What happened to Quality S&W

[AJR337]

I just got a brand new 686 2.5+ and it’s a tack driver and runs perfect

What grips do you have on that 686?

 

[Shoebox1.1]

I’m running two sets but some cheap eBay Thais that are 50 shipped! VERY pleased with them and some NC Ordnance walnuts that were 150. The cheapie ones clear loader no issues. The NC had to be clearanced. I think the cheapies are going to stay. They fit my hand better

 

[balin]

Low unemployment means companies have to hire what they can get.
As for quality I have bought a few Smiths over the last few years and I have no complaints

 

[stansdds]

Low unemployment means companies have to hire what they can get.
As for quality I have bought a few Smiths over the last few years and I have no complaints

S&W does turn out good firearms, they also let lemons out of the factory. My advice when considering a purchase, whether new or used, from S&W or any manufacturer, is to give the firearm a close inspection, look for defects and issues before buying.

 

[Shrek Of The Arctic]

"These dang Smith & Wessons just ain't good no more! They don't take no pride! Just churning them out for the masses! They're too lazy to pin the barrels, or even recess the cylinders anymore!" - Half my Father's shooting buddies, Circa mid 1980's.

Point being that there are and have always been defective products to roll off the assembly line from time to time. For every one defective product, there's always far more than one voice to call them out on it. It seems every generation venerates the previous generation for having done better. With the advent of the internet, we have limitless voices to hear, repeat, and spread a rumor about every factory defect, whether real or imagined. Of the newer guns, I've had a decent handful of newer S&W revolvers. The only one that ever had to go back was a 627 for a detent bearing that hadn't been properly staked. The Customer Service Rep was the very picture of "Service with a snarl" and they refused to send me the part so I could do it right myself. It would have taken longer to find the hammer and punch than do the work. But...They did pay the tab to ship it both ways and make it right. Kinda stupid how they went about things, but the results were good at the end. Funnily, I could see where they missed two more times before they did get t it right. The snarling customer service gal didn't impress me, but I wasn't looking to date her, I just wanted my gun fixed. In the end, she saw that through.

Unfortunately, I've come to believe that most any revolver nowadays should be inspected before purchase whenever possible. I've seen bad timing in a few Smith & Wesson revolvers, Quite a few Charter Arms and Taurus revolvers, and most every new Colt I've ever picked up. I know that's unheard of, but...it's been my experience. In summary, I fear that my beloved revolvers just don't jibe all that well with our modern times, regardless of the name on the side. Labor, inflation, public interest...They all play a factor. Of course, I know my cantankerous self well enough to realize that if all the world were wrapped up iwith revolvers I would be singing the praises of the polymer 9mm bottom feeders.

The initial query provides plenty of food for thought.

 

[BluedRevolver]

I've been really tempted to get one of the new Model 19 Classic no-lock revolvers that just came out, but I hesitate because of QC issues.

Like, what are the odds of getting a good one vs a bad one? When inspecting the gun before picking it up, what should I look out for that would be wrong (timing, etc)?

 

[Dave686]

Could someone please advise of a company whose products produced today are as good as the products that same company produced 30 years ago?

Keeping prices competitive is the reason quality suffers.

Most any gun company, and certainly most any of the top car companies, foreign or domestic. Generally speaking, most companies. Price has little to do with it, Smith & Wesson handguns used to cost about twice of some of their competitors. Now the competitors charge as much as they do because its marketing over customer support.

I retired a few years ago after spending most of my career in manufacturing. Minus a few years I was a cop. To say things were made better “back in the day” is not correct.

So what changed? Social media for one thing. We have gone from a gun culture where a small percentage of gun owners were involved in computers and social media to today, where everyone is involved in social media.

I don’t think we are seeing anymore of a percentage of complaints about new guns. But I think what we are seeing is Smith & Wesson’s total failure to act when they are made aware of a problem. It used to be they sent you a shipping label, they quickly fixed the problem and got your gun back. They don’t do that anymore. They were once the gold standard of firearms customer service. Now they are in a race with all the others to the bottom. Rarely will anyone have a good experience once customer service gets involved.

 

[familyman357oh]

In 2025, the average wage for Smith & Wesson's plant/manufacturing department is $17.35/hour. Half are LESS:

Those are McDonald's wages these days.

That explains a lot. You don't exactly attract a stable, dedicated work force when you pay peanuts.

Now I'm actually impressed that my 432UC turned out fine.

It gets even worse when you see how production and customer service rank in the company overall (customer service is literally dead last):

Smith & Wesson Salaries: How Much Does Smith & Wesson Pay In 2025? - Zippia

 

[Tom S.]

In 2025, the average wage for Smith & Wesson's plant/manufacturing department is $17.35/hour. Most are LESS:

Those are McDonald's wages these days.

That explains a lot. You don't exactly attract a stable, dedicated work force when you pay peanuts.

It also explains why, when I bought my last S&W gun I was asked if I wanted fries with it!

 

[Slufstuff]

The hourly wages posted above are pretty low, even in the south. I know of several retail stores in my area that pay $15 hr. to start for non-technical jobs like stocking shelves or cashiers. It looks like S&W is competing wage wise with retail stores and fast-food restaurants for their skilled or semi-skilled workers.

 

[Shoebox1.1]

I work at a huge car dealer group in Dallas and we pay our porters 20+ to park cars!! No dirty hands, no washing cars. JUST park them and pull them around when it’s ready to go home. 40hr a week job with insurance BCBS

 

[BluedRevolver]

I just ordered a new Model 19 Classic No-Lock revolver. What should I look for at the FFL to ensure whether it's good to go or not? I will have a pair of feeler gauges.

 

[EK2944]

I just ordered a new Model 19 Classic No-Lock revolver. What should I look for at the FFL to ensure whether it's good to go or not? I will have a pair of feeler gauges.

I like to make sure the front sight is vertical, no canted barrel.

 

[stansdds]

I just ordered a new Model 19 Classic No-Lock revolver. What should I look for at the FFL to ensure whether it's good to go or not? I will have a pair of feeler gauges.

Check barrel-cylinder gap with the cylinder pushed forward and again with the cylinder pushed to the rear, the difference is called end shake and should be 0.001-0.002", not more than 0.004" and I would consider that to be excessive on a new revolver. Check the barrel rib/front sight orientation in relation to the frame, the front sight should be straight up, 12 o'clock, not tilted slightly to the left or right.

Look at the machining of all of the surfaces you can see, S&W has become infamous for rough machining of the barrel's forcing cone and sometimes the muzzle too. Since this is a blued revolver, look at the finish, check for blotches, spots, and even rust. Check the cycling of the action for proper cylinder rotation and lock up and smooth functioning of the trigger in both double and single action.

 

[Claims Rep.]

I hated reading about the poor QC from S&W, but I am thankful for the comments everyone has shared. I was wondering about the latest no-lock revolvers, but after reading this thread I think my best bet is to continue looking for a used one. Maybe one of these days I walk in on a 2.5” 686 safe queen that someone let go off (a guy can still dream, right?!!?).

 

[pistolpete10]

Lucky man

I just got a brand new 686 2.5+ and it’s a tack driver and runs perfect

You are a very lucky man. I suggest you buy a lottery ticket.