Ruger REALLY sucks.
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I read the entire thread and didn't see this mentioned - that said, someone else may have already stated this: Ruger's reticence to install a conversion cylinder on a non-conversion serial-numbered revolver is an ATF-related restriction. They reported such and such revolver to ATF as, say, a .45LC back when they produced and shipped it. If they install an ACP conversion cylinder, ATF will have them on a technicality. They have chosen not to put themselves, and their license, at risk. I bought my ACP cylinder off of fleaBay, it fits and works perfectly, and didn't cost me nearly as much as Ruger would have charged.
So you're not worried about violating the ATF restriction, since you bought a LC but now own an ACP?
Not at all - I didn't manufacture the Ruger, and report it to ATF - Ruger did ... 
I was only trying to add some clarification, based on my foggy memory, to this thread. The ACP cylinder is not stored with the revolver, and not currently installed... 
This has been discussed over on Ruger Forum; I will try to find the link and post it. And, Ruger sells conversion kits for the (I think) LC9 or LC380 to convert it to one caliber or the other. So, based on that, it sounds like the customer has legal authority, in Ruger's eyes, to convert his Ruger as he or she may see fit.
I was only trying to add some clarification, based on my foggy memory, to this thread. The ACP cylinder is not stored with the revolver, and not currently installed... This has been discussed over on Ruger Forum; I will try to find the link and post it. And, Ruger sells conversion kits for the (I think) LC9 or LC380 to convert it to one caliber or the other. So, based on that, it sounds like the customer has legal authority, in Ruger's eyes, to convert his Ruger as he or she may see fit.
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Not at all - I didn't manufacture the Ruger, and report it to ATF - Ruger did ...
This has been discussed over on Ruger Forum; I will try to find the link and post it. And, Ruger sells conversion kits for the (I think) LC9 or LC380 to convert it to one caliber or the other. So, based on that, it sounds like the customer has legal authority, in Ruger's eyes, to convert his Ruger as he or she may see fit.
My point is that Ruger can legally do the same thing you did, but they choose not to. It's like buying a second cylinder for your .38 S&W Victory and reaming it out to .38 S&W SPL. Smith could legally do that, but they don't . . .
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scooter123
Member
I have a much longer history here and agree with you 100%. Also spent time as a Journeyman Machinist before I became a Mechanical Engineer.
As for why Ruger isn't interested on making a cylinder for an Old Vaquero, I suspect it's because that cylinder would have to be made from scratch using bar stock. At a guess with all the setup and fixturing that would have to be done that is probably about 3000 dollars or more in setup costs. Add in the finishing operations and you are probably looking at a cost to the customer in excess of 4000 dollars. I would suggest if Serger really wants this cylinder enough he call Ruger and offer to send them a check for 5000 dollars for this one cylinder, maybe then the answer would be yes.
The setup cost's for a one off item, was one of my first thoughts. Very expensive, when they can't recoup the cost with mass production. Reminds me of when a lady brought in a vintage looking cabinet door hinge to the machine shop. They told her, that realistically, it would cost $10,000 to duplicate this one item. Sell tens of thousands of them, and I suppose it would have been less than ten bucks.
Of course, some dedicated machinist might take on a project as a labor of love, but a company can't stay in business that way.
45/45ACP....Who could not like this?
Got one just like it. I put Goodyears on it, as they fit my hand better. Ugly though.....
OP
Your cost suppositions would be true except Ruger still makes and replaces Blackhawk Cylinders in 45ACP and the Old Vaquero is a fixed sight Blackhawk.
But since this tempest in the tea cup has gone on, 2 Gentlemen, both out of Arizona have contacted me. One was gracious enough to offer to sell me his spare cylinder. It was for a Lipsey revolver made on the Medium frame the New Vaquero is made on. Unfortunately it is too small.I sent him this information but his mailbox is full and he won't get mail until he removes some contents.
The second Gentleman told me to check out Gary Reeders site. It turns out Mr. Reeder will install 45ACP cylinders on 45Colt Rugers for $250.00. I budgeted $175.00 on this project and his cost is reasonable. So I think tomorrow I'll call him and see what his lead time is. I know he's good so I suspect his lead time is easily 6 months.
Thanks for all your input. I was enlightened.
bushmaster1313
Member
My day is complete and I go to bed a better person than when I awoke
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Bingo! Though others have done it. S&W used to fit .22 LR cylinders on Model 48's, but that was back in the day when things were perhaps a bit more casual.
All of the viable solutions that have surfaced on this thread, whether buying a cylinder and grinding/stoning it to fit oneself to sending an entire frame and action out to a one man shop in Arizona are just the type of operations that would be categorized under "custom work". There are many reasons why a full production type manufacturer like Ruger would have no interest in going there.
It looks like the OP has found a solution for his cylinder wishes. Good luck and good shooting.
