Problem with M&P 10mm + Customer Service Nightmare

[waffles]

Well since you feel you need a heavy load you shoyld have picked a 45 maybe !! Reason why You have plenty ole 45acp loads then there the +P loads and finally nothing more than a heavier recoil spring you could run 45super . .

Now I did give some options you might have over looked . If you feel you need 180gr then why not a federal , remmy , winny and hornday or something more basic made like pmc . S&B has had more than its share of problem ammo and heavy flat nose loads have been a problems in other handguns .

Since you came to air your issues here you have to expect reply's you may not like . But hey sorry to offer some unwanted advise about how YOU could check your mag issues with the slide off the frame but that's your problem to deal with .

The M&P 10mm is amongst the newest production 10mm offerings. The 10mm 220gr by underwood is a massively popular loading, and within SAAMI specs per underwood. This is not the pistol failing to feed, failing to eject, or any other similar issue, it's a bizarre mag drop problem that doesn't seem to impact the other M&P 10mms, nor the M&P 10's main competitors, the Glock 20 and 29.

So the solution to his factory pistol not handling a very common factory (if boutique) loading in a very bizarre way is to...go to the .45 ACP so he can deal with modifying it (which is often more than just a recoil spring...) to shoot .45 Super, a less popular round with less factory support that is pretty equivalent ballistically to the 10mm that he has? Why?

No, his pistol should work the first time around, or S&W should make it right. Ideally I do think the suggestions to have another person shoot it (or even shoot it weak hand) to make doubly sure it's not accidental magazine release contact, but the recoil really is nothing to write home about and I'm willing to take his word that he can properly shoot a handgun without dropping the magazine inadvertently like he does any other handgun.

 

[gnystrom]

I feel your pain on this one. Nothing like a single shot bear gun. I am at a loss for words. You might try contacting the people at Apex. I don't think they make one but they might have some better thoughts than you have been offered.

 

[mark_lives_things]

I feel your pain on this one. Nothing like a single shot bear gun.

Especially since I'm headed to Alaska in a few weeks...

 

[gnystrom]

Mark, given that info I think you need to get to somebody higher up at S&W and tell them about your need for that gun to function as it is going to a place where bears are just starting to move around. A Montana man was killed a week ago by a bear.
I wish I could help and I hope somebody in this forum can give you a name that will take this very seriously and get the job done.

 

[Charlie Foxtrot]

Sorry you’re having problems with your new pistol. I had some issues with a new .45 Shield. One of the problems was fully seated magazines were ejecting when I fired the pistol. The second time it happened, it took nearly one year to get a replacement magazine. Unfortunately, the defective magazine was a 6 round magazine, and after nearly one year, S&W could only offer me a 7 round replacement magazine. I bought the Shield because I wanted a small pistol. Unfortunately, the 7 round magazine gives the pistol a larger footprint.
Here’s a link to my discussion about the issues I had with my pistol.
Defective .45 Shield Magazines?

I sent you a PM. Hopefully, you’ll find the information I sent you to be beneficial.

 

[mark_lives_things]

Sorry you’re having problems with your new pistol. I had some issues with a new .45 Shield. One of the problems was fully seated magazines were ejecting when I fired the pistol. The second time it happened, it took nearly one year to get a replacement magazine. Unfortunately, the defective magazine was a 6 round magazine, and after nearly one year, S&W could only offer me a 7 round replacement magazine. I bought the Shield because I wanted a small pistol. Unfortunately, the 7 round magazine gives the pistol a larger footprint.
Here’s a link to my discussion about the issues I had with my pistol.
Defective .45 Shield Magazines?

I sent you a PM. Hopefully, you’ll find the information I sent you to be beneficial.

Wow! That's terrible.

 

[dla]

It's not my responsibility to fix the broken gun that S&W sold to me. It's their responsibility. I'm not here to "troubleshoot" mechanical problems or play gunsmith.
.

Very wrong. You do play a role and you better accept it if you want your pistol to run right.
It must be a generational thing.....

 

[mark_lives_things]

Very wrong. You do play a role and you better accept it if you want your pistol to run right.
It must be a generational thing.....

Those gosh darn Millennials! Always buying guns and expecting them to work!

 

[seldon14]

Very wrong. You do play a role and you better accept it if you want your pistol to run right.
It must be a generational thing.....

Right. Some very basic trouble shooting, would have likey saved a ton of time, energy and frustration.

Logically the problem is likely caused by operator error, the mag, mag catch or mag catch spring. If you had done a few minutes of trouble shooting you probably could have pinned it down, and just had Smith send you a replacement mag catch and or spring, or swapped magazines in the first place.

You can't expect them to fix a malfunction that is not happening on there end.

 

[mark_lives_things]

Right. Some very basic trouble shooting, would have likey saved a ton of time, energy and frustration.

Logically the problem is likely caused by operator error, the mag, mag catch or mag catch spring. If you had done a few minutes of trouble shooting you probably could have pinned it down, and just had Smith send you a replacement mag catch and or spring, or swapped magazines in the first place.

