Cylinder Stop Timing

[John Patrick]

I handled and did paperwork on a police trade in M65-5 today.

The revolver is in jail awaiting expiration of MD's seven day waiting period.

The price was as right as they seems to get these days but the cylinder stop doesn't fully rise rise into any of the notches prior to the hammer reaching full cock.

The timing is consistent with all six cylinders, with full cock being reached just prior to the cylinder stop rising into the notch - this with a bit of thumb induced drag on the cylinder as it rotates.

I'm think this M65-5 ought to go back to the factory. Any thoughts or suggestions welcome.

Thanks.

 

[Protocall_Design]

It just needs a slightly wider hand to bring the cylinder around sooner. It might be a little better with ammo in the chambers.

 

[John Patrick]

Thanks for the help.

Do you have a recommendation for a source for different thickness hands?

 

[series guy]

If it's very close it may be easier to lightly pein the ratchet teeth.

 

[Protocall_Design]

Original S&W hands come in different thicknesses in the guns, I don't know if you can order a certain size from the factory or not.

 

[John Patrick]

Original S&W hands come in different thicknesses in the guns, I don't know if you can order a certain size from the factory or not.

Numrich has a new oversized factory cylinder stop!

Thanks for the help.

Link to part:
Cylinder Stop, Oversized | Gun Parts Corp.

 

[armorer951]

A new cylinder stop won't solve your carry up problem. As previously suggested in post #2, you'll need a new hand that is .001" - .002" wider than the existing one.

Resolution of the timing issue will likely involve fitting, so if you are not familiar with this issue and fitting a new hand, I would suggest taking it to a trusted/trained local gunsmith or S&W revolver armorer.

 

[Hondo44]

You're experiencing what's known as a "carry up" problem. Not uncommon in well used revolvers; the cyl ratchet teeth are 'upset' and worn. A wider hand (which means it'll be slightly taller) will fix it. But so will just peening the teeth; no new parts needed.

I agree with that posted above, the cyl stop is not the problem. A wider one will not fix the problem and in fact contribute to it.

Easy to fix once the "timing mechanics" of a revolver is understood. If you want to attempt it, I'd recommend getting a repair manual.

Or take it to someone to fix.

 

[fleabus101]

I dont mind mailing you a few hands to try. If you have a mike or a dial or digital 6 inch caliper you can measure your hand that will help me send you a wider few.. PM Me your info if interested.
I first would follow up on Hondo44's suggestion to
lightly peen(tap lightly) the rachet teeth to expand
them outward slightly.. Do advanced search for Carry Up or Cylinder Timing ..per Hondo44's guidance
BTW Thanks Jim, for your past research on action issues, ie, here now, a carry up issue. Your ratchet
peening/ upsetting is all I've ever needed to correct
slow timing on a few older slow 5 screws.
Thanks for sharing your info over the years
Best Randy..

 

[Protocall_Design]

All the ratchets are worn equally now. Peening will probably make them variable. Better to get a wider hand and try that first. I usually only do peening if 1 or 2 are different from the rest.

 

[John Patrick]

I see I mixed up hand and cylinder stop. I was wondering how a wider cylinder stop would help and not make it more difficult for the stop to click home.

I will get a caliper.

The M65 is still in Maryland's seven day wait jail, though I got my Orwellian "Congratulations, you have not been disapproved…" email this morning and will pick it up this afternoon.

All six cylinders are off by the same small amount.

Remarkably, I guess, I did paperwork yesterday on a nickel M19-5 with the same issue. If the timing isn't off the same small amount it's off a little less on the 19. It effects all six cylinders, though in my repeated trials the cylinder stop clicked into one cylinder's recess just as the hammer reached full cock about one out of three tries.

To be sure I'm checking the timing right, you do it by manually cocking the hammer while applying light pressure on the cylinder and watching the cylinder stop, right?

The manual says to do it double action as well, but it's difficult for me to determine if the cylinder stop clicks home trying double action.

Thanks for the help, I really appreciate it.

John Patrick

ETA: I achieved a bit of a milestone the other day when I restored a different M65 police trade in to shooting condition with the replacement of the extractor spring retention cup. I am ridiculously pleased with myself for doing that simple repair, especially since it shot really well yesterday. But baby steps!

 

[steelslaver]

Before you do anything with the hand check the end shake and get it to .001-.002. It can affect carry up if it is larger.

I on the other hand, just changed out the cylinder in a model 12 and need a slightly thinner hand as it binds before full cock

 

[Protocall_Design]

A lot of the newer guns I'm seeing have a too thick hand and bind up a little right at the end of the trigger pull. That will wear in with time, but isn't supposed to be like that. It pushes the chamber to the left edge of the barrel, rather than centered.