Victory data base
- Thread starter zonker5
- Start date
A "Doh!" moment
I must learn to be more exacting when inspecting my firearms.
I have posted in the past on my Victory (posts #29 and #69). Serial number on the frame is 43268 but I just noticed the cylinder bears #432695.
Does this sugest the gun was returned to S&W for repair work? Also, the "8" in the serial number is rather faint and I know the hole for the lanyard ring was filled in; this has me wondering if somehow the last digit of the serial number was erased as it makes more sense to me that the frame and cylinder would be only a few numbers apart as opposed to being 627 numbers apart. Am I overthinking this?
My letter makes no reference to any additional work done by S&W but I had failed to note the different number on the cylinder when I sent my request.
Ned
I must learn to be more exacting when inspecting my firearms.
I have posted in the past on my Victory (posts #29 and #69). Serial number on the frame is 43268 but I just noticed the cylinder bears #432695.
Does this sugest the gun was returned to S&W for repair work? Also, the "8" in the serial number is rather faint and I know the hole for the lanyard ring was filled in; this has me wondering if somehow the last digit of the serial number was erased as it makes more sense to me that the frame and cylinder would be only a few numbers apart as opposed to being 627 numbers apart. Am I overthinking this?
My letter makes no reference to any additional work done by S&W but I had failed to note the different number on the cylinder when I sent my request.
Ned
ordnanceguy
Member
Hello Dave:
Thanks very much for contributing your info to the Victory Database. Every bit helps.
One question: On the left top strap are there US Property GHD markings?
S&W HE
Member
Yes there are US Property GHD markings on left top strap. Also the frame, barrel, cylinder, and stocks serial numbers all match.
Skeetr57
Member
S&W Victory and pre-Victory
Two more for the data base. First is a Victory in .38 Special, 4" barrel, parkerized finish, SN V423316 on frame, cylinder, barrel and grips. This gun appears nearly unfired with no wear or brass marks on the recoil shield.
The second is a pre-Victory in .38 S&W with 5" barrel. The SN 810738 appears on the butt, cylinder, barrel, and checkered grips. The only non-standard marks are a small"P" stamped in the butt and the swivel. This piece also shows very little wear with none on the recoil shield.
Two more for the data base. First is a Victory in .38 Special, 4" barrel, parkerized finish, SN V423316 on frame, cylinder, barrel and grips. This gun appears nearly unfired with no wear or brass marks on the recoil shield.
The second is a pre-Victory in .38 S&W with 5" barrel. The SN 810738 appears on the butt, cylinder, barrel, and checkered grips. The only non-standard marks are a small"P" stamped in the butt and the swivel. This piece also shows very little wear with none on the recoil shield.
ordnanceguy
Member
Hi Tom:
Thanks for contributing the data on your two revolvers.
On your V423316 are there any left top strap markings?
On your 810738 am I correct in understanding that the finish is blued?
Thanks for contributing the data on your two revolvers.
On your V423316 are there any left top strap markings?
On your 810738 am I correct in understanding that the finish is blued?
Help with ID
Can someone help me nail down the date on my smith. The serial number is 837xxx. All numbers match, including the frame, barrel, cylinder and the grips, which are the diamond with small silver medallions. The gun is marked on the left "Smith and Wesson". On the right "38 s &w special ctg." the barrel is a 6 inch, top of barrel last patent date "dec 29, 1914".
The gun is a five screw, it has a LARGE smith trademark logo on the right side plate. It is a very deep blue finish. There is made in USA on the right side. There are no other marks. It does have a lanyard loop. It has a serrated case trigger, case harmmer, standard round front sight and slot for rear sight. I am guessing it is a commercial version 1905 4th from around 1942. I know, I know, figure out how to post a photo or two! First post, so please be gentle!
Thanks in advance!
Can someone help me nail down the date on my smith. The serial number is 837xxx. All numbers match, including the frame, barrel, cylinder and the grips, which are the diamond with small silver medallions. The gun is marked on the left "Smith and Wesson". On the right "38 s &w special ctg." the barrel is a 6 inch, top of barrel last patent date "dec 29, 1914".
The gun is a five screw, it has a LARGE smith trademark logo on the right side plate. It is a very deep blue finish. There is made in USA on the right side. There are no other marks. It does have a lanyard loop. It has a serrated case trigger, case harmmer, standard round front sight and slot for rear sight. I am guessing it is a commercial version 1905 4th from around 1942. I know, I know, figure out how to post a photo or two! First post, so please be gentle!
Thanks in advance!
charlie sherrill
Member
I just got one that Bubba got hold of some time in the past. Serial number is V252003. The top has been scrubbed of any property markings. The "V" has been removed from the grip. The lanyard hole has been filled in. It has pock marks under the cylinder release that looks like somebody used it for a hammer. It's got the wrong grips. It has a very old and worn reblue. We got it at Gander Mountain a few days ago. It was in pieces in a zip-lock bag. We put it back together and the only thing missing was the side plate screw under the cylinder. I found a screw for it yesterday and we put it on and shot cans in the back yard yesterday afternoon. The barrel has good rifling and we knocked cans all over the place with it. At $70.00 it is the cheapest Victory I've ever bought. There is absolutely no collector value so it will join my household hide-a-gun program.
ordnanceguy
Member
Hello Scott:
Welcome to the Forum. You have what we call, for shorthand, a pre-Victory Model.
