New SW1911SC normal or problem!?

I agree with you 100% Your original post the gouge is simply unacceptable. Let us know in the forum what S&W does to correct the issue. I am very sorry for using the term "grease groove". On older molds, dies, fixtures that get dinged up and I have to repair them, I do call it a grease groove.

Thanks Geddy! Love Rush. I got the gun back.. no explanation. Just says:
Performed Service: Evaluate/Repair -> Repaired scratches

I took the gun out. The slide was much, much smoother, no sandpaper grit feel. Ran my finger along the slide burrs are gone.

The gouges look filled but it still looks scratched, which if its just the finish that will wear off fine.. but no explanation of "is this normal", "is it not normal and fixed." They also dinged the barrel nut.. so much for requesting the gun to be looked over good. Wont affect the gun though, so not crying bout it.

So I'm unsure what to do. I may sell it or just shoot it. I have at least 2 months before I can shoot it. Have to wait for my next eval and that my vertebrae fused. I think they will have fused boys, because I have been feeling sick on and off and thats a sign of bone growth, and it hurts like hell sometimes! Thanks for all your help and different opinions. Sorry if I seem like a grumpy old man at times, maybe I shouldn't ache and type lol! I'm gonna take it to my smith that's helping with my AR build. His 1911s are like butter. Have him eyeball it. I think with those burs gone and a possible "fill" material use we may be ok. Jeeze they could of at least blue penned it. lol.
 
Here's the pics. Vinny's this is what your getting back.. Depending on the day of the week it was worked on and whether they were sober. J/K... Kind of. Also he put a round through it so that's good.. Another little test fire. :)





 
Cleaned her all up. The burs on the slide that are gone did it, or some metal pieces were in the slide like others have stated. They are gone now and you can see on the slide edge where the Smith tech filed it down. It's smoother now, but I don't understand why Smith didn't refinish the damaged frame. I did the Qtip test too.. No more snags on the slide or frame like before. Just a scratched up frame groove in the rear that will eventually happen with use?? They don't look too deep and I think it's just the black finish.

I'll tell you this I just oiled her up and she looks pretty (Wilson Combat oil leaves a nice sheen!). I think with the burs gone I will be fine.. Just the black finish. I just wasn't sure if those bits of metal were From the frame or seared bits of metal in there scratching the S out of the gun like Someone said. So I emailed Smith back with pics, commented on Smiths QC, and this should have never happened had they put it down the assembly line properly, I also asked in retrospect to this, why it wasn't refinished and sent back to me all scratched up, since it was a brand new gun.
 
Got a call tag in and waiting on Smith's response to this tune..I just can't accept piss poor service.. They need to try again


How are you! I received back the 1911 today. So I went to break it down, and the slide felt much smoother. The burrs on the slide were smoothed out, perfect! The frame is another story. The repair order (see pic) says performed service: "Evaluate/Repair - Repaired scratches." Though the gouges don't look as deep as they were before(see pic), there are still scratches or would you say this is just removed finish? Did they just fill the gouges, and not refinish it, because it will eventually wear anyways? I can understand normal slide wear... buts its' new. There's no explanation to whether this is normal, and is it supposed to happen? Also they dinged the barrel nut... (see pic), and one of the simple instructions was to look over the gun over real good as it is BRAND NEW! I haven't even shot this gun yet, its brand new, and I get it back more worn than I sent it out. Why does the other side of the frame have no wear? And the other side does? See below.

I have two M&Ps that are flawless guns. I bought Smith & Wesson because of previous experience, warranty, excellent past service, and faith in your brand. Now I feel like I've lost that. I bought a new gun that was marred during manufacturing, because they missed slide burrs or tooled the gun by accident. Then I get it back for warranty work that was specific and it's not refinished from the scratches that were caused by poor Quality Control. Can you give me some kind of explanation for this poor service, and should I be sending this gun back to be refinished to new condition like It should have been when I bought it? I'm an honest man and of principle... This gun should have never left the factory like this. This needs to be made right, and I would appreciate your help in resolving this issue.

Best,
Marty
 
Marty, I understand your frustration with the cosmetic issues. Was the tight slide issue fixed? I have not heard anything from smith. thanks for the update.

vinny
 
Marty, I understand your frustration with the cosmetic issues. Was the tight slide issue fixed? I have not heard anything from smith. thanks for the update.

vinny

Hey Vinny's I broke it down and cleaned/oiled it last night. Just have to finish the bore and it will be back together. Just breaking it down the slide was smoother. Once I get it back together and some good Wilson Lube I'll give you the scoop. I know you can also email Smith with your giun's serial # for a status.
 
