S&W Quality?

[Tom S.]

This is an all too often repeated topic. I solved my S&W quality problems..

Funny you should mention this. I bought one last year, and posted a report here under "other Brands". While it looks nice, the trigger on it can't hold a candle to my 640. And we won't talk about how much than the 640 it cost.

Kimber K6S

 

[OLDSTER]

S&W quality

I'll be the "fly-in-the-ointment" on this thread. The only "new"(IL,MIM,etc.) S&W revolver I've purchased in at least 15 years is this Model 360J scandium frame .38+P. I was intrigued when they first began showing up a few years back. Fit and finish is superb, action is very smooth, factory grips are perfect to tame recoil, so even at around 15 oz. It's not unpleasant to shoot. POA to POI at 7-10 yrds. is spot on. I guess I was just lucky with the QA/QC of this little gem

 

[sasu]

To be on the positive, of the dozen or so new S&Ws I bought about a decade ago, two thirds did not require any repairs.

 

[cmj8591]

We tend to hear only about problems on internet boards so we think that most of the guns coming out of the factory have a problem. The truth is that most of the guns are well made and have no problem. They go to their owner and give years of trouble free service and we never hear about it. The trouble comes when one slips by the person in charge of making sure everything is right before the gun heads out for sale. Maybe the quality control guy was busy talking to his co worker about the New England Patriots winning their fifth championship in eleven years and a gun with a defect slipped by! See, it's Tom Brady's fault!

 

[gnystrom]

Duplicate posting

 

[Bourget117]

All my firearms purchased in the last 3 years have had issues and have needed to go back for repair. Two Sigs, a S&W Bidyguard and now my e-series 1911 will need to go back.
Only firerarm that has not given me any problems is my Colt.

 

[gnystrom]

I am trying to keep this to a discussion of expected quality when purchasing a firearm not a specific brand so...

Understand I am not a fanboy of any particular company and as a RSO and instructor I see problems with literally every brand of firearms made and as other have stated, the internet is full of complainers, so let's assume all guns fire and operate as advertised as the vast majority do,
That said:
When I pay a bonus price for any firearm that comes from their "custom shop" I do not expect to open the box and find a cylinder that has one chamber left unfinished, a barrel visibly clocked, the flutes in the barrel with deep visible pits (my 640Pro), a gun totally out of time (my 686 SSR), damaged crowns, trigger action that felt like it was full of sand (my buddy's 586L comp), among many other issues reported here.

The Kimber I purchased will be the first revolver in twenty years that will not need a trigger job, charge holes chamfered, or sights replaced.
As with all guns I will assume it will continue to perform as expected or get the great customer service that S&W provides. So far, I have only fifty rounds downrange and being recoil insensitive (I shoot and carry a 340PD) the Kimber just continued to put them in the black on a NRA bullseye target at 30' just as I would expect from any high end firearm.

As for pricing, my 640 Pro with LG350 Lasergrips and trigger job was a wash with the Kimber equipped the same way. You will find Rugers Wiley Clapp models to also be in the same bracket with Kimber and S&W.

 

[jeeps]

Kimber?? Worst Q problems in the industry!! Would not own a Kimber!

 

[Bourget117]

I am trying to keep this to a discussion of expected quality when purchasing a firearm not a specific brand so....

Well all my brand new defective firearms cost me $850+ each with the exception of the bodyguard, so ya I expect some quality regardless of the brand.

 

[cmj8591]

I am trying to keep this to a discussion of expected quality when purchasing a firearm not a specific brand so....

You are absolutely right, when you plunk down a G note for a new gun, you expect it to be as advertised. The thing with internet forums, all of them, not just this one, is that quality is subjective in a lot of cases and we get that subjectivity in most of the complaints that get posted on the internet. (I.E., the dreaded lock!) I buy a gun and am happy with the fit and finish, you buy the same gun and think it's a piece of junk. So, you send it back and it comes back in that same condition and it's still a piece of junk and now the manufacturer is no good. That doesn't mean that the gun is junk, it just means that you have different expectations than I do. My point is, absent an obvious manufacturing defect, like we have in this case, keep in mind that many of the complaints we read here are in the eye of the beholder.

 

[Arik]

I bought a 63 (no dash) about 1980/81? for my then girlfriend (now wife). It would not eject shells. In order to extract them you had to hit the end of the extractor rod on the side of the bench to knock them loose. Took it to my gunsmith and he said the radius on the extractor portion was not lining up with the radius of the chamber, there was a little ledge. He polished them down for me and it has worked fine for the last 35+ years.

I guess they do make them like they used too.

No way? You mean it wasn't all perfect like people seem to THINK?

