True story on breaking an entering

[kablamo]

My brother lived 1/4 mile from me when this happened. 11pm on a week night. His 1yr old is sleeping in the bedroom down the hall. Him and his wife are watching TV. A belligerent and heavily intoxicated man is screaming and attempting to kick the front door down. My brother (who is anti-gun) is unarmed, calls 911. The 911 operator can hear the man attempting to break into the home. The man escalates and begins throwing his whole body into the door. The screen door is smashed in. The 911 operator instructs my brother to arm himself with something. He grabs a kitchen knife, his wife hides, and he stands guard in front of his daughters room while on with 911 dispatch. 15 minutes later police arrive while the man is still attempting to get inside. The man is apprehended after arguing with police. He was too intoxicated and convinced it was HIS house (despite living 3 miles away in an an apartment).

This story goes to show that 911 may not be there, and is also shocking that 911 told him to arm himself. He was quite shaken up by this, as who knows what the man would have done if he gained entry. FYI, this was in a relatively "nice" area...

Shortly there-after I had my concealed carry permit.

 

[Lost Lake]

Thanks for the story!

Methinks the guy just said he thought it was his house so he wouldn't get in as much trouble....

Is your brother better able to defend himself now??

 

[Rintimtin]

Methinks Lost Lake is on to something.

 

[bummer]

I believe the saying goes "when seconds count help is minutes away" I hope your brother saw the light and purchased a gun for self defence

 

[sharpshooterassassin]

I too had a similar case where a guy hyped up on drugs was trying to break into my condo with my family and I there. My wife and I were getting ready for bed at about 10pm with my 2 year old daughter in the next bedroom already asleep. Our power suddenly went off. I looked out the window and the condos across from us in the next set of buildings their power was still on. My front door is a heavy fire resistant door with a deadbolt, doorknob lock and a cheap chain latch. I also had a metal cane jabbed up under the doorknob for cases just like this. After about a few minutes after our power went off, a guy was trying to open the front door with the doorknob. When he found out that the door was locked, he proceeded to try and kick the door in. I immediately had my wife call 911 on her cell phone since we had no power to our landline. I had her stand a little bit down the hallway with my mossberg shotgun but all I had in it was light bird shot loads from the weekend before from dove hunting but it was better than nothing. I on the other hand had my Springfield XD .45 with me pointing at the door while I was yelling at the perp telling him that he was about to get shot. I had the 911 operator on speakerphone with the phone laying down on a little table by the front door. The guy didn't care that I had a gun. He was dead set on coming into our home! I told the operator that if he sets one foot into my home that I was going to shoot him. While he was trying to kick in our door, he also had a crowbar that he was trying to use in between kicks to the front door. Long story short, he was just beginning to make entry and I was just about to pull the trigger, I heard sirens and saw red and blue lights bouncing off the building next to our condo. He started to run and the cops caught him at the bottom of the stairs. His excuse too was that he thought it was his house and he thought his brother had locked him out. It was very scary almost as much as a guy trying to break in but scary that I might have had to take a life! I was a split second from pulling that trigger! If I wouldn't have heard the sirens and seen the read and blue lights, he would've been dead!

 

[kablamo]

This kind of thing is terrifying. I've had a drugged up guy trying to get into an old apartment as well. I talked him out of it, but did have my Glock 19 in hand. He made the right decision to leave, and I'm glad.

I hope anti-gun people are able to view these things and put themselves in their shoes. When your life is on the line, a handy gun could be quite a nice thing. Its funny how guns are evil until they are about to save your life eh?

 

[cmort666]

I never get tired of saying this:

• Police have no legal duty to protect individuals.
• Police have no legal liability when they fail to protect individuals.
• Police have virtually no physical ability to protect individuals.

The police don't protect individuals. They draw chalk outlines around individuals who don't protect themselves.

When your life is in danger RIGHT NOW, you're either going to protect YOURSELF or you're just not going to get protected AT ALL. Anybody who tells you different is a liar.

 

[Old cop]

I read on the internet that police have no duty to protect anyone and it leaves me wondering what I did for 30 years. Not only was it in my oath of office, it was written on almost everything in print w/i the agency. As to no ability to protect anyone other than ourselves I always guessed that is why we were issued weapons and trained. As a matter of fact I used my weapon to protect someone that did not have the ability to protect himself at the time.

Frankly, I find this kind of thing insulting to every cop that ever put on a uniform and worked a shift anywhere!

