Safe Schools

[bigwheelzip]

Products exist to properly secure doors effectively.

As long as emergency egress capability must be maintained, then that pushbar exit door potentially defeats building security every time.
If a threat can get to an outside door or window, anyone on the inside, especially a co-conspirator like at Columbine HS, could provide entry.
The grounds must be secured first, before building occupants can begin to have security.


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[Bekeart]

Door Propped Open - WELCOMED SHOOTER!

Door Propped Open - WELCOMED SHOOTER!

In Uvalde, McCraw said that the gunman entered Robb Elementary through a back door that a teacher had left propped open. Moments earlier, the teacher had left the school to get her cellphone

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What experts say police should have done in the Uvalde school shooting : NPR

That's a great start but the best locks on the planet, on the doors, are worthless when the doors are propped open by staff or students. As I drive around our little town, I still see doors left open and it just leaves me furious. Americans have short memories and all believe, "it can't happen here".

 

[Kanewpadle]

As long as emergency egress capability must be maintained, then that pushbar exit door potentially defeats building security every time.
If a threat can get to an outside door or window, anyone on the inside, especially a co-conspirator like at Columbine HS, could provide entry.
The grounds must be secured first, before building occupants can begin to have security.


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True. But anyone can allow access at anytime regardless of which of locking system is used.

Training and proper supervision is also necessary. And products still exist to secure the building while adhering to fire code and ADA requirements.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Door Propped Open - WELCOMED SHOOTER!

.

What experts say police should have done in the Uvalde school shooting : NPR

While the experts are correct it seems as though they have a lot to say after the event. Where were they prior?

 

[ColbyBruce]

The hall monitor at my granddaughter's elementary school was a Shilen.

 

[bigwheelzip]

True. But anyone can allow access at anytime regardless of which of locking system is used.

That's why I detailed the photo in post 10. A single, professionally staffed ingres portal maintains control over all grounds access, while searching those entering for contraband.

Sadly, anything short of that, can and will be defeated with little effort, by your average high schooler.


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[mckenney99]

Butler County, Ohio's Sheriff Richard Jones is offering free firearms training and CCL classes to school teachers and employees of the county school system.

It's where my youngest lives.

Rusty, I thought, the state supreme court ruled the current state law required school sponsored safety teams to meet the same firearms training standards as Ohio police officers. Until the legislature sets separate standards for voluntary school safety teams, certified police officers or armed private security officers, the armed school safety teams in Ohio have been disallowed.

 

[Rustyt1953]

From the WCPO.com article:

Jones' press release also said he will offer free firearms training to teachers and "strongly encourages schools to arm teachers and hire more School Resource Officers."

"I'm encouraging school boards to put armed personnel in the school, plus teachers," said Jones during the press conference. "Not every teacher, or it can be a janitor, it can be someone who works in the school, it's up to the school boards."

 

[mckenney99]

Last 2 paragraphs of the WCPO story.

"In February 2019, a Butler County judge ruled district staffers did not need the same 700-plus hours of training required by peace officers under Ohio law; Madison Schools were requiring just 27 hours of training. Then, in June 2021, the Ohio Supreme Court ruled staffers in the district were required to follow Ohio state law and complete the advanced peace officer training, or have been a peace officer themselves for at least 20 years.

This ruling meant schools throughout Ohio that already implemented allowances for teachers and staff to carry guns had to force staffers to holster their weapons until they'd completed the state-approved training. That ruling is still relevant to discussions surrounding arming teachers in 2022, because it hasn't been reversed."


While I admire his offers to help and he can offer all the training he wants, but the school districts have to follow current law as interpreted by the State Supreme Court until new law is written or the State Supreme Court ruling is overturned.

Really sad that the FASTER program sponsored by Buckeye Firearms Association as taught by the superb TDI staff can be utilized by other states but not in Ohio.

 

[crstrode]

Teachers in Israel can protect their students.

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

Much of this strikes me as a sort of "Maginot Line" mentality, relying too much on technology, electronics, concrete and steel. Too passive an approach. I have had very little contact with the medical professions over the years, but it seems they use technology to aid them, not to take the place of skill, training-dedication. Don't recall any "duck and cover" drills from my school days 1954-1967, recall fire drills-my church just had a fire drill.

 

[Pete99004]

Wow...maybe we should use the empty prisons for schools since all the criminals have been set free...just saying...

Pete99004

 

[ExRanger714]

From above:
"That's why I detailed the photo in post 10. A single, professionally staffed ingres (sic) portal maintains control over all grounds access, while searching those entering for contraband."

And that's exactly why the only really gun, knife, drug, cellphone and shiv free zone is inside a prison. High walls and fences, one entrance and exit and a professionally trained staff giving reeeally, reeeally personalized searches keeps those places safe.

 

[BigBoy99]

Schools are not safe when signs are put out front advertising that it is a "gun free zone" so if you are crazed killer, go right in because there will be no oppisition.

What if banks put signs in their windows saying. "We don't lock our safes and our alarm system doesn't work." Which bank do you think a bank robber would visit?

 

[Donn]

I've said this every time one of these incidents, (sadly), happen. Arming teachers isn't the answer. There are any number of Iraq and Afghan vets out there, young, fit, already trained up, and have had combat experience. This is the untapped resource we should look into for school security. Of course there needs to be a hard vetting process, but these are the guys for the job, and I believe they'd be happy to do it.

 

[SMSgt]

There were no school shootings when the kids were learning from home. Just saying..

Would an extensive list of all the kids killed when playing with daddy's gun at home count?

 

[BigBoy99]

Years ago I saw where the media defines "children" as those under the age of 30. They made that the cutoff age so alll of the gang-banger deaths could be included as children. There by, making the numbers greater so they will have a larger impact when the numbers are just "tossed out" by reporters.

 

[Imissedagain]

There may be many teachers in middle and high school that could not protect themselves from students taking their guns.

 

[UncleEd]

Years ago I saw where the media defines "children" as those under the age of 30.

Never heard of such a definition. Sure it
wasn't 20 because that's the definition
of "children" under federal guidelines
for various benefits, restrictions, etc. The
federal government then lumped
20-year-olds into the statistics.

The media have nothing to do with how
the government defines categories.

 

[Rlg#17]

No such thing as a "safe" place or safe school anymore with what's going on these days! Access would have to be so controlled, and limited that it would be almost impossible to get out, should the need arise…

Lunatics with antisocial behavior in mind will only be stopped with the appropriate amount of force. Sad, the times we are living in, but the "village" isn't doing enough to protect anyone.

While that school district should be applauded for its efforts, it's not truly safe!

Regards, Rick Gibbs