1st post: bought M&P Shield single stack... slide release is TIGHT

[gonerydin]

S&W says NOT.

I don't see that in the Shield 9 manual. However I was reading the manual for my M&P 22 Compact and saw this:

"Press down on the slide stop to release the slide and allow it to carry fully forward on its own under spring tension. Or, pull back on the slide and release it from your grasp. Either action will strip a cartridge from the magazine and seat it in the chamber of the barrel. "
Similar language is in the M&P 380 Shield EZ manual. Non of my M&P pistol manuals specifically state to NOT release the slide by pressing the slide stop.


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[NCW Ray]

I've used the Slide Stop/Catch/Release to drop the slide on all of my auto's for years. So after reading all the "it's a slide stop, not a release" berating's given to people wanting to use it as a release I contacted S&W to see what they have to say about it. They "recommend" the slingshot method, but say you can absolutely use it to release the slide, although it might need breaking in.

Here is the chat I had with Rachel on S&W Chat:

 

[CB3]

One should remember when dealing with customer service reps at any large company, you will rarely get the same answer from three different individuals. Even manuals are written to the level of the lowest common denominator and to legally protect the manufacturer and simplify their business (to make more $$).

When it comes to setting up and running my guns, I do what benefits my needs, not their's. As long as I can articulate a reasonable explanation why a modification is an improvement for me, I am comfortable.

 

[N4KVE]

I had tried out a rental Shield prior to purchase. It must have had 10,000+ rounds on the recoil spring. All you had to do was lightly tap the back of the slide and it would fly forward.

That's because hundred's of idiots who don't know how to properly use a gun shot that rental. When I worked at a range that rented guns, it amazed me how many people had no idea how to rack the slide, & lock it back. I wouldn't rent them the gun. So I offered this one idiot a revolver, & asked him how he would load the ammo in it. He had absolutely no idea how to open the cylinder to load it. I told him we could offer him a one on one beginner class for not much more than the range fee, & ammo, but this insulted him. I said "so you want me to loan you a gun, & you have absolutely no idea how to use it"? So I'm assuming some ranges hand guns to people without even asking if they know how to use it. GARY

 

[SoCalDep]

S&W says NOT.

When's the last time you spoke to them? I do a lot... just spoke to them at the shot show. I teach for a very large department that teaches to release the slide with the slide stop/release... and
I frequently work with another very large department that issues the M&P and teaches to use the slide stop to release the slide. You quoted my post that asked to change my mind. Not only did you fail at that, but offered no substantial contrary argument.

You don't have to use the slide stop to release the slide but if you argue that it's wrong, then YOU are.

 

[N4KVE]

And for that matter, you could drive to work in low gear every day. It will get you there, but will cause more wear on your car. But it will get you there. GARY.

 

[gunny4053]

There's an awful lot of right, wrong, and indifferent opinions going on, so let's see what the manual says.

From the Shield Safety & Instruction manual: Pull the slide to the rear and release it, allowing it to carry fully forward. This strips a cartridge from the magazine and seats it in the chamber of the barrel.

From the M&P Pistols Safety and Instruction manual: Pull the slide to the rear, press down on the slide stop to release the slide and allow it to carry fully forward. This strips a cartridge from the magazine and seats it in the chamber of the barrel.

So the sling shot is used for both, but on the M&P Pistols it actually says to do both at the same time. Is it the best or fastest, good question, but it is the recommended method straight from the manual. If it's recommended, I must assume S&W sees it as the safest method as well. You can play he said, she said all day, but if you follow what "we" said in the manual, there will never be a liability question, and firearms manufacturers are all about avoiding liability.

OP, it's up to what works for you. Good luck and good shooting.

 

[Horn]

Not A Slide Release

The ergonomics are great - but... the slide release is really hard to work with the thumb.

Anybody else had this? If so, I wager this will loose up with use. Correct?