Ok so I got a message from the Smith dealer, I think they may be more pissed than I am, after seeing the pics above. Let me remind you this is a Police Armorer, not some rag tag gun shop. They work only with Smith products.
After wiping the slide a frame down nice. I closely inspected the frame and saw a few notches/nicks on the guide rail, probably from the previous burrs. It was hard to get a good angle so this was the best I could get.



I then Wiped down the slide, and once the oil was removed it was apparent where the burrs were removed. Almost looks like the edge of the slide was filed.



I ran a Qtip across the areas and they snagged a little. Heres the areas were they snagged. It is smoother though than before





I lubed it up, assembled it, racked the slide a bit to work in the lube. Much better! I'm still concerned about the above pics, and am full of piss and vinegar stuck on principle. Honestly I think they owe me a new slide and frame, which translates to new gun. So waiting on a call tag. The gun is going back. Obviously I must not just have sand in my crack if the Smith Armorer is pissed about the way this issue was handled, and of course repeat business from a good customer who depend on their arms. It is being put in a manager's hands at Smith.

On the flip side some fun for this poor bugger. God it feels great in the hand. I hope they can make this right. Shes a beaut. All this gloom on this thread, here's something positive. Wilson Combat 10 rounder :)

 

I just picked up this SW1911SC this afternoon.
A dealer bought fourteen guns from us and I took this gun in on trade.
Though the slide was probably racked a few times it hasn’t been fired since the factory and when I took the slide off for this picture it was the first time it has been off since it left the factory.

This pistol doesn’t show any of the more pronounced marks in the left rear frame rail as others have shown.

Its fired case is 04/25/13.

James
 

I just picked up this SW1911SC this afternoon.
A dealer bought fourteen guns from us and I took this gun in on trade.
Though the slide was probably racked a few times it hasn’t been fired since the factory and when I took the slide off for this picture it was the first time it has been off since it left the factory.

This pistol doesn’t show any of the more pronounced marks in the left rear frame rail as others have shown.

Its fired case is 04/25/13.

James

Yea that looks normal to me. Mines boxed up and ready to go back.
 
Some good news today, and felling accomplished! I got that stinkin NY pinned muzzle brake off. New Handguard on, and all reassembled.

NY Compliant Days... Boooooo



Now she's free to be any length she desires!







I'm drooling and my fiancé is jealous... now I have to convert her rifle. Something to burn the midnight oil!!
 
Spoke with Mark at Smith today, and he was nice enough to explain and answer any questions I had. He was very knowledgeable on this gun. So here's the synopsis with this piece:

He explained this is a Blued aluminum frame with small amounts of scandium (steroids). Which I knew. He said it's very soft and it will wear... (Wish I knew that before..) With a blued frame you will see wear, and any slide imperfections will notch off small pieces of the slide on the frame. That's why they filed the frame in those spots and the frame and slide will work itself out and be like butter.
He went on to emphasize again how soft the frame was, and the blueing just makes it more apparent. He also noted the slide and safety scratches that have been the biggest complaint , which we and I both laughed about.
I only asked one more main question. Is this normal and will it affect the reliability of this gun. He said it is normal, and will not affect reliability, and you have a warranty for that. This gun was made to wear this way and it will be fine. Good enough for me, that's all I wanted was reassurance.

So there it is case closed. If you are eyeballing this gun, expect this kind of wear. I'm glad this thread is available for people to see and help warrant their decision on their purchase. Thanks again to everyone for help and different takes on this issue or should I say trend. ;)
 
So its not over yet..
Called back Mark at Smith, left him a short and to the point voicemail, basically stating I let our conversation absorb, had some concerns, and asked for a call back.

He seemed a bit irritated. His walls were totally up. So I kept it to the point.

I told him I spoke with experts, forums, my pop who is a police chief, and a few of his boys about this piece with 1000s round through em. I've seen their guns, as well as pics online, all had normal wear, but no gouges, nicks, or scratches in the frame like mine. I expressed to Mark their reactions, and they would be pissed, and so was I.

I told him this was a QC issue that was missed, and is not my fault and is their responsibility to right. I expressed a lot of expert concerns as well as forum opinions that basically, "this is a poorly assembled pistol, that may be functional, but not well fitted and finished for a gun of this quality. I paid $1300 for a NIB "E -Series" not a "scratch and dent" that I could have bought for $800-900 for. I asked for the gun to be replaced, as well as my faith in their brand. I have two M&Ps and planned on purchasing a Shield and a revolver. I simply stated if you are going to handle a warranty and customer situations like this, how would you expect me to buy another firearm from you. What good is a warranty if you don't stand behind it. The Smith Lifetime Warranty, and their reknowned customer service is what drew me to this brand as well as aesthetics, but I'm not seeing that customer service part or warranty coverage.

