Speer Gold Dot bullets for handloading .32Long

[I'm3rd]

I recently ordered 2 boxes of 60 grain Gold Dot bullets to handload some higher than standard velocity rounds for my wife's model 30-1 .32 Long revolver that serves as her house & car gun. That low recoil round is as much as she can tolerate due to arthritic hands that were also damaged by botched surgery. I handloaded a few .32 Long cases using the upgraded loading data that was provided by Speer for modern steel guns. The 60 grain Gold Dots were originally intended for .32 acp, but now Speer also recommends them for handloading ammo for use in modern solid frame .32 Long revolvers such as the mod. 30 Smith.

OK, now for the problem. The 60 gr bullets in those rounds I handloaded will not expand at all even at the much higher than normal velocity that the Speer data produces. After being fired into a row of water filled 1 gallon milk jugs, except for the marks left by the rifling they looked just like they looked when I loaded them. I could actually reload them and fire them again if I wanted to. I also tried firing into 20" of rainwater standing in a plastic container and got the same result, no expansion at all. If the 60 gr bullets are designed to expand at .32 acp velocity, why don't they expand at the 1035 fps velocity that Speer claims it's data produces? Her Smith has a 3" barrel which may possibly cause a slight loss of velocity compared to a 4" test barrel, but I doubt it's enough to cause a good HP bullet to totally fail to expand. I have been a Speer fan in the past, but I'm beginning to wonder whether their claims in regard to the bullets in question are true or greatly exaggerated. 200 Gold Dots cost me $47 delivered from Midway. That means they cost almost a buck per 4 bullets, and that should be enough to get a bullet that does what it's maker says it does.

 

[Bruce51]

I like to shoot the Hornady 95 grain SWC as I don't expect any expansion with a .32 caliber bullet. The frontal diameter is small as is the mass of the bullet.

The Speer listed load velocity and the actual velocity from your gun can only be determined with a chronograph.

I sometimes shoot the .32 acp round from a model 31 and other than printing lower on the target they seem to work just fine.

Buying Gold dots just does not seem to be cost effective for the .32.
I guess you already know that per your test.

I have also shot the 90 and 100 grain JHP bullets offered by Sierra and Speer. In the .32 these are expensive plinking ammo even when handloaded.

Best bet, stick with swagged lead or cast bullets as velocities and recoil will both be low anyway.

BLM

 

[I'm3rd]

.

I sometimes shoot the .32 acp round from a model 31 and other than printing lower on the target they seem to work just fine.




BLM

I have fired several rounds of Geco brand .32acp in my wife's little Smith, and to my surprise they fired and ejected perfectly. I wasn't firing for accuracy but even firing offhand at 7 yds they hit close to point of aim. I may try a box of WW's Silvertip .32acp cartridges just to be sure they will fire and eject reliably and then let her use them in her house and car gun.

I don't usually put a lot of faith in Evan Marshall's so-called "1 shot stop" ratings, but he may be correct regarding the .32acp. His book rates the 60 grain Silvertip as the best .32 defense round, and that may be true because as far as I know it was the only hollowpoint round available for .32acp until very recently. And according to a relative of mine who is a retired deputy, quite a few LEO's carry Silvertip ammo in .32acp backup guns such as Keltec, NAA, and Beretta Tomcat semiautos. IIRC Marshall's book rates the old standard 71 grain FMJ .32acp round at about 50% one-shot stops, and even if the hollowpoint bullets don't expand they should be at least as effective as the slightly heavier FMJ slugs. OTOH, Marshall may be as FOS as Dr. Fackler says he is, and a .32 round of any variety except the new .327 Federal magnum may be as ineffective for stopping 2-legged predators as it's many detractors say it is. I just hope that we never learn who's right the hard way.

 

[cjw3]

I doubt you will ever obtain significant expansion from the .32 Long under most circumstances. Recommended loads that I use with the Hornady LSWC and HBWC both run around 650 fps from my 4" HE. I think there is a little room to step them up a bit, but for my use I have no interest in doing so. The velocity is just not there and is not obtainable in small frames and shorter barrels with a comfortable margin of safety.

If wanting to use a .32 Long for your application, I would personally prefer to approach it with better penetration. Any number of commercially available cast bullets should give you that, and they are very inexpensive.

This is an excellent article on loading .32 Long. Maybe it will give you some ideas to look into.