Its not a slide release. Its a slide lock. I know a lot of guys use these for a release___So does Hollywood.
If you sling shot your pistol you'll like what happens.
Some pistols and some slide locks on some pistols will release the
slide. Many competitive shooters like to be able to release the slide. Some even change them to a larger slide lock.
Basically, you pistol is within spec.
Enjoy but stay safe.
Poli Viejo

 

[SoCalDep]

Its not a slide release. Its a slide lock. I know a lot of guys use these for a release___So does Hollywood.

What is your background and expertise to make such an absolute claim (it is this, not that)?

I ask, because I contend, based on decades of experience in law enforcement, training from some of the top shooters and instructors in the industry (including members and former members of various special operations units) and personal observations training thousands of law enforcement officers who use the M&P and god-forbid the slide stop/lock/release/whatever... Oh yea... a bit of shooting through my own M&Ps and Shield... in the many 10s of thousands of rounds... oh and also overseeing the testing of the Shield for my department where one fired over 15,000 rounds and the other over 18,000 rounds...

That you are flat out wrong.

I have a Safariland Advanced Pistol rating, a FAST coin, and twice shot a 299/300 on the FBI instructor course, but hey...maybe I'm wrong.

 

[shadowrider]

O/P my 9 Pro was so stiff when new I thought it was broken. It'll loosen up with use. I also use the slide release and it's just faster, all day, every day. I demonstrate it in a class that I take regularly. It drives the instructors nuts. They teach the slingshot method.

I've also had them swear up and down that inserting a mag firmly enough to drop the slide will fail to feed a round sometimes. Never had that happen on any of my 6 M&Ps in multiple calibers. EVER. In literally hundreds of reloads. I always point out to them that M&Ps aren't Glocks. It trips their trigger. LOL!

 

[SiGfever]

I had a Kahr PM9 that the instruction manual said to Lock the Slide back, and then release the Slide Stop on a full mag to chamber a round". I paraphrase.

 

[CB3]

I had a Kahr PM9 that the instruction manual said to Lock the Slide back, and then release the Slide Stop on a full mag to chamber a round". I paraphrase.

From the current online Kahr manual, page 16, Loading:

"Insert the magazine into the magazine well at the base of the grip until the magazine catch engages fully.

"Pull the slide fully to the rear and lock it back using the Slide Stop. Next push down on the Slide Stop to chamber the first round into the barrel. Do not chamber a round by pulling back on the slide and letting go of the slide. This may cause the slide to not go fully into battery."

Will someone PLEASE tell Kahr they should not be advising people to use the Stop as a release?

In truth, I have had three Kahrs and really liked them. Once broken in, you could use any method to load, including from a locked back slide, that you might use on any other gun with a slide lock. I never loaded a full mag into a gun with a closed slide, then locked back the slide, then released the slide by pushing down on the slide stop. If the slide was closed with a loaded magazine inserted, I would use the overhand retraction and release method. When done properly, it worked just fine on my Kahrs.

The point is, Kahr recognizes that pulling back on the slide can be done incorrectly causing a failure to go into battery. With a reduced friction slide stop, using it as a release on a locked back slide ensures that the recoil springs will drive the slide into battery without inference.

This is Kahr's way of preventing problems with their guns, especially when new and the recoil springs are stiff. It seems kind of silly to me, but so do parts of almost all other manufacturers' manuals, because they are written for them with minimum instruction and not for us with maximum options.

Follow only what is written in a manual and you will have reduced usefulness from your gun.

 

[Pef]

Wow. There's a lot of thinking about the slide stop on the Shield.

From the manual: Pull the slide to the rear and release it, allowing it to carry fully forward. This strips a cartridge from the magazine and seats it in the chamber of the barrel.

FWIW, I've always used the slingshot on the Shield and I have never had a problem in over 1.2k rounds. That's about 173 magazines.... I usually slingshot to load my guns....

 

[N4KVE]

I had a Kahr PM9 that the instruction manual said to Lock the Slide back, and then release the Slide Stop on a full mag to chamber a round". I paraphrase.

