.38 Special or .357 for EDC

So, I’m a K-frame fan. I’ve got one (1) .357, a Model 19, but I primarily carry a J-frame or a K-frame revolver (Model 10 with a thin barrel or a Model 64) stoked with Hornady critical defense 125gr +P hollow points. The magnum does have .357 loaded, but it’s rarely carried due to being really nice and the size of the barrel profile. I’m debating whether to pick up a Model 65-4 in really good shape, and it would replace the Model 64 that I do carry frequently. along those lines, is there a practical reason to transition from .38 to .357 in the context of EDC in suburban America? Note- I’ve also got 9mm, .40 S&W and .45ACP options available, but I do find revolvers easier to get along with on a daily basis. I’m just not sure that I’d actually gain anything from transitioning to .357.

I found this from @LoboGunLeather back in 2023

Post in thread 'Self Defense: 357 Magnum VS .38 Special'
https://smith-wessonforum.com/threads/self-defense-357-magnum-vs-38-special.706675/post-141800819

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Parsing, it seems like I might be underestimating .38 Special, but I’m far from an expert or even experienced. Is this a move to make?

Thanks!

I have BB 38 spl + P in my CC revolvers. & in my 38 super .
I can't duplicate there load with my hand loading.....

Like anything else of this nature Shot Placement and Adequate Penetration are far more important than any other criteria. I grant you that something really nasty is more effective IF YOU CAN GET GOOD HITS WITH IT but many people just do not practice enough or train enough to ensure that with very high performance loads, especially with small or medium weight weapons. Two .38 wadcutters in the gut will probably do the better job than a .357 +P+ JHP zooming past the bad guy's ear.

Due to time OTJ as well as assignments, I am very comfortable with 148/150gr. hardcast wadcutters in .38 spl. A speed strip with 158gr. JHP for easy reloads floats my boat. And yeah, I stick these in a .357 too.

Controlled multiple follow up shots are my objective. I shoot DAO J frames and a 3" DAO K6s. This is the way I've been training since 1973. Don't need no stinkin' hammer.

Standard pressure .38 spl. has been knocking the stuffing out of whatever needed it's stuffing rearranged for 100 years. "is there a practical reason to transition from .38 to .357 in the context of EDC in suburban America? " YES! Because you want to. practical reasons my left foot.

Shoot what you are comfortable with in practice. In a crisis situation you are not going to notice what is going on.
I used to shoot on a collegiate pistol team (they actually had those 60 years ago). I had a High Standard Supermatic Citation and then I bought a M41 Smith. A single action trigger pull is far more accurate than double action trigger pulls. However you should practice double action with a revolver. It is what you will be using in a crisis. Then use the revolver and ammo you can can carry and shoot best in practice. That for me is 38 +p in a 2 1/2 in Model 19

A .357 brings significantly more power to the table, and therefore increases the chance of one hit resolving the problem. However, the key word here is “hit”. IF you can reliably Hit with a .357 then go for it. If however you have trouble, esp getting off a second accurate shot then you’re better served with something YOU can shoot better. A hit with a .22 is more effective than a miss with a .44.

I found that I am most accurate overall consistently with my government 1911 or my SIG 40 Cal, but I’m right up there next to them with the K frames in almost everything else.

Skeeter Skelton was quite enamored of the 2.5" M-19 when it was first introduced, later changed his mind, cited muzzle blast and flash, found a 4" no harder to conceal. Bill Jordan said the 38 Special was the most powerful round the average man-i.e. most of us-could hope to master. Jeff Cooper noted all the magna needed a long runway to get up to speed. And hits with Minor Calibers hurt worse than misses with majors.

The 357 Magnum is a terrific round - no argument there! The problem I have with carrying one in a populated area is it can be a little "too good" and has the potential for excessive penetration and can do much damage if a bullet goes astray. Yes, any caliber that goes astray can be devastating but the 357 has a lot of punching power - more so than many. Muzzle flash from most short barreled, magnum revolvers is not your friend at night and heavy recoil can slow down follow up shots drastically. Reloading a revolver is also a bit harder and slower than just shoving a new magazine in the pistol. Of course we also can talk about the 6 onboard rounds which is not exactly high capacity any longer. Couple that to the fact that K frames are somewhat bulky, heavy and larger than many Micro 9's these days and are just harder to conceal, I don't know that they make great EDC's now. Yes, GREAT for the woods, but I am up in the air around town!

I know I will probably get flamed for this, but WHY some like carrying big, heavy bulky SD handguns that are harder to conceal, hold less rounds on board and are much harder to shoot, bewilders me. The argument about revolvers being much more reliable and less prone to failure have pretty much gone by the wayside these days as the small EDC pistols have become extremely reliable. As an old dyed in the wool revolver fan I never thought I'd switch to a Micro 9 but after actually shooting a few hundred rounds out of one I could just no longer lie to myself. My Sig P365 covers all the bases and I feel much better armed with that pistol and the 21 or more rounds I have with me than a wheel gun that is harder to shoot accurately and requires much better skills and practice to reload efficiently.

On another note while the vulnerable 5 shot 38 Spl. J frame is still a good SD round I no longer feel 5 rounds onboard are adequate in today's gang ridden, crazy, "life has little value" world. Please don't tell me you live in a great neighborhood and gangs don't come there - we now know that is rapidly changing!!! I feel more warm and fuzzy knowing I have 11 onboard with another 10, 12, or 18 as a back up mag.

While I still own many J frames, I have not carried one in 6 years. Highly doubt I will ever again. But yes, my 3" M65 still gets carried in the woods. Hard to beat it for woods protection.

