"Safe" Apartment Ammunition

[S&W360Talo357]

Trying to figure out what the best ammo to use for apartment defense is for my .357/38 and .45lc revolvers. I've been looking at prefragmented and am pretty impressed with the Glaser Safety Slug (Silver tip). I believe the air marshals used them in the past and supposedly they won't shoot through an airplane fuselage or overpenetrate through an assailants head. I believe they now use .357s with hallowpoints. Magsafe also makes prefragmented ammo.

My main concern is shooting through 4-5 layers of drywall or worst case through two front doors . The walls in my apartment are relatively thick compared to other ones I have lived in. I'm also concerned with having not enough penetration if I happen to hit an attacker in the arm (i.e. Miami Shootout).

Do you believe Glasers are an adequate/"safe" round? Anyone know of any sites that have tests using drywall with different rounds?

 

[off road]

Looks like overpenetration of hollow points may be the norm....rather than the exception in the real world: http://www.brassfetcher.com/40S&W JHP performance against Bone Simulant and Ballistic Gelatin.pdf

Given that, something that you know will never overpenetrate, is a refreshing change! As a civilian, I'm not going to be engaging in a running gunfight around vehicles, like a LEO might. So, everywhere (not just at home!) the primary threat is humans, I load Glaser Silvers. When the threat is some animal + humans, then I will load hollow points or hardcast in cat/bear country.

If you do a search, you will find some pros and cons about Glasers. I use to work for the medical examiner of a large populous county. I feel that the FBI standards for penetration, are way off for civilians (who aren't going to be shooing up perps in vehicles). Personally, I will choose Glasers, unless there is a shotgun in my hand!

 

[The Big D]

In all seriousness, is there a particular reason you think bad guys would choose your apartment over the others in your building to invade/attack? Are your neighbors similarly worried?

Be safe.

 

[Kanewpadle]

In all seriousness, is there a particular reason you think bad guys would choose your apartment over the others in your building to invade/attack? Are your neighbors similarly worried?

Be safe.

In all seriousness, maybe the man wants to make a responsible decision. Do you have a crystal ball? Can we borrow it.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Trying to figure out what the best ammo to use for apartment defense is for my .357/38 and .45lc revolvers. I've been looking at prefragmented and am pretty impressed with the Glaser Safety Slug (Silver tip). I believe the air marshals used them in the past and supposedly they won't shoot through an airplane fuselage or overpenetrate through an assailants head. I believe they now use .357s with hallowpoints. Magsafe also makes prefragmented ammo.

My main concern is shooting through 4-5 layers of drywall or worst case through two front doors . The walls in my apartment are relatively thick compared to other ones I have lived in. I'm also concerned with having not enough penetration if I happen to hit an attacker in the arm (i.e. Miami Shootout).

Do you believe Glasers are an adequate/"safe" round? Anyone know of any sites that have tests using drywall with different rounds?

I wouldn't carry Glaser or Magsafe on the street, but they are a good option for apartment use. Also look into Corbon Powrball and Federal EFMJ.

 

[The Big D]

In all seriousness, I think most home invaders/attackers don't consider dwellings where they have to run the steps or take an elevator...whilst passing other apartments...to and fro their dastardly deeds.

Be safe.

PS: How do you know the OP is a "man." Can I borrow your crystal ball?

PPS:

I've lived in apartments; had the same ammo in my gun as I did whilst on duty/going about my business. Doubt that few (if anyone) anyone "reloads" upon arriving home. I surely did not.

In all seriousness, maybe the man wants to make a responsible decision. Do you have a crystal ball? Can we borrow it.

 

[S&W360Talo357]

In all seriousness, is there a particular reason you think bad guys would choose your apartment over the others in your building to invade/attack? Are your neighbors similarly worried?

Be safe.

Look at the crime statistics for apartments around the University of Central Florida. I know a ridiculous amount of people that have been robbed/injured/killed, and friend's neighbors and friend's friends

Go here: http://www.orlandosentinel2.com/data/crime/. Under the "All Zips" section select 32826 - UCF area.

Even if the crime rate wasn't so high around here I'd still have a firearm for the worst case scenario because I have a right to. Better safe than sorry...

Thank you for the help!!!!

 

[dunndealin]

I am living with my mom and sister right now and besides my night stand pistol, my main HD gun is an 870 20gauge(so the girlfriend can shoot it with confidence) it is stoked with 3" #2 heavy Turkey loads specifically for the over penetration factor...
I shot this stuff through 2 sheets of 5/8" Drywall with 3.5" air gap inbetween(2"x4" to act as internal wall of house) from 15feet, I hung a 3'x4' poster on the other side roughly 5-7 feet past the make shift wall and when i shot the wall none of the pellets penetrated the poster on the other side. i did this with 5 shots in 5 areas of the dry wall and the results were all the same. I did the same thing with 2-3/4" OObuckshot and it blew the poster to smitherines... By no means was this a scientific test but i am satisifed with the fact that if i have to shoot at someone in my house the #2 Turkey load is a better choice "for me"... At 10-20ft this stuff is nasty!