He is not allowed authority to replace the gun, a Smith..smith has to look at it first, so I'm sending it out. Mark stated I should send the same explanation with the gun. So I will be asking for a replacement. Why shouldn't they be able to give me another gun? So we will see what happens. I may buy this gun a little suitcase, lol. second time back, lets see what they do.

FedEx picked up the gun yesterday with this Love Letter.

"This gun is being sent back for a "Request for Replacement", for the following reasons:

I purchased this pistol New in the Box, and when I disassembled it, I noticed a badly scratched frame on the left rear side. This was due to slide burrs and some broken off burrs of metal that I found in the slide grooves. The store I bought it from would not return or exchange it for some reason, and stated Smith & Wesson would handle it through warranty or replacement. I sent the pistol in for repair, and I received it back a week later with a badly tooled slide with the burrs removed, and a still badly scratched frame, this time with more gouging, and a notch missing (probably from the changes made to the slide). The slide did rack smoother, and less like sandpaper. Also the spring retainer nut was dented, a $10 part no big deal, but its the principle.

I spoke with Mark "###"at your facility. I told him I spoke with experts, forums, and my father, who is a police chief, and a few of his boys about, this piece who have put 1000s of rounds through them. I've seen their guns disassembled, as well as pictures online, all had normal/even wear, but no gouges, nicks, or scratches in the frame like mine.

I told Mark this is a QC issue that was missed, and the pistol should have never left the factory like this, and I feel is Smith & Wesson's responsibility to make this right. I have gotten expert concerns as well as forum opinions who have seen this gun and pictures, that basically sum up, "this is a poorly assembled pistol, that may be functional, but not well fitted and finished for a gun of this quality." So Mark stated a replacement would be up to you guys after looking at the gun.

To sum this experience up, I paid $1300 for a quality New In Box "E-Series", not a used "scratch and dent". This is a premium pistol at a premium price, so its quality should be better than my M&P's. I am asking for the gun to be replaced, as well as my faith in your brand. I have two M&Ps, one fixed under warranty no issue, and I planned on purchasing a Shield and a revolver. I only own Smith Pistols, because of previous experience and referrals. Please replace this firearm like any company would replace a defective item that shouldn't have passed through their QC. If you are going to handle warranty and customer situations like the last time I sent this pistol in, how would you expect me to buy another firearm from Smith & Wesson with peace of mind. What good is a warranty if you don't stand behind it. The Smith Lifetime Warranty, and their renowned customer service is what drew me to this brand as well as aesthetics. Please help me out this time around, and send me back what I paid for, which is quality work and craftsmanship that you advertise.

Best,
Marty"
 
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Let me also point out

Most warranties cover defects in material or workmanship. S&W's warranty is no exception:

The Smith & Wesson Advantage™

In addition to providing some of the highest quality products available today, Smith & Wesson is committed to providing our customers with support and services second to none. When you purchase a Smith & Wesson handgun, you receive the Smith & Wesson Advantage™, comprised of four service features:

1. Lifetime Service Policy
We will repair any defect in material or workmanship without charge to the original purchaser for as long as you own the handgun.

2. Expedited 911 Priority Service
This service is available in the event emergency repairs are needed by law enforcement, military, or government personnel. This service allows you to expedite the prompt repair and return of your handgun.

3. Easy Access Customer Support
Our customer support representatives are available to assist your every need. Contact Us

4. Pride
Our customer support staff is proud to represent Smith & Wesson. They are dedicated to helping customers and look forward to providing you with a level of support equal to the quality level of Smith & Wesson products. Call us any time, even before you make your purchase. Our customer support team is product knowledgeable and can help you decide which model best suits your needs.
 
I also contacted the shop I bought the pistol from today. I sent them a message in writing for legalities as usual, I find that a person's word means everything, but no longer holds up. So I I'm keeping them in the know, and what to expect next.

"I spoke with Mark @ Smith yesterday more about the slide mauling the frame on the pistol, and how it should have never made it past QC. I told him I paid a for a New in Box gun and not a scratch and dent. I am asking for the gun to be fixed right or replaced. He said he does not have the authority to replace the gun, a smith has to look at it, and sent me a return label. I sent gun back yesterday.

