New SW1911SC normal or problem!?

[aqualungs]

On the plus side got a call from Smith it went to upper management and he saw the pics and apologized. He sent me a label, told me to put the gun in a box, send it back and they will take care of it. He didn't tell me to stop bitching and whining. Again in a world full of lazy asses. If you want something done. Persistence pays...

Seems repetitive. Maybe the third time will be a charm. We shall see. I'm not expecting miracles.

 

[aqualungs]

Just for those wondering... Got it back from S&W, not replaced or fixed. Oh well, it was function tested of course and fine. I'm past it, minor detail. Can't wait to shoot 200-500 rounds through it so I can carry it, and retire my reliable S&W 40c for now. I have some custom plans for this gun once it proves reliable, which I'm sure it will. Also back to work part time, and getting better everyday. Still about 2 months minimum, before I can take it to a range.. Meanwhile .22 & .556 fun for now... Not so bad right. Take care everyone.
Next post will be a new thread on range test.

 

[ca survivor]

I have similar 'scratches' on the front part of the frame, from the slide on the left side - not as bad as yours.

 

[aqualungs]

I have similar 'scratches' on the front part of the frame, from the slide on the left side - not as bad as yours.

Yea, now that the burs on slide are gone, it's not scratching the frame anymore. I expect it to wear even now. I used one of those sharpie-like black pens, and I can hardly tell now. Even where the trigger guard is.
Honestly I'm my opinion, it's just a soft finish. Once I range test it I will probably have a better finish put on, and the slide fixed and bead blasted. Honestly I don't know how Smith did that, but it is what it is. If anyone made that dent it should have been me, and it's on my wallet if I feel like fixing it, lol.
It's still the best looking 1911 in my opinion, unless you want the traditional Style. I plan on carrying this, and I think I will love it. It feels so right in my hand. Honestly I can't find a bad review on it. I just had an "experience" that every manufacturer has once in while. Will I buy another Smith? I'm not sure. I love my M&P 40c and 10/22LR, both 100%.
So this gun to me now is fixed unless broke. I'm past the 1200$ kick in the pills.

 

[Fastbolt]

While I can understand how someone could easily become frustrated by what they feel is insufficient QC efforts, sometimes expectations and perceptions might be unrealistic for the circumstances. BTDT.

Aluminum frames, even alloyed with a bit of Scandium, are still softer than steel. It's the nature of the beast. Black finishes on aluminum are always going to make scratches, gouges, nicks, dings & such more visible because they can go through the dark finish and reveal the plain metal color. Light anodizing/finishes on aluminum frames are going to blend better with the normal metal color make the the scratches & developing wear less obvious.

Also, trying to compare a hand-crafted 1911 made by a custom gunsmith, focusing whatever attention & time they want to spare, is different than assembling & fitting one that's mass produced ... and such a comparison is perhaps not quite fair mass production maker, and maybe not a little unrealistic.

I bought a SW1911SC 5" stainless slide/plain finish back about '05. The top of the right aluminum frame rail had a nice 'nail nick' depth groove running lengthwise along the middle of the top of the rail. A closer inspection made it seem as though a burred spot on the steel slide's rail edge probably cut the groove during production and test-fire. This gun cost me just under $700 NIB, though, and wasn't a hand-fitted PC 1911 that cost over $2300.

As I'd bought this gun for a working/training tool, and looked at the deep scratch as a cosmetic annoyance more than anything, I didn't bother returning it and started shooting it. (To be fair, the hammer & sear engagement were textbook on that gun, easily matching the engagement I'd found on my Colt XSE, which looked excellent when examined under the magnifying scope 1911 armorer's widget we kept at the armorer bench).

Several years later the plunger tube staking became loose at one end. I don't mind staking steel frames, but I decided to take advantage of their warranty on the aluminum frame and let them replace it. I had enough other things to occupy my time as an armorer, anyway. When I got the gun back I could tell the repair tech was probably someone familiar and experienced with 3rd gen guns, as the repair tag said they'd replaced the 'sideplate'. Good repair, though.

I still chuckle when I clean and lube the gun and see the long scratch along the top of the right frame rail. Kind of looks like a bit of gravel got caught up in the works one day.

 

[44R]

Same Problem

UPDATE: S&W agreeing to replace this part. See below. Good old S&W. See post #97 below.