 

[gdnagle]

I never get tired of saying this:

• Police have no legal duty to protect individuals.
• Police have no legal liability when they fail to protect individuals.
• Police have virtually no physical ability to protect individuals.

The police don't protect individuals. They draw chalk outlines around individuals who don't protect themselves.

When your life is in danger RIGHT NOW, you're either going to protect YOURSELF or you're just not going to get protected AT ALL. Anybody who tells you different is a liar.

I can agree with that Lived in Baltimore had a good friend in the 60's whose father was a B City cop. He told us that back then when they came across a stolen car they would take what they wanted before calling it in. He also told us if they got a call for armed robbery they would take their time getting there, they didn't want to be the first on the scine. Probaly was a very few but they could have been the ones in my district.

Another case was a guy in his home four perps broke in about 11:00pm and stabbed him and made him sit on the sofa while they robbed the appartment he saw a chance to run and took it. Ran about two blocks bleeding then down the median of a 4 lane road till he couldn't run anymore. Threw his hands up and they walked up to him and shot him point blank with a 12ga. then walked away. Cops got there after awhile then a few minuets later his sister showed up. She asked if they lookd for the murder weapon they said they did but didn't find it. Next morning his sister went back and looked down into a storm drain and saw it about 30 ft away. Never did find the perps.This was in the late 80's so apperently the police force didn't change much. Shows you need to protect yourself at all cost. Oh btw true story guy killed was my brother-in-law and still no one brought to justice.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

I read on the internet that police have no duty to protect anyone and it leaves me wondering what I did for 30 years. Not only was it in my oath of office, it was written on almost everything in print w/i the agency. As to no ability to protect anyone other than ourselves I always guessed that is why we were issued weapons and trained. As a matter of fact I used my weapon to protect someone that did not have the ability to protect himself at the time.

Frankly, I find this kind of thing insulting to every cop that ever put on a uniform and worked a shift anywhere!

I do feel bad that you take that post as insulting. I doubt that it was intended that way. I, and probably most or all of those who make posts like cmort's, DO appreciate the considerable effort that most or practically all LEO's make to protect those who cannot protect themselves. But the status of the law is that they DON'T have a legal duty to do so. They have a moral and professional duty to TRY. They don't have legal liability when they fail. The statement "Police have virtually no physical ability to protect individuals" is true, but misleading. When they are present, they have considerable ability, but criminals try, often successfully, to commit crimes in the absence of LEOs. When life or death is a matter of seconds, the police are just minutes away. THIS is what makes the last quote true.

Thank you VERY MUCH for your service in a difficult job. I hope that you don't take a statement of the legal realities as demeaning of your contribution to public safety.

 

[cmort666]

I read on the internet that police have no duty to protect anyone and it leaves me wondering what I did for 30 years. Not only was it in my oath of office, it was written on almost everything in print w/i the agency. As to no ability to protect anyone other than ourselves I always guessed that is why we were issued weapons and trained. As a matter of fact I used my weapon to protect someone that did not have the ability to protect himself at the time.

Frankly, I find this kind of thing insulting to every cop that ever put on a uniform and worked a shift anywhere!

Truth is truth.

It's settled law that police have no legal duty to protect individuals and no liability when they fail to. There's simply no disputing that. The exceptions?

• Get elected to political office and have a protective detail, like Obama, Bloomberg and Emmanuel.
• Get arrested and be in custody.
• Be a confidential informant.

That's about it.

If you "protected" somebody as an individual, the odds are overwhelming that:

• The immediate threat wasn't that much of a threat.
• The threat wasn't immediate.
• You were standing in front of the victim at the time the threat occurred. Exactly how often does that happen?

The odds of a citizen being "protected" from the IMMEDIATE threat to life and limb by police as an individual are about on par with those of you seeing bigfoot. If that weren't the case, my godsister in Chicago and those kids in Connecticut would still be alive.

This is reality. If you find reality "insulting" then perhaps there's a problem with your take on reality.

 

[cmort666]

I do feel bad that you take that post as insulting. I doubt that it was intended that way. I, and probably most or all of those who make posts like cmort's, DO appreciate the considerable effort that most or practically all LEO's make to protect those who cannot protect themselves.

Regardless of ones opinion of somebody's motivations, it's unreasonable to expect them to do the impossible. Hate the police or love the police, it's quite literally IMPOSSIBLE for them to "protect" you from the IMMEDIATE threat of death or great bodily harm.