If the gun comes back to me in the same condition, and not repaired or replaced, I will be contacting you. I looked at your receipt, and I should have been able to have returned the gun when I contacted you months ago when discovering this problem per your return policy. This gun was sold to me in this condition, and you told me I could not return it, when your receipt states otherwise. I am hoping that Smith will take care of a problem they caused, but if they don't I would expect you to hold up to your return policy. I understand there's a restocking fee if it applies, and I would like to keep current business with you, and would like to put credit towards an M&P revolver.

Hopefully all will be resolved, but I wanted to give you a heads up on the situation."
 
I'll reiterate this, too. The scratches on the slide I can deal with.. Their not that deep, it's just the finish. Whatever..it's not worth the fight, and that will happen. It's the gouges and the notch on the frame that scares me. I'm not going to shoot a gun, depend on it, knowing that it may break and they can't replace it, so I have to spend another $$ on 500 rounds to run through another gun, to trust my life on it.

Another thing Mark @ Smith said as far as repairs, they could redo the frame, but it takes too long, because they have to strip it, coat it, and laser engrave everything again, and that takes too long. I'd imagine they still wouldn't be able to fix the notch, So is this an excuse to not do work or is it settling on my part, or both.
 
So after requesting a refinished or replaced gun.. Pistol came back today... :eek::confused:

The pistol did come back with an explanation this time: No repairs necessary as firearm is in proper working order.
In the process like some warned, the gunsmith wasn't very gentle. Looks like he may have dropped it on the muzzle, and scratched the finish off the trigger guard. Something that may happen after I holster and use it.. Looks,like,he was in the middle of dipping chewing tobacco and got some in the mag release. Nice and sticky.. Thanks..

4c8868d354a84ad344ba4ba7be45974c_zpsa4140e03.jpg


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Made a few phone calls. Not 100% sure but Pistols,in Ohio cannot be returned. The police armorers stated it should have been replaced and was shocked. An email was sent to Smith & Wesson Law Enforcement division with pics, and a manager I won't disclose got back to me, and he is putting it in the hands of a higher up manager, as he doesn't have the authority to have the pistol replaced. So we will see. Meanwhile I'm over it. Opinions are appreciated, but please no negativity, I'm done being stressed over this gun. Whatever happens happens. It's a learning experience, and from now on I will always break down and inspect any pistol I buy. Unless it's custom which kills me, because you can send it back if it's shat. I do have a buyer that has been wanting this gun and will pay what I paid for it. I just want to make sure there no issue, and in good conscious can't sell it until I do everything I can to make sure it's right. As soon as I do will be calling Wilson to order an X-Tac Commander.
 
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I don't know, but this thread is beginning to stink.... and not like tobacco..

I agree... That's the smell of a bad experience. Be glad it's not yours. Again I don't want to focus on negativity.
 
Just my two cents worth but you are allowing a pistol that wasn't built to the best standards to take up way to much of your time and causing a good deal of aggravation to boot.
I agree, you paid $1,300 and you expected a nice pistol and didn't get one. Chalk it up to experience and either sell it or trade it in, but please move on to something else for the sake of your own blood pressure. $1,300 is a good deal of money to all of us but in the world of custom 1911 45's it is low end. You want better then look at the new PC version, Les Baer, Brown, Wilson, etc. Any dealer selling any of these brands should be happy to break down the pistol for you before purchasing.

Good luck with the next one.
 
Just my two cents worth but you are allowing a pistol that wasn't built to the best standards to take up way to much of your time and causing a good deal of aggravation to boot.
I agree, you paid $1,300 and you expected a nice pistol and didn't get one. Chalk it up to experience and either sell it or trade it in, but please move on to something else for the sake of your own blood pressure. $1,300 is a good deal of money to all of us but in the world of custom 1911 45's it is low end. You want better then look at the new PC version, Les Baer, Brown, Wilson, etc. Any dealer selling any of these brands should be happy to break down the pistol for you before purchasing.

Good luck with the next one.


Thanks Snow, sums up exactly what I said earlier, over the stress, I did say I am ordering a Wilson Combat Xtac, and the gun is sold.
The issue is not dead yet sorry, and if the thread seems over bearing and annoying, then simply don't follow. I will admit I see it as annoying, but necessary. This thread has a purpose, and shows how a company is handling situations, and has helped a lot of buyers consideration of this pistol, which you have stated is " a pistol that wasn't built to the best standards". All I have done is lay out a series of events of a company's customer service.

I am a man of principle and was taught to do the right thing, and when something is wrong, right it, and only persistence pays off.
 
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