Annoyed at S&W

[Engineer1911]

An EXCELLENT summary of why I own 20 steel or stainless steel 1911s made by different manufacturers. My S&W 1911 is near the top of the list. 45 acp leads the herd, but there are 40 S&W and 9 mm just because. Who cares about a tacticool reload -- draw another 1911!

 

[clcdawg]

Sorry for your bad experience. I keep thinking i need a Glock 19 but when I went to the range and rented one I shot my M&P better. I'm not saying I still will not get one but it has been put on the back burner for now. I love my M&P and have had no issues with it. The "auto forward" bothers me a little but not that much and my G30sf has done it before.While I am personally a big fan of the M&P line I realize it may not be for everyone and respect their opinion.

 

[A2 Stippling]

I am sending my 3 year old M&P Pro 9mm back to S&W tomorrow due an increase in failure to extract. I am having one per magazine (new S&W mags as well). Started within the past month. S&W quickly sent me a pre-paid Fedex label and will honor their lifetime warranty...even though I am 2nd owner (about 2k through the barrel).

I love my M&P but also read that it has it's problems. I love my G23 (carry gun) as well...but for different reasons.

Hope your gun gets/got better. I really enjoy shooting the M&P series. My 9c is a great gun which has never jammed or had any malfunctions...just hope to get the Pro 9mm back in the game!

 

[vector16]

Vector16,

You knew going in you were barking in the wrong dog house and kudos to you for speaking your mind 'against the grain'. I think it's healthy for the forums.

I have a Springfield XDm, several Glocks and my favorite for 'all around, in town' is an M&P 40c. I have a smattering of others, but those are 'the big three' in terms of popularity I think. Each is a fine gun, each is a bit different with its own pros and cons, but overall, the M&P feels best to me.

I hope you didn't buy a 4th Generation Glock!? I can't believe they messed up so bad on the latest series. I know die hard Glock fans who feel they're putting what's practically a franchise at risk. I could see the swap out back straps, but they really screwed the blue ribbon pooch on the 4th Gen. Glocks changes in other ways, IMO.

G3 G17 is what i got. G4s are not legal in CA and I don't like the trigger bar design in the G4s anyway

 

[Magnum27]

Sorry for your bad experience. I keep thinking i need a Glock 19 but when I went to the range and rented one I shot my M&P better. I'm not saying I still will not get one but it has been put on the back burner for now. I love my M&P and have had no issues with it. The "auto forward" bothers me a little but not that much and my G30sf has done it before.While I am personally a big fan of the M&P line I realize it may not be for everyone and respect their opinion.

I really want to get a Glock 17 and also have shot the 19. But the 2 times I have shot them against the MP the MP was MUCH better.

 

[vector16]

I guess, like me, I depends on what you wanted in the gun. I wanted the short reset and ease of cleaning. The reset was more important to me than anything else. Glock, as of a few years ago only had a 1 year warrany on their products. Now they have a lifetime warranty. I also have large hands so the palm swells that came with the M&P was not that much of a concern, I am also the only one that will ever be shooting the gun so the extra parts were just extra parts i did not need. When the time comes for me to buy another 1911, S&W will be at the top of my list unless CA makes the SR1911 legal. I was also happy with the G17 purchase now that it has been a few days and I started looking into accessories for it. The extra mags run anywhere from $15-$25 and some of the other items like the slide lock and the extra recoil springs are very cheap also. The APEX trigger for the M&P is $159 and the 3.5lb ghost trigger for the Glock is $17. S&W might make some improvements to the M&P this year and I will look at them again at that time. The reason that Glock is so good at making the gun they make is probably, all their guns a basically the same gun, IMO. If I would have thought the XD was the better choice, we would have been having this discussion about that gun. The reset on the XD9 is just too far forward.
Either way you go, no matter what other gun you get, if its not a S&W on a S&W forum you're gonna catch alot of flak for it. But in the end, its not the gun they bought for me. If they would have been so kind to offer to buy me the M&P when I was looking at the guns, I would not have turned it down, but they did not and it was not their dime so they should just learn to live with my decision. In the end it really does not effect them in any way, shape or form. Its good the have other choices if not we might as well be living in China.