I had the same problem as Aqualungs with the slide damaging the guide rail on the right side of my frame. Bought the gun two weeks ago and fired a box of commercial ball. Brought it home, removed the slide for a cleaning and noticed the damage to the lower surface of the guide rail. Checking the slide just ahead of the damage, found the the channel for the extractor pin had a sharp edge. There were some flakes of metal visible in the channels on the underside of the slide.

One would think that any manufacturer would take extra care in the finishing of the steel slide when it is to be mounted on an aluminum alloy surface.

After paying sales tax, this new pistol cost me about $1275.00. I have more expensive 1911's than this, but would not expect such a problem on any pistol. The slide should not damage the frame in normal operation. Once the running surface becomes rough, it has been compromised.

I have returned the gun and requested replacement of the frame. S&W received the gun on May 5. I sent them an email today. S&W has not contacted me yet.

 

[aqualungs]

Yes I agree. If you're putting a steel slide on a softer frame, this should not be overlooked.. Your serial # is close to mine. I wonder if they had a bad batch. Even the slide serration cuts are off and look sloppy. My $400 M&P has sharper cuts. I know in the 1911 realm $1250 isn't a lot, but this is unacceptable. I should have looked this gun over more closely.

I gave up the fight with them because I have to fight for disability right now., even though i am back to work full time, finally! I hope they don't beat up your gun like they did to mine.. I think they need to issue a recall.

Let us know what happens

 

[Rick_A]

In the 1911 world $1300 is not a premium. Triple or quadruple that. The SC is in the range of a decent production mid grade "semi custom."

If you don't like scratches or wear on frame rails get a stainless gun and keep it well lubed.

I would have fired a few hundred rounds, and if it worked and the slide feel smoothed out, left it at that. They'll all shoot loose, eventually.

I can understand the frustration at S&W as all the alloy framed guns from all manufacturers get wear patterns in the frame rails and behind the controls...and people love to complain about it.

The purpose of these guns is a lightweight carry option. After a year or more in a holster some frame rail scratches are small beans.

 

[Badquaker]

This is why I like all steel guns. I just traded off my last alloy framed gun a couple of weeks ago. The wear marks on the rails (legit wear from shooting) were far more than shown in this thread.

I also break down new pistols to check for issues before the first range trip. You never know what can be missed during production.

 

[44R]

I do not expect this to be anything like my premium 1911's and it's not. It has very good accuracy. It will hold 2" at 50 feet or better. My Les Baer and my custom Colt will hold that at 50 yards.

But, for $1,300.00, I expect a new pistol to be free from defects. I have owned other alloy-framed pistols and none had this problem. The alloy frame has a hardened surface to prevent wear. Once that surface shatters, it will not last as long. I get that a 1911 has more slide surface than it needs, but I want a new gun to be free from defects.

I like S&W a whole lot. I have many of their fine handguns, going back to the beginning of the 20th century, from Model No. 3 New Model Target through a 500ES, fantastic handguns all. All S&W needs to do is finish the burs in slide and replace the frame.

There should be no issue here.

 

[44R]

Yup, You're Right

This is why I like all steel guns. I just traded off my last alloy framed gun a couple of weeks ago. The wear marks on the rails (legit wear from shooting) were far more than shown in this thread.

I also break down new pistols to check for issues before the first range trip. You never know what can be missed during production.

I agree with you on both points.

Steel is always better - especially blued carbon steel. Just where I am, concealed carry is mandatory so the twelve ounces of weight means the difference betw. being able to carry a 1911 and not.


Yup. I should have broken down the pistol the moment before I bought it. Easy to do.

 

[aqualungs]

Rick_A I wouldn't say people love to complain about this, lol! But it is a little frustrating. Like I said earlier I'm pretty much over it. I have to fight an appeal that halted my disability payments when off work.. Bigger problems, and a bigger fish. I agree with you,it is a light carry gun and half the price of Wilson. I did a lot of research, but should have looked into the frames more. I would have forked out the extra cash. That's my fault, but I look past the scratches now. Can't excuse their QC and customer service like you stated. I can't wait to hammer 500 rounds through it, check the wear, and that will give me confidence in it.

Badquaker, I always break down, inspect, and clean every firearm I purchase before firing them. I would assume everyone does, but they don't Manufacturing crud, etc.. I just wish I broke it down at the shop, instead of at home, which normally shouldn't be a problem. The shop would not return it after I got it home, and said S&W would take care of it. I sent it to them right away. So it had't been shot yet, except by S&W for function testing. I'm glad I inspected it, if they didn't file off the burrs, the damage would probably be worse than in the picture. All that damage was from racking the slide when it was in the shop. I agree also ... I should have went all steel.. But it is light, like Rick_A said.

