Open Carry: I knew it would happen

[Faulkner]

The Arkansas General Assembly changed the wording on the firearms law in their last session, supposedly to clean up the existing wording around the vague "journey" provision. Instead, what ACT 746 seems to have inadvertently done, through a lot of folk’s interpretation, was to open up the state to open carry.

After reading the new changes I agree that it does now allow open carry even if that was not the original intent. Regardless, it's kind of a mess at the moment. Most prosecutors have said they will not prosecute on open carry without criminal intent. The state attorney general has said she supports open carry but has failed to submit an official opinion.

Law enforcement in the state has not received a lot of formal input on the subject because the issue is confusing and still in debate. No doubt the General Assembly will have to clear this up one way or the other in their next session in the spring of 2016. In the meantime, our department reads the law that without criminal intent open carry is legal.

Here's the problem, just like I figured, we have some folks that have started carrying openly, pushing the social boundaries, and carrying "just because it's my by-God right" and slinging their AR over their shoulder as they grocery shop at the Walmart Super Center, or strapping on a leather rig with matching hog leg and strutting around at the little league ball field even though they don't have any kids playing ball. I was with my family at a nice family restaurant not long ago when a couple of 20-something year old bubbas came in and sat at the table next to us. Both wearing fancy 1911's in open top holsters that weren't the least bit secured, I could have easily reached over and just yanked it out the holster and started blasting away without leaving my chair.

I'm a second amendment supporter, NRA member, hunter, collector, firearms instructor, and all around gun guy, but I cringe when I see people that ought not be allowed to breed or own pets as I see them strutting around town loaded for bear just because they can.

"Self-government won't work without self-discipline." Paul Harvey

Oh, and here's a link to the latest conflict on the open carry issue in our state. Unfortunately, I think the cops are in the wrong on this one, but it shows the level of confusion initiated by the vagueness of new law. This situation is unfortunate for the fellow that got detained, but it could be beneficial to the state if it goes to court and establishes precedent one way or the other.


BKPD Arrest Man For ? Well, Something. | The Arkansas Project

 

[JAFO]

In benton county, the sheriff has made it clear that you are good unless you do something stupid. That being said, I think the rules need to be straightened up in Little Rock so that we dont have more incidents.

 

[Old cop]

Unfortunately some open carry folks do not make the best representatives for the Second Amendment. They like to push things, confront LEOs when the cops have better things to do. They, some and not all, strut around and make everyone around them uncomfortable. These idiots are all over the internet. It does not happen often where I am but when it does the individual is normally low key and everyone ignores them.

 

[KSDeputy]

I happen to agree with you. I think open carry should be reserved for peace officers displaying a badge. Otherwise, it scares citizens. Even though we have constitutional carry in KS, I support the law though I do not agree with that part of it.

 

[shawn mccarver]

Unfortunately, some folks exercise their gun rights with the same level of maturity and good sense as they do their alcohol consumption. Having a pint after work or a drink with dinner is not the same as being a drunken moron who has no manners or good sense. Either type (gun-stupid or alcohol-stupid) is intolerable, and it ruins it for the rest of us. Shame on such boorish behavior, and the people who perpetrate it.

Personally, I favor the option of being able to open carry, but I have never exercised it apart from at the range. There are many good reasons why carrying openly is a poor idea from a "tactical" standpoint.

 

[American1776]

I open carry as a matter of normal daily activity. That said, there are better and worse ways of going about OC, just like there are better and worse ways of concealed carrying.

Over the years, I've learned that 90 percent of people are preoccupied with themselves to even notice the pistol on my belt. The 10 percent who do notice, many are very supportive. I've never had anyone panic, and the LEOs who have seen me have never even approached me.

If you do it right, it's not a problem.

 

[okiegtrider]

Shortly there will be someone along to ask a couple of you what is wrong with you? And then tell you that your opinions give fodder to the, "antis", and how dare you write things like that on this board.

In before the lockdown.

 

[69camfrk]

I rarely open carry even though it is fully within my rights to do so. I think however it offers no tactical advantage. So....I conceal. I realize the firearm(s) I carry may print on my shirt, but the way I hold myself, I doubt most ever notice. Generally I think Leo's are grateful for CCW types. Most all of us have had military and other types of formal training, shoot competitively, etc. Unless more good guys carry, we are doomed to the same old thing where criminals pick soft targets and try to perpetuate a crime on them. It's high time they realize that the next crime they try, may be their last.

 

[Bob R]

I think open carry should be reserved for peace officers displaying a badge. Otherwise, it scares citizens.

I am sure you have tons of evidence to support that statement. I OC 99% of the time and have yet to notice anyone trembling in the corner or running away in fear. Maybe those people in KS are a little more high strung that the ones in E. WA.

There are many good reasons why carrying openly is a poor idea from a "tactical" standpoint.