With that said i refuse to shoot shot ammo or fragmenting ammo out of my handguns for defense because i am just not convinced and that stuff is stupid expensive!

 

[S&W360Talo357]

I am living with my mom and sister right now and besides my night stand pistol, my main HD gun is an 870 20gauge(so the girlfriend can shoot it with confidence) it is stoked with 3" #2 heavy Turkey loads specifically for the over penetration factor...
I shot this stuff through 2 sheets of 5/8" Drywall with 3.5" air gap inbetween(2"x4" to act as internal wall of house) from 15feet, I hung a 3'x4' poster on the other side roughly 5-7 feet past the make shift wall and when i shot the wall none of the pellets penetrated the poster on the other side. i did this with 5 shots in 5 areas of the dry wall and the results were all the same. I did the same thing with 2-3/4" OObuckshot and it blew the poster to smitherines... By no means was this a scientific test but i am satisifed with the fact that if i have to shoot at someone in my house the #2 Turkey load is a better choice "for me"... At 10-20ft this stuff is nasty!

With that said i refuse to shoot shot ammo or fragmenting ammo out of my handguns for defense because i am just not convinced and that stuff is stupid expensive!

First on my list of next gun to get. I have heard the same thing about 20 gauge with bird shot (some people say with 12 gauge also, but I've read about an incident where a neighbor shot through his/her wall with birdshot (not sure what #) and injured his neighbor on the other side, 12 gauge. I remember seeing something on TV when I was younger that talked about a case where someone shot a guy in a store with 12gauge (i think) birdshot and killed him.

 

[Kanewpadle]

In all seriousness, I think most home invaders/attackers don't consider dwellings where they have to run the steps or take an elevator...whilst passing other apartments...to and fro their dastardly deeds.

Be safe.

PS: How do you know the OP is a "man." Can I borrow your crystal ball?

PPS:

I've lived in apartments; had the same ammo in my gun as I did whilst on duty/going about my business. Doubt that few (if anyone) anyone "reloads" upon arriving home. I surely did not.

You never know big D. I don't plan around statistics or what I "think" may or may not happen.

To survive, one must be prepared and aware at all times. Adaptability increases survivability.

 

[Kanewpadle]

First on my list of next gun to get. I have heard the same thing about 20 gauge with bird shot (some people say with 12 gauge also, but I've read about an incident where a neighbor shot through his/her wall with birdshot (not sure what #) and injured his neighbor on the other side, 12 gauge. I remember seeing something on TV when I was younger that talked about a case where someone shot a guy in a store with 12gauge (i think) birdshot and killed him.

I'm no expert on shot guns. But people I know and trust would never use bird shot on people.

What ever you choose to use in your apartment, have a plan. Know where your fields of fire should be. Know where your solid backstops are if any.

The key to home security is to not be caught by surprise. Secure your home with additional locks or other items to give yourself time to prepare.

For the time being, I also live in an apartment. The front door is down the hallway from the bedroom. They have to come down the hall to reach me. At the other end of the hall is a fireplace. Perfect backstop for me.

 

[The Big D]

Truer words have never been spoken, Kanewpadle.

I am just a bit frustrated (not speaking of the OP, you, or anyone else in particular here) when folks consider special needs for trail guns, backyard guns, "people" ammo, animal ammo, car guns, truck guns, backup guns, and so on and so forth.

I was on the clock in 46 states and that work took me some places I wouldn't have gone had they not paid me. I made do with a .38 M10 or M60 and an 870 about the first 16 years and then a 9mm H&K P7 M8/M13 (with an occasional 870) thereafter.

To the point, my work was indoors, outdoors, urban, suburban, and in some extraordinarily rural/unsettled/wilderness/open space areas. I cannot recall a time when I changed ammo based on my assignment or in what locale I found myself. (I did, though, carry both slugs and #4 for the 870.)

Rant off; make it a great day everyone.

Be safe.

You never know big D. I don't plan around statistics or what I "think" may or may not happen.

To survive, one must be prepared and aware at all times. Adaptability increases survivability.

 

[S&W360Talo357]

Truer words have never been spoken, Kanewpadle.

I am just a bit frustrated (not speaking of the OP, you, or anyone else in particular here) when folks consider special needs for trail guns, backyard guns, "people" ammo, animal ammo, car guns, truck guns, backup guns, and so on and so forth.

I was on the clock in 46 states and that work took me some places I wouldn't have gone had they not paid me. I made do with a .38 M10 or M60 and an 870 about the first 16 years and then a 9mm H&K P7 M8/M13 (with an occasional 870) thereafter.

