people?"

It shakes my confidence in this nation that a reporter in the Ozarks would ask those questions and be so firearms ignorant. On either coast I could understand it, or in Minnesota, but in the Ozarks?!?

 

[TxShooter]

Wow. It's hard to believe that was 10 years ago. What kind of work did they need before being put into service?

 

[Faulkner]

It shakes my confidence in this nation that a reporter in the Ozarks would ask those questions and be so firearms ignorant. On either coast I could understand it, or in Minnesota, but in the Ozarks?!?

I said he was from the local paper, not sure if he was actually from the Ozarks.

Wow. It's hard to believe that was 10 years ago. What kind of work did they need before being put into service?

They were not really in all that bad a shape. I put new spring kits in all of them and cleaned up and refinished the stocks. Put a few of them in Choate's synthetic stocks. After I'd serviced three or four I'd take them to the range, sight them in and run 'em through a course of fire. Though most of them were well used, they were all serviceable.

We got very good service out of them and the performed well side by side with black rifles at the range. We did a lot of test comparisons at the range including ballistic vests testing, auto body and auto glass penetration, accuracy, and reliablity. We found that the .30 carbine round and the .223 had similar performance with ballistic vests and auto bodies, but the .30 carbine seemed to penetrate auto glass and windshields better. Reliablity was high with both the M1 carbine and the black rifles, and accuracy was pretty much equal out to 100 yards. Past 100 yards, the black rifles really outperformed the carbines.

When surplus ammo dried up for training, the cost of ammo is what finally pushed us to start retiring the carbines, but we got our money's worth out of them.

A couple of them were close to collector quality. I recall the sheriff picked out one that was almost all Rock-Ola and he restored it to original WWII USGI configuration and hung it in his office.

 

[Joe Kent]

Faulkner, what ammo did you carry on duty?

 

[Faulkner]

We carry Winchester jacketed soft hollow points. This bullet allows you to stand up and take notice of the .30 carbine round and really turns it into a very capable one shot stopper.

Fortunately, we've never had to use it on a human, but I've taken several whitetail deer, a number of hogs, and downed a few bovin with it to good effect.

 

[Mean Bone]

Late '70's. Small South Georgia town.

Found myself alone on a roadblock looking for several convicts who had commandeered a delivery van. All I had was an issued double barrel shotgun, my personal M-66 and a radio.

Next day I went to a local pawn shop and bought a new Ruger Mini-14. A 180 series with the wooden handguard. Unlike most Mini-14's I found this one to be quite accurate.

A bit later I sanded the stock down making it a small bit lighter and thinner. I used tobacco juice to restain it. Came out a bit lighter in color and the finish never was perfect. Always had a very slight tacky feel.

Later, either traded or sold it. Can't remember which.

 

[SG-688]

This is for Joe.

Rifles were rare in my area in 60's - 70's. City had a Thompson and the county had four Winchester 94's and a Reising locked up, never to be used.

I carried an AR-180 which, with the folding stock, rode nicely on the floor with the forend on the transmission tunnel.

Later, when a chief had qualms about .223, broke out an M-1 Carbine using Rem SP and Win JHP.

Never qualified with either; it never occurred to anybody.

 

[TxShooter]

Craig, have you got any tintypes of the Colt Paterson and musket they issued you right out of the academy?