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

 

[Arik]

Back in the late '70s we replaced our blued Model 15s w/the "new" stainless models. Quite a few needed the range master to make a few repairs before they could be issued, and some were so bad they had to be returned to the factory. This is nothing new.

Impossible. That only started happening 3 or 4 years ago. All S&W used to be perfect until after the pinned barrels were dropped. Then it started to go downhill. Around 2014 S&W decided not to use QC, as been explained here many times. Obviously your timeline is wrong

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[locolobo56]

Colt is out of bankruptcy. Again.

And makin Snake guns again according to recent press.

 

[HOUSTON RICK]

Well, welcome and thank you for taking the hit for the rest of us. I own over a dozen S&W handguns and have not had a problem with any. I have a few tips that may or may not be relevant.

1- My theory -and it is only my theory - is that some guns sold online, are sold online because they would not be sold if first inspected. If I cannot check it out. I do not buy it. Period.

2 - My wife used to go to a veterinarian who never saw a dog that did not need $300 of work today and again next week. If you bring a gun to some gunsmiths complaining about it, he will find a problem that needs fixing whether he just handles it for you or actually fixes it.

3-Smith and Wesson is not perfect, but they try. As the company reorganizes, many of the old experienced employees are retired or retiring. Whatever their education and work ethic, the youngsters are now learning their trade.

4. I bought half of my S&W handguns used. They all work as good as the new ones and have the same warranty and may have been built at a better time.

Respectfully, Rick

 

[glenwolde]

No way? You mean it wasn't all perfect like people seem to THINK?

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Nope. You should have heard the complaining about Bangor Punta. I have a 15-4 from '77 that I bought new that has some fairly obvious grinder marks under the nickel plating. Not obvious enough that an inexperienced 21 year old would reject it.

I also had a Model 17 of the same era. I was shooting it one day and felt something brush my hand. I ignored it. Went to cock the revolver and couldn't. The hammer spur had fallen off. I found it on the ground.

I called S&W and they told me to send it back. The hammer had been over-hardened and was too brittle. To be fair, the gun had a good 35,000 rounds through it. I sent it back and they replaced the hammer and basically rebuilt it for me, no charge.

I also had half a dozen or so others of the same vintage to slightly newer that were trouble free and wonderful guns. Unfortunately the cost in time and treasure made me dispose of most of them. The job, the house, the kids...

 

[Flintlock1]

Every S&W revolver I've owned was bought new between 1981 and 1987. An M-60, an M-66 w 3" barrel, and an M-17 w 8-3/8ths Barrel, target everything. The only problems I experience are the ejector rods working out as the cylinder goes around. The M-60 rod will jam in the latch every three or four rotations if I don't manually tighten it, which has become automatic and I don't even think about it. The M-17 will jam the latch every one revolution, but it's a target gun and I don't mind. The M-66 is no longer with me (regrettably) , but it would do the same after about ten revs. Small idiosyncrasies that I over look. Maybe a little lock-tite would suffice. Other that that, they are beautifully made.

Now, the new 9mm Shield I just bought...well... that's another story for another thread.

 

[LAA]

Had my 9mm Shield been a problem child, I wouldn't think of buying a 45 Shield. I would have stole back the 9mm Glock, my wife decided she wanted (Glock 43). Come to think of it, had my S&W 40 CORE had problems, I wouldn't have purchased the 9mm Shield. But I own all three. Haven't sent any back.

Note: All new & inspected beforehand. None bought online. I think it will always be that way.....hopefully.

 

[TeaDub]

Go to pretty much any gun forum dedicated to nearly any brand and you'll see threads just like this. Unfortunately, it's where we are now. I also agree that many of us forget that they always existed to a degree.

What does surprise me is how many threads start with "when I got home I noticed"....

I try to always give a close physical inspection of ALL the guns I purchase before signing the forms and handing over my cash. New or used. While that won't catch each and every defect, it sure will lessen the odds.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a new production Smith. I'll still "trust but verify" before I bring it home. I'll also trust S&W over many other brands to make it right with issues that crop up after use.

 

[hangnoose]

NEW IFFY QUALITY VS OLD/USED PROVEN QUALITY.

And you are blaming S&W? Disappointing QC from a variety of mfgr's is nothing new. Sorry for your troubles, but bashing S&W on a S&W site won't get you much sympathy IMO.

 

[Mike in Reedley]

Here's a marketing point that S&W might consider; include two return shipping labels in the factory boxes of every new gun sold. They could advertise it as: If you're not that picky about guns, then our new firearms are for you. If you want it to work most the time, return it once. If you want it to work every time and have a bit of accuracy, return it the second time. They could call it their Customer Decides our level of Quality Control program.