44R I agree. Why is my $400 M&P better quality? Example the slide serrations on the M&P are perfect, and on the E-series, very sloppy. It is a cheaper 1911, but not that cheap. I also question mid term reliability.. I also don't understand why they didn't just replace it, especially after they damaged it. I think there was a series of sloppy pistols made, and S&W knows it. I've had quite a few PMs from people. I'd wish they would share their issues on this thread.

 

[44R]

Still Waiting

Rick_A I wouldn't say people love to complain about this, lol! But it is a little frustrating. ....

Badquaker, I always break down, inspect, and clean every firearm I purchase ....

44R I agree. I think there was a series of sloppy pistols made, and S&W knows it. I've had quite a few PMs from people. I'd wish they would share their issues on this thread.

Getting no response to email with call tag and s/n, I telephoned S&W CS to hear that the pistol is in the "repairs" department and would be finished and sent back this week. When I asked what had been done, the rep (sounded like an OK working man) said he did not know. I mentioned I expected them to replace the compromised frame.

More later.

 

[aqualungs]

Keep us informed. I'm not surprised,and I think we're on our own. I hope they replace your frame

 

[44R]

UPDATE: S&W agreeing to replace frame. See #97 below. Thank you S&W.



S&W Level 1 wrote me an email on May 13 and acknowledged receipt. Guess I'll call and see what's up.

 

[44R]

UPDATE S&W is agreeing to replace the frame. Good old S&W.

 

[44R]

Hi. A representative from S&W called to say the company would replace the frame. As long as the company is willing to replace this part, I'm satisfied. This is a slick accurate gun that feeds with no issues. The light weight makes it easy to carry a 1911. It handles beautifully. As loing as S&W follows through - as I expect they will - I recommend the 1911SC. I guess my problem was an anomaly.

 

[aqualungs]

Man I should try again,lol. Oh well I'm shooting it, and if I have issues it can go back. Have another bump in the road.. Thought I was having issues with my back surgery.. Turns out I'm passing a big kidney stone. Never had one before... Not fun, lol

 

[aqualungs]

Got word from Mark at Smith and Wesson, and they are repairing and refinishing the damaged slide. When I asked about the frame they said it was already repaired. I asked how, and he said he “blued” it. I’m not sure this is the same color as anodizing, or he was just using the term “blued.” I did ask why they didn’t just replace the pistol, and that’s when things turned a little sour.

Mark’s nice switch turned off, and he made it a point to say my pistol has come in 4 times since December; it has a new mark, which is not true. So I stated actually it’s the opposite, every time I get my pistol back there’s a new mark. Mark then stated the pistol should not have come back to them after the first time, and it wouldn’t have been damaged if I hadn’t done so. I pointed out the gun has come back so many times, because they failed to fix what they damaged. There really are only two marks besides the frame gouging that I was contesting, so I asked him I am not sure what he is getting at. He was a little defensive and stated that his gunsmiths work very hard, and would never damage it, which in a way made it seem like I was being accused or at fault. I asked if he was accusing me of making the marks, and he said no that it could have happened in transit from FedEx throwing the packages around. I asked him to explain how a gun packed in its foam padded box (no mags), packed in bubble wrap in another box, gets a dent on a stainless steel slide. He just repeated himself, talked over me, and disregarded me as a customer. I asked how this is my fault, and should I file a claim with FedEx, and are they going to back me?

So basically he said the decision to not replace the pistol was coming from "the big boss", who I was not able to speak with. He also made a point to state they are not obligated to fix anything, just look at it, and I should feel lucky that they are even fixing it. I then told him that this has been a very bad experience, and no offense as a customer I would not consider buying another product after this. Mark then went on to say I should want another product from them, since they are doing me a favor with fixing it.

This is no way to treat a good customer, especially with repeat business in mind. Initial customer service was good and warranty work with my other Smiths has been excellent. I was not happy how this was handled, and had the matter escalated. I am however happy they are fixing the damage the best they can. I am not expecting anything to come out of the escalation; I did receive a message stating another supervisor is reviewing it.

***NO NEGATIVE COMMENTS PLEASE***

 

[rbert0005]

Raking a CS service rep over the coals does't put you in the "good customer" ranks.

Personaly, I hesitate to send anything back because of the collateral damage that occurs.

Bob