I keep hearing that yet the evidence seems to point the pother way if one takes the time to really research the subject of OC and crime deterrence vs being shot because you are OC.

If you do it right, it's not a problem.

Like most things in life. It is the few that the media latches onto because they carry long guns, pose in Starbucks and other generally unacceptable social behavior with guns that gets everyone that decides to OC painted with the same brush as they do. It just isn't like that in a lot of places. Our local fair is coming up soon and I will be OCing there on Military, Fire and Police day as I have for the last 14 years. I usually stop by and talk to the county Sheriff during this trip, he doesn't see an issue with OCing.

bob

 

[ladder13]

So what LAW did he break?

 

[John R]

If people keep pushing the envelope there will be laws passed to stop it.
These guy's on U-Tube will wreck it for us all sooner or later.

 

[dougb1946]

MN has "carry", open or concealed. Not a lot of problems because of it.
5% of the population has a CCW, but you rarely see a gun flashing around. I am assuming it's because we are polite, don't like to brag, and prefer not to scratch up a good pistol grip. Had a few instances when the shall issue edict was passed, but now you just don't hear anything.
And the streets did not run blood.

 

[kbm6893]

Yesterday, I was pumping gas at the gas station and some guy gets out of his car to pump. He's wearing some HUGE Glock, at least a .45. Maybe a 10MM. His license plate read "OPN CRRY".

To those who champion these idiots, I hope you'll be happy when they pass a law to make it illegal. The You Tube buffoons. The "Crusaders" who look to make a statement. They own guns so I get lupmed in with them. They don't speak for me or represent me. Walking around a little league ballfield with displayed weapons. What idiots.

 

[kbm6893]

So what LAW did he break?

There's no law against pogo sticking into church while wearing a clown suit, either. Doesn't mean I'm gonna do it.

 

[Smoke]

Did I click the wrong link and end up on the Mommies Demanding Attention Webpage by mistake?

There are so many facets to this issue it's hard to address them all in one post. I personally choose not to open carry but support the rights of those who choose to do so.

I don't think it makes other people nervous because most of the time they don't even seem aware of it. I know this doesn't count as data but every time I point out an open carrier to my wife she isn't even aware until I do.

Sure there are idiots that open carry and I fully support taking their right to do so based on their specific behavior if they do something stupid while open carrying but I don't want to see the majority punished for the actions of a few.

Does open carry make you a target? Sure it does sometimes but sometimes just being there makes you a target.

All in all unless you can show me statistically significant numbers of open carriers being robbed for their guns or causing legitimate public disturbances I'm going to come down on the side of personal freedom

 

[Bob R]

Yesterday, I was pumping gas at the gas station and some guy gets out of his car to pump. He's wearing some HUGE Glock, at least a .45. Maybe a 10MM. His license plate read "OPN CRRY".

Sounds like someone who could easily be a member here, or any other law abiding gun owning citizen. He has just decided to exercise his rights the way he sees fit. I don't see a problem with that.

As far as the 'huge Glock", so what, I OC and CC a full size 1911 in 10mm. I like it, spent a ton of money to ensure it works and was built to my specificaions. Am I supposed to carry some "little" gun?

If his lifestyle and exercising of his rights is such that he ends up carrying somewhere that is legal, yet may offend you or cause him to call him an idiot maybe you need to look inward at your conviction of certain rights.

As far as being lumped in, hell I bet you do that with other groups if you think about it. I know I do, especially Californians that move into the area. I know they aren't all gun grabbing liberals looking to raise the price of real estate here but it sure is easy to paint them all with the same brush. Actually some of them are quite the freedom loving citizens who saw how dismal the outlook was in CA so they moved away to a more free state. Some of them.

bob

 

[caleb4387]

I open carry cause it's fits my needs better or I like when someone recognizes I'm carrying model 13. I don't do it for attention or to rile people up. How they feel is their choice. Ohio is very open carry friendly and people just need to get over it.

 

[cmort666]

• If open carry isn't legal, DON'T.
• If it's legal and you want to, DO.
• If it's legal and you don't want to, DON'T.
• If it's legal and somebody else wants to, LEAVE THEM ALONE.

That doesn't seem all that complicated...

 

[cmort666]

Yesterday, I was pumping gas at the gas station and some guy gets out of his car to pump. He's wearing some HUGE Glock, at least a .45.

HOW "HUGE"? 60cm? Was his "car" a RAIL car? Did he have a regiment of Wehrmacht artillerymen supporting him? Did he say he was on his way to Sevastopol?

 

[Smoke]

I was in line behind a guy open carrying a Shield at WalMart Thursday. We chatted a little. I asked him where he got it, he named a local pawn shop (Stop, Drop and Shop) that I've been meaning to check out and I asked him if he'd ever been to Family Firearms Sales and he said yes and that was the end of the conversation.

Pretty much a nonevent