Kahr is owned by a religious fanatic. The MOONIES. I would never own any product they make, or trust anything they say. A Glock armorer once yelled at me when I "dropped the slide" using the lever, & showed me the "slingshot" method. It's been that way ever since. I know, the M&P's are not Glocks, but if you disassembled both side by side, you'd be amazed how similar they are. Funny Glock doesn't sue them. Wait a minute, they did, & they won. GARY.

 

[gunny4053]

What is your background and expertise to make such an absolute claim (it is this, not that)?

I ask, because I contend, based on decades of experience in law enforcement, training from some of the top shooters and instructors in the industry (including members and former members of various special operations units) and personal observations training thousands of law enforcement officers who use the M&P and god-forbid the slide stop/lock/release/whatever... Oh yea... a bit of shooting through my own M&Ps and Shield... in the many 10s of thousands of rounds... oh and also overseeing the testing of the Shield for my department where one fired over 15,000 rounds and the other over 18,000 rounds...

That you are flat out wrong.

I have a Safariland Advanced Pistol rating, a FAST coin, and twice shot a 299/300 on the FBI instructor course, but hey...maybe I'm wrong.

I shook hands with Gen. Depuy, Gen. Schwarzkopf, Gen. George S. Patton, Jr., and Admiral Long. I fired the M198 155mm howitzer when it was the XM 198, before the military even bought it. I was a Drill Sgt., a firearms instructor, an Instructor at the NCO Academy, an Artillery Mechanic, a Gun crew chief, Gunnery Sgt., Chief of Firing Battery, 1SG, and Operations Sgt. In over 20 years in the Military, the breech block on a howitzer is still a breech block. According to Smith and Wesson's own manual, the pictures show and the description is still listed as a "slide stop". So unless S&W hired you to specifically to change the nomenclature of one of their parts, I'm pretty sure it's still a "slide stop". Use it as you please, but don't criticize others for calling it what S&W has identified it as.

 

[N4KVE]

I shook hands with Gen. Depuy, Gen. Schwarzkopf, Gen. George S. Patton, Jr., and Admiral Long. I fired the M198 155mm howitzer when it was the XM 198, before the military even bought it. I was a Drill Sgt., a firearms instructor, an Instructor at the NCO Academy, an Artillery Mechanic, a Gun crew chief, Gunnery Sgt., Chief of Firing Battery, 1SG, and Operations Sgt. In over 20 years in the Military, the breech block on a howitzer is still a breech block. According to Smith and Wesson's own manual, the pictures show and the description is still listed as a "slide stop". So unless S&W hired you to specifically to change the nomenclature of one of their parts, I'm pretty sure it's still a "slide stop". Use it as you please, but don't criticize others for calling it what S&W has identified it as.

Hey, I'm with you 1000%, but it's not correct to end a sentence with a preposition. GARY

 

[gunny4053]

MY bad.

 

[Ransom]

Hey, I'm with you 1000%, but it's not correct to end a sentence with a preposition. GARY

"Ending a sentence with a preposition is something up with which I will not put." Winston Churchill [emoji39]

 

[gunny4053]

And we digress.

 

[Flyingfool]

What is your background and expertise to make such an absolute claim (it is this, not that)?

I ask, because I contend, based on decades of experience in law enforcement, training from some of the top shooters and instructors in the industry (including members and former members of various special operations units) and personal observations training thousands of law enforcement officers who use the M&P and god-forbid the slide stop/lock/release/whatever... Oh yea... a bit of shooting through my own M&Ps and Shield... in the many 10s of thousands of rounds... oh and also overseeing the testing of the Shield for my department where one fired over 15,000 rounds and the other over 18,000 rounds...

That you are flat out wrong.

I have a Safariland Advanced Pistol rating, a FAST coin, and twice shot a 299/300 on the FBI instructor course, but hey...maybe I'm wrong.

That all may be... but you would have to be the Hulk or use two hands to get my shield to release. Even the range instructor who also shoots tens of thousands of rounds per year also could not work it.

So I suppose I can send this clearly malfunctioning gun back to S&W. I am sure they will modify the slide or the stop/release/lock so that it works properly.

Or will S&W send it back unchanged saying that my weapon operates exactly as designed/properly?