To the point, my work was indoors, outdoors, urban, suburban, and in some extraordinarily rural/unsettled/wilderness/open space areas. I cannot recall a time when I changed ammo based on my assignment or in what locale I found myself. (I did, though, carry both slugs and #4 for the 870.)

Rant off; make it a great day everyone.

Be safe.

I see your point, I don't like the idea of having to use new fangled prefrag ammo. But I am responsible for every bullet I fire, and if I miss (average 4/5 miss in defense situations I believe) I could be sued/injure/kill my neighbor. I've decided what the best shooting lanes/backstops in my apartment will be and firing in those lanes I think I could probably use a .38 hollow point and not overpenetrate to the neighbor's apartment. I'm not sure though

 

[Road Rat]

Spend a few minutes looking over this site where the man actually shoots various rounds are sheet rock, etc.

The Box O' Truth - Ammo Penetration Testing

 

[S&W360Talo357]

Thank you for the suggestions!

Truer words have never been spoken, Kanewpadle.

I am just a bit frustrated (not speaking of the OP, you, or anyone else in particular here) when folks consider special needs for trail guns, backyard guns, "people" ammo, animal ammo, car guns, truck guns, backup guns, and so on and so forth.

I was on the clock in 46 states and that work took me some places I wouldn't have gone had they not paid me. I made do with a .38 M10 or M60 and an 870 about the first 16 years and then a 9mm H&K P7 M8/M13 (with an occasional 870) thereafter.

To the point, my work was indoors, outdoors, urban, suburban, and in some extraordinarily rural/unsettled/wilderness/open space areas. I cannot recall a time when I changed ammo based on my assignment or in what locale I found myself. (I did, though, carry both slugs and #4 for the 870.)

Rant off; make it a great day everyone.

Be safe.

U.S. Marines Ammo Penetration Test: U.S. Marines Ammo penetration tests - YouTube
I wouldn't want to use an M240g in my apartment

 

[old bear]

I've lived in apartments; had the same ammo in my gun as I did whilst on duty/going about my business. Doubt that few (if anyone) anyone "reloads" upon arriving home. I surely did not.

My carry loads are 158Gr. gas check SWC ahead of 14.5 grains. of Herco 2400. That's 1/2 a grain less than Mr. Keith developed for the original .357 Magnum round. When I get home my carry revolver gets put away, and if needed I have my home Self-defense revolvers around the house. All of these are loaded with 125Gr. Golden Sabers.
So some of do change out our carry ammo.

 

[27145]

Trying to figure out what the best ammo to use for apartment defense is for my .357/38 and .45lc revolvers. I've been looking at prefragmented and am pretty impressed with the Glaser Safety Slug (Silver tip). I believe the air marshals used them in the past and supposedly they won't shoot through an airplane fuselage or overpenetrate through an assailants head. I believe they now use .357s with hallowpoints. Magsafe also makes prefragmented ammo.

My main concern is shooting through 4-5 layers of drywall or worst case through two front doors . The walls in my apartment are relatively thick compared to other ones I have lived in. I'm also concerned with having not enough penetration if I happen to hit an attacker in the arm (i.e. Miami Shootout).

Do you believe Glasers are an adequate/"safe" round? Anyone know of any sites that have tests using drywall with different rounds?

I don't have any info for you, but I would like to commend your concern for innocent bystanders.

 

[OK Hog Shooter]

For a civilain with no LE or military training, I'm gonna vote for a shotgun, guage of your choice, loaded with 000 buck. IMHO my preference is a Benelli M2 12 guage with more of the same!

 

[G.T. Smith]

Perfect paranoia= perfect awareness. Stay aware.
If I happen to shoot through an exterior wall of my house, first of all my house would fall down, then the load would have to travel 3 or more miles through densely wooded land before it could hit somebody.
Bird shot will do the trick. I remember a friend of mine that went into a bar, all drunk and crazy with a chain saw. The bartender shot him with a 20 gauge using no.6 shot. He was dead when he hit the floor.
Maybe a Judge or Governor loaded with 410 shot would keep the load in the room better?
Peace,
Gordon

 

[The Big D]

Yes! Your concerns are well-founded, and I am happy you are considering your neighbors. Truly.

BTW, note you are a new Forum member. Please keep posting...lots to be learned here...and that's NOT just for the new folks. Take care.

Be safe.

I see your point, I don't like the idea of having to use new fangled prefrag ammo. But I am responsible for every bullet I fire, and if I miss (average 4/5 miss in defense situations I believe) I could be sued/injure/kill my neighbor. I've decided what the best shooting lanes/backstops in my apartment will be and firing in those lanes I think I could probably use a .38 hollow point and not overpenetrate to the neighbor's apartment. I'm not sure though