 

[walkin' trails]

You did make the right choice. I carry a M&P 45 piece of junk everyday. I have layer out my agency's problems here multiple times. Im on my second one. Everyone here tells me I'm crazy, there's no way the M&P is junk etc. All I can do is laugh. Last March at qualification numerous pistols were pulled from service on the spot due to various reasons. Everyone will chime in and suggest 100,000 reasons OTHER than the gun is junk to explain all the failures.

Personally I am a big time 3rd generation guy. We traded our 4566s for this thing.

Anyway, your original notion that the M&P is junk is correct. I will wager the majority of the posters after me will pontificate about how THEY have never had problems with theirs, the ________ police department is issuing it so it can't be junk, and a slew of reasons why it isn't junk. I wonder if they're doing it to feel better about the money they spent, the choice they made, or out of brand loyalty?

Specifically, what kinds fo problems was your pistol having? And were the problems common to all department pistols? What was the approximate date the were acquired?

 

[vector16]

You did make the right choice. I carry a M&P 45 piece of junk everyday. I have layer out my agency's problems here multiple times. Im on my second one. Everyone here tells me I'm crazy, there's no way the M&P is junk etc. All I can do is laugh. Last March at qualification numerous pistols were pulled from service on the spot due to various reasons. Everyone will chime in and suggest 100,000 reasons OTHER than the gun is junk to explain all the failures.

Personally I am a big time 3rd generation guy. We traded our 4566s for this thing.

Anyway, your original notion that the M&P is junk is correct. I will wager the majority of the posters after me will pontificate about how THEY have never had problems with theirs, the ________ police department is issuing it so it can't be junk, and a slew of reasons why it isn't junk. I wonder if they're doing it to feel better about the money they spent, the choice they made, or out of brand loyalty?

I like your way of thinking. That is straight up and to the truth.
I have recieved multiple PM's from people that have said "the slide is not supposed to do the auto close, it is a defect". "No gun should ever do this". So in my opinion everyone that says they like it are either FOS of they just don't want to send the gun back to S&W to have the problem fixed, either way I am still right with the decission I made, for me. Its not your their problem.

 

[RussellD]

I love my S&W revolvers. Carry an issued .40 M&P at work. There is a Glock in the nightstand beside my bed. While I like the ergonomics of the M&P it has yet to earn the reliability ratings of my Glock. At 50 years old I have been through the 1911 phase, and have come to believe that of you want a revolver buy a 20 to 30 year Smith. If you want an auto that just plain works out of the box buy a Glock. Smith has yet to bring to bring to market an Auto that compares and competes with the rest.

What do i carry almost every day when off work and as a backup? A vintage model 49. Yes I am an old school $%^&.

Flame proof suit on...YMMV.

 

[vstromrider]

If you dont like them dont buy them. and the need to exaggerate to make a point is typical net stuff. I believe this guy before I will take your word on it.Tactical-Life.com » Gun Test: Smith & Wesson M&P .45ACP

 

[turbo38gn]

If you dont like them dont buy them. and the need to exaggerate to make a point is typical net stuff. I believe this guy before I will take your word on it.Tactical-Life.com » Gun Test: Smith & Wesson M&P .45ACP

Here's an except I think was pretty telling...

I tested the sample gun from my 25-yard bench on an MTM gun rest. I followed my usual protocol of measuring five-shot groups for an indication of how well the gun would group for an experienced shooter on a calm day with minimum wobble, and measuring again for the best three shots to factor out human error and to get a prediction of the pistol’s inherent mechanical accuracy.

Winchester 230-grain Ranger high-tech hollow points have earned an excellent reputation “on the street” with American police departments. Five shots measured 3.6 inches center-to-center within the generous 4-inch limit generally specified as “acceptable service pistol accuracy.” However, the best three shots grouped only 1.35 inches apart. That was more like it.