Eh, I really dig the aesthetic of the wood-and-steel…and I think there’s a practical purpose to it too. A revolver or a 1911 are visually distinctly different from a polymer pistol with an extended magazine or an AR-pattern rifle; given that most people are idiots who only know guns from CoD or something, I’d rather foster the misconception that it’s an elephant gun I’m extremely good at than play into the stereotype of “black assault gun”. That, a good holster, plus reasonable dress (no sagging pants, clean, not looking crazy) is my best defense against getting mistaken as a lunatic.

Rocketmedic40 said:

Eh, I really dig the aesthetic of the wood-and-steel…and I think there’s a practical purpose to it too. A revolver or a 1911 are visually distinctly different from a polymer pistol with an extended magazine or an AR-pattern rifle; given that most people are idiots who only know guns from CoD or something, I’d rather foster the misconception that it’s an elephant gun I’m extremely good at than play into the stereotype of “black assault gun”. That, a good holster, plus reasonable dress (no sagging pants, clean, not looking crazy) is my best defense against getting mistaken as a lunatic.

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No one over the age of 50 can argue the looks, aesthetics and well crafted beauty of an old style wheel gun or 1911 - can't argue that point! I am just being a practical as far as EDC goes. Remember, if one carries discreetly, no one will see our ugly plastic guns - lol.

chief38 said:

No one over the age of 50 can argue the looks, aesthetics and well crafted beauty of an old style wheel gun or 1911 - can't argue that point! I am just being a practical as far as EDC goes. Remember, if one carries discreetly, no one will see our ugly plastic guns - lol.

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It’s not even they’re hidden that I’m worried about; it’s in the event of ever having to reveal it.

chief38 said:

…I know I will probably get flamed for this, but WHY some like carrying big, heavy bulky SD handguns that are harder to conceal, hold less rounds on board and are much harder to shoot, bewilders me. The argument about revolvers being much more reliable and less prone to failure have pretty much gone by the wayside these days as the small EDC pistols have become extremely reliable. As an old dyed in the wool revolver fan I never thought I'd switch to a Micro 9 but after actually shooting a few hundred rounds out of one I could just no longer lie to myself. My Sig P365 covers all the bases and I feel much better armed with that pistol and the 21 or more rounds I have with me than a wheel gun that is harder to shoot accurately and requires much better skills and practice to reload efficiently.

On another note while the vulnerable 5 shot 38 Spl. J frame is still a good SD round I no longer feel 5 rounds onboard are adequate in today's gang ridden, crazy, "life has little value" world. Please don't tell me you live in a great neighborhood and gangs don't come there - we now know that is rapidly changing!!! I feel more warm and fuzzy knowing I have 11 onboard with another 10, 12, or 18 as a back up mag.

While I still own many J frames, I have not carried one in 6 years. Highly doubt I will ever again. But yes, my 3" M65 still gets carried in the woods. Hard to beat it for woods protection.

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I certainly won’t flame you, but I will disagree.

I am of the opinion that capacity is overrated. While more is certainly better, the advantage is not linear. A handgun with two rounds is probably twice as good as a single-shot, but 15 rounds isn’t three times as good as five.

Based on where I live and the type of activities I participate in a deadly force encounter, while highly unlikely, will almost certainly be very close and very quick. In such circumstances there is a lot to be said for having a hand already gripping the gun in your pocket.

Life is all about choices. I’m perfectly comfortable with mine, and I hope the same is true for others.

To answer the original question

“is there a practical reason to transition from .38 to .357 in the context of EDC in suburban America”

NO

One of my goals in a lethal confrontation is to hurt the bad guy and not myself. Touching off a 35,000 + psi short barreled handgun in a confined space will hurt ME.

Any time you can put your handgun cartridge in a rifle and gain 500+ feet per second you no longer have a handgun cartridge. You have a carbine cartridge.

All of that unharnessed power in a handgun goes into a (literally) blinding flash and a mind numbing, ear damaging concussion.

How is that going to help your ability to survive the fight?

Flat point .38 Specials will get the job done nicely thank you.

Somewhat off original topic, but...Twenty years ago I would have agreed that even a five-shot revolver is adequate for personal defense (as opposed to police duty or police off-duty) use. The stats have shifted over the years. The probability of having to deal with a pack of feral humans, as opposed to one or two of them, is much higher than it was back in the day. I still carry a round gun on occasion but my usual EDC now (to the point I own two of them) is a Springfield EMP (9mm frame compact 9mm) and two spare magazines. It carries well, shoots well, fits my hand beautifully, does not beat up my arthritic hands and, if push comes to show, throws more lead faster than a round gun.

I think that the general improvement in ammunition makes the .38 Special more than adequate for SD purposes. I can handle my 9mms and .38s well, though I need to practice more.

robertrwalsh said:

The probability of having to deal with a pack of feral humans, as opposed to one or two of them, is much higher than it was back in the day.

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Oh, you bet!

It dawned on me one day that I could carry a "10 shot" 38 Special.

Two lightweight J frames weigh about the same as one all steel 6 shot K/L/N. And if one of the J's is in a cross draw holster I could get to it without undoing my seat belt or ripping of a bunch off clothing.

The carry weight is distributed around the belt and a gun would be available to either hand if needed.

Some folks call it a New York reload.

With the same logic one could manage a "12 shot" 32 Magnum loadout.

Add a speed strip or two and you could have 10-12 immediate, manageable shots and 20-24 rounds available on short order in a very concealable package.

Just sayin'.

I believe thee OP's question was specifically about the 38 Special v the 357. I have two revolvers that I carry in those calibers, both Model 66: a four inch and a 2 1/2. I carry the 2 1/2 more ofter than the four inch (note I misidentified the 2 1/2 as a Model 19 above). If we want to drift into automatic pistols then it is an entirely different question, not answering the OP