You can't expect them to fix a malfunction that is not happening on there end.

1. It's not operator error. See videos.
2. If it was the magazines, that should have been addressed by S&W the two previous times I sent the mags back to the factory with the pistol.
3. Mag catch or mag catch spring should have been replaced by the factory if that's the root of the problem. As others here have noted, I likely would have voided any warranty or service guarantee by messing with those myself.
4. I have offered information to help S&W to replicate the problem and they have shown no interest in that information. I'm not terribly surprised that they haven't been able to replicate the problem without talking to me about the conditions under which I experienced the problem -- e.g., full-power ammo, one-handed grip (suboptimal recoil management), fully-loaded mags, etc.

 

[mark_lives_things]

I really appreciate the helpful comments in this thread and the people who reached out to me via DM. I don't think there's much more to say or do until I get mags from S&W -- hopefully they'll send those soon...? I'll update y'all then.

 

[LVSteve]

Those of us with long memories were there when the first M&P9 pistols did the exact same thing. Happened to me with a brand new rental multiple times just after the launch.

 

[4506517]

So if I buy a brand new truck and have mechanical problems, I'm supposed to drop the engine and transmission in the driveway? Seriously?

If it wasn't an S&W, you guys who are suggesting he "trouble shoot it" would be screaming he send it back in. Get real, the blind brand loyalty is laughable.

"But the M&P pistols are JUST AS GOOD AS A GLOCK"......hmmmm.....

Oh wait.......I've never heard of a G20 or G29 auto ejecting a magazine.....or auto releasing a slide.....

Man, get out of here......

 

[LCC]

Especially since I'm headed to Alaska in a few weeks...

Friend of mine is a river guide in Alaska, he and the other guides at the lodge all carry G20's because they never have problems with them. Might consider picking one up, sort out the Smith when you get back.

 

[GregG]

Personally if it was me I would sell the gun and move on. No way I'm going to let a company treat me like that.

I love the Smiths I own but they are several decades old, made when S&W was staffed with better people.

 

[WR Moore]

I watched the OPs video and it's difficult to be sure given the camera angle and distance but:

The second finger of the gun hand seems very, very close to the magazine catch, possibly touching the bottom surface of the catch. Having the camera at the same level as the gun might make this more clear. The major problem with the video is that it's real time rather than slow motion which would allow us to definitively rule out accidental contact.

 

[cometpx4]

M&P 10mm

I am with Greg. Dump it and buy a Glock. Smith can't fix it, and they don't really care. The "gun people" are long gone from there. To be fair, like other businesses right now they are taking anything they can get and it shows in the product. I looked at a new 43c the other day. Pulled the trigger and the cylinder did not rotate. Trigger felt like it was not connected to anything. The front sight pin area on the barrel had chunks of material missing around it, almost like the guy drilling the hole started and stopped 3x before he hit the right spot.
Don't think any one there has any idea what to do with your pistol but they don't want to admit it.
Its disappointing as the 10mm M&P was long awaited but I would move on from it and Smith.

 

[moralem]

Dump the gun and move on…..a Glock 20 or 40 will serve you well……I am old school my colt delta would be my Alaska gun.

 

[Frank Black]

Well since you feel you need a heavy load you shoyld have picked a 45 maybe !! Reason why You have plenty ole 45acp loads then there the +P loads and finally nothing more than a heavier recoil spring you could run 45super

Wrong. Real, full-power 10mm ammo will best +P 45acp all day every day.

And 45Super is a hobby cartridge for full-time handloaders. I can walk into any store in AK that sells ammo and find real-deal 10mm ammo on the shelves. Not so for .45 Super. It’s unobtainium.

 

[kbm6893]

I really like my M&P pistols, but I don't own a 10MM. I do own one Glock, a Gen 2 19. I'd take an M&P any day over a Glock. They just fit my hand so much better and mine have been 100% reliable.

However, this thread is about S&W customer service, and it is no surprise that the OP isn't happy. They have seriously gone downhill in this regard. Look at the .380 EZ magazine issue. They clearly redesigned the 9MM version to deal with the .380 issue. Jerry Miculek even references the reason for the design change in the 9MM, but they continue to sell the same problematic magazines with the .380 model.

For what it's worth, I sent my 28 year old Gen 2 Glock back to Glock, just for a once over and new night sights. 4 days from when it left my hand, it was back in my hands. They replaced virtually every internal part and sent it back in a factory hard case. It's ludicrous that they would have you send in the mags before sending you new ones, especially after you've been inconvenienced twice.

I took apart some Ruger 10/22 mags to clean and I couldn't get the tension right on the spring when I put them back together. Ruger even tells you not to take the mags apart in the manual. I call Ruger and fess up. Lady on the phone laughs and says they would send out 4 new ones to replace the 4 ones I couldn't get back together right. Even asked me if I would prefer the clear ones, which I did. She told me to keep the 4 mags I took apart and keep trying, and that I would eventually get them right. 5 days later, 4 brand new mags showed up, and she was right, I did get the others back together properly.