Federal Classic 185-grain JHP was next. This is a soft-kicking load that has earned its chops on the street, and has also earned a reputation for extraordinary accuracy. It has frequently proven itself the most accurate ammo in various .45ACP tests, and came through again this time. The overall five-shot group measured 2.15 inches, and the best three cluster was an extraordinary 0.20 of an inch, a measurement center-to-center that was less than half the size of a single .45 hole. If multiple observers hadn’t been spotting the hits, we would have thought it was a double instead of a triple. The three hits were in one hole that measured 0.55 of an inch apart. The best four out of five hits were 1.15 inches.

The gun didn’t like one particular load for accuracy, but other than that, I have no complaints with it. Joe Bergeron designed the M&P .45 for battle, not competition, but interestingly enough it does pretty well in competition too.

My friend Chris Christian, an outdoor writer, is a big fan of the M&P and has been shooting the 9mm version for some months now in IDPA competition. In July of 2007, he used the .45ACP version (slick slide, no thumb safety and no disconnector) to shoot against the 1911s in the Custom Defense Pistol category at a match in Jacksonville, Florida. Chris came in first place overall in that division by a significant margin.

 

[crracer_712]

One might ask the same type of questions as to why you are taking such a derogatory tone. Because obviously, since YOUR gun had a problem, that, by default, makes every other M&P that was ever made, a piece of "junk", right? Never mind the fact that many people are happy with their M&P's, right? Since you've proclaimed them "junk", they must be.

The problem is, even if what you claim is true, the tone you've taken sounds more like sour grapes than anything else, and will probably be treated as such by most of the people who read your reply. I would guess your attitude is the reason why you aren't being taken seriously.

Actually that claim about him being a big Gen 3 guy is the reason he's doing it. And like he said about the M&P guy defending his pistol to feel better about his purchase, I'd say the pot is calling the kettle black here again.

 

[turbo38gn]

Actually that claim about him being a big Gen 3 guy is the reason he's doing it. And like he said about the M&P guy defending his pistol to feel better about his purchase, I'd say the pot is calling the kettle black here again.

Actually, that's not true at all. He doesn't have to, nor does anyone else that likes M&P's, knock the Gen 3's.. to feel good about anything. So I guess maybe you can try another excuse to justify your 'stuff"

 

[cshoff]

Actually that claim about him being a big Gen 3 guy is the reason he's doing it. And like he said about the M&P guy defending his pistol to feel better about his purchase, I'd say the pot is calling the kettle black here again.

Of course it was. It was an attitude problem, plain and simple.

 

[cshoff]

Actually, that's not true at all. He doesn't have to, nor does anyone else that likes M&P's, knock the Gen 3's.. to feel good about anything. So I guess maybe you can try another excuse to justify your 'stuff"

I think you may have misunderstood what crracer was getting at with his reply.

 

[crracer_712]

Actually, that's not true at all. He doesn't have to, nor does anyone else that likes M&P's, knock the Gen 3's.. to feel good about anything. So I guess maybe you can try another excuse to justify your 'stuff"

Hey, I don't own a Glock or an M&P pistol. I wasn't the one trying to justify my 'stuff'. Nor do I, my stuff is my stuff, I don't have to justify or defend it to anyone.

 

[turbo38gn]

Hey, I don't own a Glock or an M&P pistol. I wasn't the one trying to justify my 'stuff'. Nor do I, my stuff is my stuff, I don't have to justify or defend it to anyone.

Since you don't have to "justify", do I have to apologize... for misunderstanding... sorry, if I misunderstood your response.

 

[crracer_712]

Since you don't have to "justify", do I have to apologize... for misunderstanding... sorry, if I misunderstood your response.

No, I didn't take any offense to anything you said

 

[baxtersmith]

The slide on my Glock 19 has always closed when the magazine is inserted with a slam...I always thought was a good feature.

 

[vector16]

The slide on my Glock 19 has always closed when the magazine is inserted with a slam...I always thought was a good feature.

It is not supposed to do that. Anyway, I was not slamming it in at the time. Well look everyone, If you like to have your guns malfunction on you all the time then that is your deal. I wnat my guns to perform like they were supposed to all the time. Guns ar3e not supposed to load themselves. Just to clarify one more thing incase you did not this either, You gun is not supposed to shoot itself either.

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