Would you please post here or send me a PM with the complete serial number? I can't really do much with a partial. With a complete number I can give you a very good estimate as to its likely ship date, based on the Victory Model Database which my pal LWCmdr45 and I administer.
Is there a "P" proof mark on the butt?
ordnanceguy
Member
Scottsaba:
Thanks for PMing me with your complete serial number and other data. That makes it much easier for me to give you answers to your questions.
Your pre-Victory likely shipped from the S&W factory in the September-October, 1941 time frame. The absence of any property/proof/inspection/acceptance markings suggests strongly to me that your revolver was probably shipped to a civilian rather than a military destination. Only a factory letter can tell us for certain what the destination was in the absence of any telltale markings or other evidence.
Keep in mind that guns shipped in this time frame are among the last of the pre-war guns as shortly thereafter 100% of S&W production was to be devoted to the war effort.
You have an interesting revolver there. Thanks again for sharing it and its data with us.
Thanks for PMing me with your complete serial number and other data. That makes it much easier for me to give you answers to your questions.
Your pre-Victory likely shipped from the S&W factory in the September-October, 1941 time frame. The absence of any property/proof/inspection/acceptance markings suggests strongly to me that your revolver was probably shipped to a civilian rather than a military destination. Only a factory letter can tell us for certain what the destination was in the absence of any telltale markings or other evidence.
Keep in mind that guns shipped in this time frame are among the last of the pre-war guns as shortly thereafter 100% of S&W production was to be devoted to the war effort.
You have an interesting revolver there. Thanks again for sharing it and its data with us.
Skeetr57
Member
Ordnance Guy: My Victory is stamped on the left top strap with the Ordnance bomb, US Property and GHD. The stamping is very faint - not polished out, just lightly struck. The pre - Victory is polished blue, and other than the "P" on the but and the lanyard ring looks like any other 5" M&P, with the S&W logo on the side plate, "Made in USA", patent dates on the top of the barrel and caliber on the right side of the barrel, "Smith and Wesson" on the left side.
U.S. Navy Victory - Shipped January 1943
I have a new entry for you and would like to know why I don't find inspector or ordinance markings on this one?
It appears to have seen little if any use.....maybe unissued??
Serial number is V205193 and Roy just informed me that it shipped January of 1943
My Victory is marked U.S. NAVY on the left side of the top strap
Smith & Wesson on the left side of the barrel
MADE IN U.S.A. on the right side of frame
S&W logo on side plate
38 S. & W. SPECIAL CTG
Grips are original and numbered to revolver and has a 4" barrel length
I am not finding an inspector stamp or an ordanance bomb on the revolver. There are other production numbers on the gun.
Thank you!
Tom Graham
#2303
I have a new entry for you and would like to know why I don't find inspector or ordinance markings on this one?
It appears to have seen little if any use.....maybe unissued??
Serial number is V205193 and Roy just informed me that it shipped January of 1943
My Victory is marked U.S. NAVY on the left side of the top strap
Smith & Wesson on the left side of the barrel
MADE IN U.S.A. on the right side of frame
S&W logo on side plate
38 S. & W. SPECIAL CTG
Grips are original and numbered to revolver and has a 4" barrel length
I am not finding an inspector stamp or an ordanance bomb on the revolver. There are other production numbers on the gun.
Thank you!
Tom Graham
#2303
Attachments
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ordnanceguy
Member
Hello Tom:
Thanks very much for contributing the data on your very handsome Navy Victory.
The details provided on your revolver reveal that it was a direct Navy purchase, rather than one of the Navy purchases administered by the Army's Ordnance Department. As such it would not have any proof, inspection or acceptance markings on it. It is a correct gun.
HTH.
Thanks for the information, I will put a note of this with the gun.
Not sure if this makes it a more sought after piece? But it is certainly a nice one!
The finish is outstanding, and I tend to believe original......as I see no sign that it has been through a rebuild at any time.
As mentioned, the stocks number to the gun.
Tom
Not sure if this makes it a more sought after piece? But it is certainly a nice one!
The finish is outstanding, and I tend to believe original......as I see no sign that it has been through a rebuild at any time.
As mentioned, the stocks number to the gun.
Tom
heater1
Member
Ordnanceguy; I have a Victory acquired some time ago and since I havent figured the picture attachment routine out yet I'll give you as detailed a description as I can.
The S/N is V341838 which appears on the bbl flat, rear of cylinder, ejector star, the butt and the inside right stock. This gun has a 4" bbl and is finished in a grey matte finish. It is marked Smith and Wesson on the left side of the bbl and 38 S&W Special CTG. on the right. The frame is marked Made in USA on the forward right side with the S&W trademark on the sideplate. The frame also carries a small ordnance bomb followed by U.S. Property G.H.D. on the top left strap of the frame.
