Question for the Colt AR guys

SAFireman

SAFireman

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Ok, A local listing has a Colt Commando 11.5" Pistol for sale.

From previous knowledge, I was under the impression that the Commando series was SBR.

The seller's photos show a CARBINE marked lower and no model #. It has what I believe to be a 'legal' brace mounted.

Colt's serial lookup brought zero results.

A Colt AR pistol looks neat, but is this example LEGAL?

Looks like a guy could get crossways with that combination.

What do y'all think?
 
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I think those laws are so mixed up and convoluted that no one knows.

I like stuff with the Hartford Horsie on it. I’d buy it and be guarded as to whom I showed it.
 
I did some searching and couldn't find a Commando pistol. I did find SBR's that require a tax stamp. If the receiver is stamped "Carbine", I seriously doubt it was made as a pistol.

It's illegal to convert a rifle into a pistol. You can convert one into a SBR with the proper tax stamp. It is currently legal to put a pistol brace on a rifle or SBR, but it's still classified as a rifle or SBR.

I also found lot's of 11.5" uppers and barrels for sale. Based on your description, I wouldn't touch that gun with a 10' pole.
 
11.5” barrel ok on a pistol lower with or without a brace, no bueno on a rifle lower unless it is a SBR, brace or no brace. Rifle cannot be a pistol, pistol can be a rifle. Lots of people out there doing things with AR uppers and lowers that they really shouldn’t be doing.

If the price is right buy it , take the upper off the lower, buy a pistol lower, put that together with the 11.5” upper. Buy a rifle upper, put that together with the rifle lower, that is how you get multiple AR’s

I don’t believe that Colt ever made 5.56 AR pistols so what ever that is , is something put together. Very slim possibility that it is an actual Commando that some how worked its way into the civilian market and is now being called a pistol. There were and still are a lot of Colt Commando uppers that are on the market that some one could buy and put together with a lower, just needs to be a pistol lower and not a rifle lower. When I buy lowers to make pistols the 4473 states that it is a pistol, not a rifle. Really impossible to tell with used AR’s that are parts guns what they started out as, plug and play, they are like legos.
 
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IMHO the entire concept of (over-)regulating a so-called "sbr" needs to be dumped, especially in light of the atf's pitiful history of gross regulatory and administrative incompetence...

Corrupt Bureaucrapts Gone Wild!

Cheers!
 
I'm going to side with those above who are of the opinion that tne lower receiver likely began life as a rifle or carbine. As such, I'm pretty sure a rifle lower receiver can't be legally converted into a pistol; only an SBR with proper paperwork.

That said, is there any chance that tne lower receiver is an 80% build onto which someone has engraved a Colt "look alike" logo and number?
 
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Buy it. (If it’s cheap) Put a 16 inch barrel on it, and be done with it.

If you could post a pic of the lower reciever, I could probably tell you for sure whether it is a genuine Colt.

This is a real Colt. The carrier group will have a C stamped on it. The bolt will have MP stamped on it.
 

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Do not buy it. Unless you can confirm that either...

a) it's an NFA stamped SBR, or...

b) it's a factory shipped pistol lower (highly unlikely from Colt), then...

...if you buy it you're in possession of an unregistered SBR; even if you separate the upper and the lower, it can still constitute constructive intent.

Way too many nice AR pistols out there without potentially felonious question marks attached to them -- get one of those.
 
If it were an NFA stamped legal lower would it not be engraved?
 
SAFireman said:
Ok, A local listing has a Colt Commando 11.5" Pistol for sale.

From previous knowledge, I was under the impression that the Commando series was SBR.

The seller's photos show a CARBINE marked lower and no model #. It has what I believe to be a 'legal' brace mounted.

Colt's serial lookup brought zero results.

A Colt AR pistol looks neat, but is this example LEGAL?

Looks like a guy could get crossways with that combination.

What do y'all think?
Click to expand...
Yes colt makes pistol AR’s. But if you have doubts do a transfer at an FFL and you’re good.
 
If purchased as a factory stripped lower it can be built as a pistol. Stripped lowers aren’t anything until built unless someone does you dirty on the 4473. If you buy the stripped lower and plan to build a pistol have you dealer call it a pistol on the form. If it’s built as a rifle, it’s always a rifle. If it’s built as a pistol, it can be either…
 
SAFireman Unless you feel having the name COLT on some variation of a short barreled AR or colt commando is special you could start off by buying a AR15 upper and lower receiver and assemble your own ! Or shop at PSA where a complete AR15 lower can be bought for under 200 bucks . Uppers complete from 380 or slightly less .

The down side of the SBR to me is dealing with the ATF for the offical OK to own one and you need new paper work every time you plan to leave the state with the dates too !

A AR15 upper and lower receivers is just one more of the millions of AR's out there be it a carbine , rifle or pistol . The Upper and parts for it can be shipped to your home .Your home assembled AR can be built to higher specs than most factory assembled units . Colt being one of those at least for me .

You can build a AR in any number of cartridges also . I built a 9mm version using a AR15 upper and lower and a stoner colt/uzi mag adaptor but I also have a Ar15 upper that takes only several minutes to convert it from 9mm to a 5.56 upper .
 
Too murky for me, let someone else deal with the red tape.

I'm more than happy to buy an Armalite pistol for the same money.

PS - the lower looks like all of the other Rampant ponies that I have seen. I'm far from an expert, but I'll take one that is 100%, no questions, legal.

Thanks guys!

If anyone wants to have a look, it is on Texas Gun Trader in the San Antonio region.
 
I saw a Colt Commando style upper at a gun show in NC last week. It would be legally put on either a pistol receiver using a pistol brace, or on a rifle receiver it it is registered as an SBR.

It’s a little different if it were on a rifle receiver and not SBR’d.


The logic that a pistol can be converted into a rifle, but a rifle cannot be converted into a pistol is based on the greater federal restrictions on purchasing a hand gun.

The idea is that if you have to be 21 to buy a handgun, or if you are old enough to buy a handgun but can’t buy one across state lines without having it shipped to an FFL in your home state, allowing someone to buy a “rifle” and then take it home and convert it to a pistol should be illegal.

To an extent there’s logic in that, except of course if you are 21 or over and can legally buy a handgun in your state without any special purchase permit or registration requirements.

At that point it’s a distinction without a difference.

Except of course attorneys, Federal regulators and law enforcement officers are all generally going to consider the worst possible case and make assumptions and interpretations based on that worst case scenario, rather than looking for an actual harm or actual evidence you committed a crime that violates the original intent of the law, beyond just a mere interpretation of a statutory offense of possession when there isn’t actually a harm involved.

——


I agree the whole SBR thing is an old over from the highway gangsters of the 1930s and SBRs should be removed from the NFA, along with suppressors.

SBRs are not used in crimes to any significant degree as they are still not very concealable. Neither are suppressors and the beneficial, legitimate uses far outweigh the largely theoretical criminal uses.
 
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