ADVICE PLS - Reloading for S&W Model 327 PC Titanium Cylinder

[44R]

Please can someone give advice, maybe from reloaders who have experience with S&W titanium cylinder revolvers?

I have a brand new S&W 327 Performance Center .357 Magnum with an 8 shot titanium cylinder and two-inch bbl. It's a great carry gun, unique and feels like it weighs next to nothing. S&W is impressive for its use of exotic alloys to keep the double action revolver relevant, better than plastic automatics. No other manufacturer has done this at any price point.

I want to avoid flame cutting/erosion of the front face of the cylinder at the chamber mouth.

The manual supplied with the gun contains the following: "CAUTION: Do not use Magnum loads with bullet weights of less than 120 grains. This will reduce the possibility of premature erosion in titanium alloy cylinders."

At 22 oz unloaded, I really like this unusual revolver and do not want to ask S&W to convert to a steel cylinder.

Once the revolver is broken in, I would like to develop my own safe loads of 357 Medium.

I guess I would want to use 135 or 140 grain bullets and not the 125 grain bullets like the box ammo I shoot in my N frames.

I have a supply of Unique and some Power Pistol on hand. (I only reload .223 Remington and .45 ACP. I have never reloaded for revolver.)

1. Should/must I go up to 158 grains?
2. What powder would be best to prevent titanium cylinder erosion?
3. Is Unique a hot, fast burning powder associated with flame cutting or would it be safe for the 327 PC if combined with 135-140 grain bullets?
4. For that matter, what factory ammo would be best?

 

[Nevada Ed]

If you want to load your ammo, the 140 gr XTP is low in cost and has
good penetration and accuracy out of my revolvers.

You can also adjust the fps and recoil to a load that works for you.

The 158 gr jacket bullets tend to over penetrate at factory speeds in my revolvers
but some people like them.

In my M49 38 special snub nose, the 140 XTP beats out the 135 Gold Dot in accuracy & POA.

It all depends on what bullet, you can find, to load, in these times.

 

[44R]

Am I right thinking the 140 Grain XTP is a Hornady jacketed bullet? OK. Will do. The Hornadys tend to be a good value. How about powders and flame cutting?

 

[TAROMAN]

With advice above, you are on the right track for loads.
Having a pair of TI cylinders, I'll repeat another caution.
Do not try to over-clean the cylinder.
That means no harsh scrubbing or aggressive solvents that will damage the protective coating.
I have had excellent results cleaning with Bore Tech C4 Carbon Remover

 

[austintexas]

carry pistol

If you are going to carry this revolver, I would decide what ammo you are going to carry, range test it and find out how it shoots. If you are satisfied with carry load, then load up your range ammo with reduced loads for practice. It doesn't take hot ammo to kill paper. I wouldn't worry about flame cutting with the few rounds you are going to have to shoot to see where the gun groups. You are not going to have a shoot out where you shoot lots of Hi-v hot ammo.
SWCA 892

 

[44R]

With advice above, you are on the right track for loads.
Having a pair of TI cylinders, I'll repeat another caution.
Do not try to over-clean the cylinder.
That means no harsh scrubbing or aggressive solvents that will damage the protective coating.
I have had excellent results cleaning with Bore Tech C4 Carbon Remover

Yes, I had heard about that coating and only I use Ballistol and a nylon brush. Ballistol, as you may know is a WWI vintage mineral oil for lubricant and cleaning. I think it is safe for this purpose unless you think otherwise.

What powder do you use for loads in your Ti cylinder guns?

 

[44R]

If you are going to carry this revolver, I would decide what ammo you are going to carry, range test it and find out how it shoots. If you are satisfied with carry load, then load up your range ammo with reduced loads for practice. It doesn't take hot ammo to kill paper. I wouldn't worry about flame cutting with the few rounds you are going to have to shoot to see where the gun groups. You are not going to have a shoot out where you shoot lots of Hi-v hot ammo.
SWCA 892

I think the Ti cylinder can be very sensitive to hot 125 grain loads. I occasionally like to fire a few full house loads for practice.

So a longer bullet and a different powder. But which powder?

 

[TAROMAN]

My TI cylinder guns are 357 and 9mm.
I mostly load with Vihtavuori powders, as they are very clean burning and not "hot" like Titegroup and similar.
Personally I prefer heavier bullets, 135 in 9mm and 160 in 38/357.
Have shot a lot of coated bullets in speed steel games with no problem at all.

 

[STORMINORMAN]

I think the Ti cylinder can be very sensitive to hot 125 grain loads. I occasionally like to fire a few full house loads for practice.

So a longer bullet and a different powder. But which powder?

How many hundred 357 Magnum rounds do you anticipate shooting every week...?

Every month?

Avoiding powders known to being "hotter " than the "average" is probably a worthwhile consideration...

Unless S&W advises you not to shoot reloaded ammunition, or prohibits using certain factory rounds (or powders?) it would seem to be reasonable to try and mirror a factory load you have confidence in: i.e., the Hornady 140r XTP @ .... Ooooops! They don't sell loaded ammo in this weight and caliber!

But Hodgdons has load data for this bullet with no less than 18 different powders ranging:from MILD (under 1K) to WILD (as in over 1700fps)!

There should be something (actually, virtually EVERYTHING) you need available: you just need to find out what makes you happy and puts your concerns to rest.

Cheers!

P.S. Hornady lists 7 different powders for this bullet...

 

[44R]

How many hundred 357 Magnum rounds do you anticipate shooting every week...?

Every month?
. . . .
Cheers!

P.S. Hornady lists 7 different powders for this bullet...

Maybe going up to 135-140+ grain pills is enough. I think the problem is that the erosion can happen very quickly, so experimenting is not a good option.

It doesn't take much. Exactly two cylinders (ie, 16 rounds) of the described Hornady 125 grain "Critical Defense" and two boxes of standard pressure 38 S&W Special are enough to start erosion. This is a great gun, but there are apparently certain factory loadings that are not good for it, not just under 120 grains. As I understand the videos and different forums, people who shoot 158's do not experience this.

When I reload, I'll use those 140 XTP's and some "cooler" powder. Maybe it's enough just to use bigger bullets.

 

[Skeet 028]

I think you will find Unique to be a very useful powder. If you load by recommended velocities/pressures...you really won't get to the point of flame cutting etc with the Ti cylinders...and really shouldn't get the same with true 38 Sp loads. I had one of the revolvers like yours. I considered it one of the hardest to shoot with any factory 357 Mag ammo. I carry a 4 inch 41 mag in bear country and load it with Unique...but a heavier than normal bullet. Learn shooting your new gun with less than max loads. you will eventually find a load that will feel perfect for you. I used to carry a 3 1/2 inch 27...hard to really conceal easily

 

[44R]

Maybe an interesting update. I exchanged emails with S&W on this subject today and was told that 158 grain bullets loading SAAMI specification would prevent flame cutting.

Skeet 028, thank you. Good old Unique. Subject to all the usual important caveats, what's a good mild loading for jacketed hollow point 158's with Unique? The old 158 duty loads will be nothing but punishment in this revolver.

 

[STORMINORMAN]

Well, 7gr ought to get you to almost 1K...

A good 38 Special velocity that won't cause undue stress to your forcing cone, your Ti cylinder or your wrist.

Cheers!