911 is a communications system of variable efficacy, not a matter transporter. Assuming that the 911 operator doesn't demand that you put your attacker on the line, as one Detroit 911 operator did, a LOT of things have to happen correctly in order for a cop to show up at your front door. ANY breakdown can cause the cops to be delayed or simply not show up at all. Assuming that EVERYTHING goes PERFECTLY, there's still the small issue of the absence of a matter transporter.

Find out what the police response time is in your area. Then see how many times you can stab a beef roast in that time. I doubt you could survive that many stab wounds while waiting for the police to come... assuming that your assailant ALLOWS you to call the police in the first place. And that of course is the nice thing about a gun. When I pull the trigger on my 4" 29-2, there isn't a 20-40 minute delay before something happens. Nor will my gun be off "protecting" somebody else on the other side of town and be unavailable to me.

Reality can be unpleasant. Reality isn't contingent upon our feelings about it.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

cmort,

You are right, as usual. But this does not make the police useless. You are addressing primarily assaults of various sorts, which, of course, ARE of the greatest concern, by far. However, I have personal knowledge of a different case, a B&E and vandalism, where the local police responded remarkably quickly to a phone report, made arrests of, I recall, two of the participants, and marched into the local high school and drug the third perp out of class. Sure, there was some luck. But they had to be on their toes to take advantage of the luck.

Your attitude is correct and a person would be a fool not to act accordingly. But we should not ignore what police do that IS useful.

 

[cmort666]

cmort,

You are right, as usual. But this does not make the police useless.

I don't say that the police (for the most part) are useless, only that it's foolish to depend upon them for ones personal safety from violent attack.

Election day I got rear ended on I-90 going to work. The police came and made out a report. That was useful.

 

[Poodle Soup]

I would rather have Smith & Wessons 442 than Paula Deans veggie chopper...

 

[Faulkner]

The castle doctrine is useless if you can't protect the castle.

 

[cmort666]

The castle doctrine is useless if you can't protect the castle.

There are vocal minorities who believe that:

1. The ONLY permissible "protection" is an armed agent of the state.
2. The ONLY permissible "protection" is the probability and statistics of the herd. Hence those who don't even want armed COPS in schools.

 

[PlainOleDave]

CMort, I believe that I understand where you are coming from But it would seem that you have a way of coming across as a bit harsh. Your explanations clearify the 1st post but I took the 1st post as inflamatory, as I read it, the first time.
I told My wife that I think you are more of a realist.

I like Cops and what they do BUT I too would rather have a gun.

 

[DigiRebel]

I would rather have Smith & Wessons 442 than Paula Deans veggie chopper...

LOL Paula Deen's VEGGIE chopper? An imaginary knife?

I mean, I know she has a bacon chopper, and a butter chopper... lol

 

[DigiRebel]

I don't think anyone here disparages what the police do, and try to do. I've got police in my family and respect them a great deal for what they do. But when push comes to shove the police are FAR more in the role of Avengers than protectors. Some hurts or kills someone, their role is MUCH more to catch that person and punish them for what they did.

When the police can protect everyone, all the time this might be a bit different, but in both stories above the police arrived only just in time to prevent a more violent confrontation. The door to my house would not withstand an attack like that. I have no intention of allowing myself to be beaten or killed preventing someone like that from getting to my children. I will keep my kids safe, but I want to be there to see my kids graduate school, and walk my daughter down the aisle. The police avenging me doesn't do me much good if I am already achieving room temperature.

A friend from college was having issues with the local frat boys messing with his car in the parking lot. When he saw them out there he called out to get away from his car. The frat boys felt that this was valid reason to attempt forcible entry of his apartment to "teach him a lesson about talking to them that way." He dialed 911, explained the situation and the operator was on the phone with him when they started kicking his door to gain entry. He told the 911 operator that he had a shotgun and was planning to defend himself if they broke through his door. The 911 operator told him that if they kicked the door in he was allowed to defend himself. He then got as close to the door as he could safely and racked the shotgun as loudly as he could. That was enough for the frat boys who realized they'd brought their fists to a gun fight and promptly retreated. 10-15 minutes later the police FINALLY showed up. Fortunately, enough of the apartment complex had heard the whole thing going on, and knew where the frat boys were living that the police were able to make 3 arrests that night.

Of course, in all of this, had my friend not been an avid shooter, who knows what might have happened to him that night. The police were simply not there when he needed them to protect him.