There is a small S stamped on the crane, the rear of the cylinder and the upper right backstrap under the stock. In addition there is , what appears to be, a small crossed sword mark on the forward left lower grip strap and a G on the rear left lower grip strap. Finally there appears to be HSA stamped diagonally across the right forwrd lower grip strap. The A is partial and not real clear so I may be wrong on that one.
Hope this helps.
Pete Janssen
The S/N is V341838 which appears on the bbl flat, rear of cylinder, ejector star, the butt and the inside right stock. This gun has a 4" bbl and is finished in a grey matte finish. It is marked Smith and Wesson on the left side of the bbl and 38 S&W Special CTG. on the right. The frame is marked Made in USA on the forward right side with the S&W trademark on the sideplate. The frame also carries a small ordnance bomb followed by U.S. Property G.H.D. on the top left strap of the frame.
There is a small S stamped on the crane, the rear of the cylinder and the upper right backstrap under the stock. In addition there is , what appears to be, a small crossed sword mark on the forward left lower grip strap and a G on the rear left lower grip strap. Finally there appears to be HSA stamped diagonally across the right forwrd lower grip strap. The A is partial and not real clear so I may be wrong on that one.
Hope this helps.
Pete Janssen
straightcut
Member
Hi ordnanceguy,
I recently acquired a Victory Model which has the following features:
5" barrel, Parkerized finish, barrel stamped 38 S & W Ctg, top strap (left side) stamped "United States Property", barrel, cylinder, butt and inside of right grip stamped V434XX, butt also stamped WB and P with a flaming bomb, frame and crane stamped 90202, inside of left grip panel marked w/yellow grease pencil with serial number and 90202.
I don't see any British markings. Would this have been used by U.S. forces, yet be chambered in 38 S&W?
Thanks for your kind assistance!
I recently acquired a Victory Model which has the following features:
5" barrel, Parkerized finish, barrel stamped 38 S & W Ctg, top strap (left side) stamped "United States Property", barrel, cylinder, butt and inside of right grip stamped V434XX, butt also stamped WB and P with a flaming bomb, frame and crane stamped 90202, inside of left grip panel marked w/yellow grease pencil with serial number and 90202.
I don't see any British markings. Would this have been used by U.S. forces, yet be chambered in 38 S&W?
Thanks for your kind assistance!
ordnanceguy
Member
Hi Pete:
Thanks for the data on your V341838. From the Victory Model Database I can estimate for you that your revolver likely shipped in the June-July, 1943 time frame. It was probably shipped to the US Navy.
The markings on the grip frame concealed by the stocks are assemblers and inspector markings. They are not considered to be very significant to collectors.
Thanks for the data on your V341838. From the Victory Model Database I can estimate for you that your revolver likely shipped in the June-July, 1943 time frame. It was probably shipped to the US Navy.
The markings on the grip frame concealed by the stocks are assemblers and inspector markings. They are not considered to be very significant to collectors.
ordnanceguy
Member
Straightcut:
It could be either. Almost all of the revolvers marked as your example is were shipped as Lend Lease equipment. Bear in mind that the later shipped .38 S&W guns do not appear to have been given the same treatment marking-wise as the earlier guns were by the British and Commonwealth Forces. Thus, even though your revolver bears no British/Commonwealth markings and no post-war UK proofs, that does not rule out its use by those Forces.
However, it is also true that a relatively small number of the .38 S&W guns were shipped to the US military. They did not get much use in US service as the .38 Special was preferred. One well known example of the .38 S&W in use by the US was the one shown in Charlie Pate's US Handguns book identified as having come from the armory in the US Embassy in post-war Berlin.
Hope that info helps you.
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Hey guys, first post. Just received a Victory model for Christmas today. Trying to get some info on it, as I'm not really familiar with these. The serial number is V673813. It also has a P stamp after the serial and on the left side near the top strap behind the cylinder.
It appears that the cylinder has been swapped for one chambered in .38 special because it has a different serial number, 472779. The lanyard ring and s/n on the butt have been filled and ground smooth (ugh). It still retains it's 5 inch barrel but it has been refinished in blue with machine turned hammer and trigger.
It appears that the cylinder has been swapped for one chambered in .38 special because it has a different serial number, 472779. The lanyard ring and s/n on the butt have been filled and ground smooth (ugh). It still retains it's 5 inch barrel but it has been refinished in blue with machine turned hammer and trigger.
Just received the factory letter. Shipped may 21, 1943 and delivered to C.H.Masland & Son, Carlisle, PA, Shipped with 4 inch barrel, military midnight black finish, butt swivel and smooth walnut grips.
The six inch barrel was installed during a factory overhaul January 1947 as stamped on the grip. The society does not have records past 1941 so they were not able to tell me who had the work done... shoot.