It looks like the OP has found a solution for his cylinder wishes. Good luck and good shooting.
rog8732
US Veteran
Sir ! I have never in my life beat a dead horse because of it's grammar skills, atrocious or otherwise !
I might add, if you mistook an attempt at outright criticism for sarcasm, I can clearly see why your diligent effort at making sure we adhere to the "eighteen rules of grammar", could induce a migraine.
I expect the medical profession will be pounding on your door, since this must be the break-through they have needed to determine the here-to-fore unknown cause of migraines.
Don't forget to give me partial credit for the discovery.
Make room Louis Pasteur and Jonas Salk, you got some company coming.
Just for clarification, I asked Ruger about getting a .45 ACP cylinder fitted for my7 1/2" .45 Colt Blackhawk, like my 4 5/8" convertible Blackhawk in .45 Colt/.45 ACP.
There are two issues involved:
1. Whether they have ever produced the configuration that will result from adding the cylinder, and
2. When it fits into their normal production schedule.
In my case, Ruger's response was "Absolutely, we'll be happy to supply and fit a cylinder to your revolver". They explained they'll do that as long as it results in a configuration that Ruger has sold in the past. In other words they don't do any custom work, but they'll happily take what you have and add a cylinder to make it a convertible - IF - they've ever produced a convertible in that configuration. If they have not produced that configuration in the past, they will not fit another cylinder to it, as that falls under their definition of custom work.
Ruger also does this work in the course of their normal production of the revolver, to avoid having to set up tooling or processes for a one off project - which is also how they keep the cost very low.
In my case, they were not doing another run of Blackhawks for about 4 months, so they put my name on the list and in about 4 months they contacted me with the RMA to send it in to them for the work.
There are two issues involved:
1. Whether they have ever produced the configuration that will result from adding the cylinder, and
2. When it fits into their normal production schedule.
In my case, Ruger's response was "Absolutely, we'll be happy to supply and fit a cylinder to your revolver". They explained they'll do that as long as it results in a configuration that Ruger has sold in the past. In other words they don't do any custom work, but they'll happily take what you have and add a cylinder to make it a convertible - IF - they've ever produced a convertible in that configuration. If they have not produced that configuration in the past, they will not fit another cylinder to it, as that falls under their definition of custom work.
Ruger also does this work in the course of their normal production of the revolver, to avoid having to set up tooling or processes for a one off project - which is also how they keep the cost very low.
In my case, they were not doing another run of Blackhawks for about 4 months, so they put my name on the list and in about 4 months they contacted me with the RMA to send it in to them for the work.
Protected One
Member
Originally Posted by vortex360
"Why beat a dead horse with such atrocious grammar skills?"
tee hee
"Why beat a dead horse with such atrocious grammar skills?"
tee hee
cowboy4evr
Member
I'm scratching my head wondering why go to 45acp ? It just complicates things . You have to use moon clips and that only adds difficulty to the situation . They can be difficult to use , easily bent and rendered useless.
To obtain 45acp ballistics with the 45 Lc is very easily done , down to using a 230gr round nose bullet @ approx 800 fps . I just don't understand the reasoning behind the conversion . To each -- his own !
I have an old model vaquero in 45LC , traded for it brand new . I checked the cylinder throats and slugged the bore , a perfect match . There was NO barrel to frame choke either .
I had shot it some when I saw the guy I got it from . I told him I was really upset with the gun . He asked me why ? I told him , " whats a guy supposed do with a gun that shoots better than he does " ? We then had a good laugh , I bought the coffee .
I have owned about a half dozen Rugers , still have a couple and I'm a " devout " Smith & Wesson guy . Rugers are fine firearms.
To obtain 45acp ballistics with the 45 Lc is very easily done , down to using a 230gr round nose bullet @ approx 800 fps . I just don't understand the reasoning behind the conversion . To each -- his own !
I have an old model vaquero in 45LC , traded for it brand new . I checked the cylinder throats and slugged the bore , a perfect match . There was NO barrel to frame choke either .
I had shot it some when I saw the guy I got it from . I told him I was really upset with the gun . He asked me why ? I told him , " whats a guy supposed do with a gun that shoots better than he does " ? We then had a good laugh , I bought the coffee .
I have owned about a half dozen Rugers , still have a couple and I'm a " devout " Smith & Wesson guy . Rugers are fine firearms.
rog8732
US Veteran
cowboy4evr, you don't have to use moon clips in single action revolvers set up for 45 a c p.
The cylinder charge holes are bored so the 45 a c p head-spaces on the case mouth, same as in a 1911 barrel.
The cylinder charge holes are bored so the 45 a c p head-spaces on the case mouth, same as in a 1911 barrel.
I love it when people rant, get totally refuted, then rant some more.
Adds so much more credibility to their next question.
Adds so much more credibility to their next question.
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