The .32 S&W Long: A Handgun Hunter's Perspective - By Glen E. Fryxell

 

[ozo]

32Long

Hi 3rd.....
The .32 long just lacks barely the potential for any wanted power in SD, whether it's penetration or expansion. [It was great in it's day for a muff gun.....better than nothing].
Today we speak ballistics for self defense basically in terms of
'bigger-is-better,knock-em-on-their-***,one-shot.......etc.
The .32 long [commercially] falls just short of meaningful capability, therefore, the creation of the .32 H&R.
Let me clarify this, my FAVORITE and MOST LOADED round now is .32 H&R......for me and my wife, replacing my previous love of .38/.357 which I still load and shoot.
If possible, my suggestion would be to move into a gun for your wife that chambers the .32H&R, giving you much more wiggle room for your intended results while still keeping recoil down for her, especially since you have the option to make homegrown ammo.
If a new gun is not in the budget, you still have room to play loading the .32long, with some expectations of achievement.
Lyman 49th has data for W231 powder[my go-to powder for my two pistol rounds .38 and.32] in the .32 long from 2.0grains to 3.5grains, depending on projectile, and I don't see any reason you can't play between them all to find an expansion you can live with.
I mainly load 3.1grains W231 powder, Hornady 90grain HBWC #10028 or Berry's 83grain DEWC #86968 or the same in HBWC, and Starline .32H&R brass. Mostly shoot them in a Ruger Blackhawk 5.5" and a Ruger GP100 4".......my results are excellent.......no recoil and accurate. This load is the bottom of the scale, leaving me room to go much hotter if I wish.
For you, loading .32long, a few things you can try...to get more expansion without exceeding maximum pressure levels, is try an XTP projectile[it was my favorite when I shot the .32long brass] , a #311252 cast #2 alloy(75grain) pushing it over 1000fps, or a Hornady HBWC 90grain and play around with seating depths.
When I load my .38's I use a Hornady 158grain SWCHP #10428..........I wish Hornady made this semi wadcutter hollow point in a .314 diameter for my .32's
The only drawback to these Hornady lead projectiles are the lube powder that funks up my press [Dillon 550B] and needs to be brushed and blown every 10-15-20 rounds, as It can accumulate enough to dent the primer when seating it.
I hope this helps to some degree, and if I can be of any other assistance [a sounding board?], please feel free..........
IMHO.......I believe a .327FedMag in a 632 S&W may be the BEST carry piece possible. Of course, certain factors are apparent.
Did I mention that I am fond of .32's ??????

 

[I'm3rd]

Thanks for your detailed reply OZO, your thoughts on loads for the .32 Long are similar to mine. I worked up to the max 231 charge that the Speer literature that came with the bullets recommends for the 60 grain Gold Dot, which is 3.4 gr of W231. According to the data sheet that load should deliver somewhere around 1030 fps give or take 50-75 fps, and although her gun has a 3" barrel it seems to me that it should be in at least the lower half of that ballpark. I am beginning to think that the 60 gr Gold Dot bullet was designed for the Federal .327 magnum and Speer is simply trying to sell it to handloaders who load any of the .32 caliber rounds. At least that little bullet has great penetration for it's size. If blew through a row of water filled one gallon milk jugs and kept on going across the uninhabited hollow behind my home here in the mountains. Those that I fired vertically into a 20" deep plastic container filled with water went through that 20" of water, the thick, hard plastic bottom of the container, and buried themselves in the hard dirt underneath. I want to do some more experimenting before I give up on that Speer bullet, and if it doesn't work out I can always just fall back on the 98 gr cast lead flat nose semi-wadcutters that I have been loading with a max charge of 231 that I found in an old Handloader's Digest. The data says it safely delivers around 1000 fps in a 3" model 30 Smith, and that's not too bad for that old round. Thanks again for your well thought out advice, it's much appreciated.

 

[358156hp]

The 32 S&W Long doesn't have enough energy to cause a bullet to expand when it hits soft tissue, as you've discovered. Think more about hard cast full or semi-wadcutters, loaded as hot as your wife can handle, if you absolutely must use that .32 and rely on bullet design, rather than mechanical expansion to maximize effectiveness. You could also consider a 22 magnum revolver for her if you can find a suitable one. The 22 mag is just now coming into it's own for low-recoil self-defense loads. I see even Hornady has come up with a loading.

 

[McShooty]

Some thoughts that occur to me while contemplating this thread: I am wondering if water is a reliable medium for assessing bullet expansion. I think I might choose several inches of wet phone book, or some such. Pure lead would be the best bet for expansion at .32 Long energies. However, when you can't have both, I think penetration is preferable to expansion. If I were mortally threatened while carrying a .32 tossing 60-grainers at 1000 fps, I would go for the base of the neck, the adams apple, or the middle of the face, double taps if possible, and not worry one whit about expansion. This would be quite discouraging to an assailant. Sorry to be gruesome, but we are talking self defense here, saving our own life. Therefore, we should teach our wives how to shoot well and not let them go forth with a marginal piece without a bunch of practice. And with that kind of practice, perhaps they could handle a .357, a 2-inch Model 19 or Ruger SP101. So much the better. And lastly, a person who knows he or she is going in harm's way should carry nothing less than a .357 magnum.

 

[Tex1001]

I have been experimenting with the Speer 60 gr. Gold Dots and I notice your velocity data is estimated. I have developed loads for three 32 longs: A model 30-1, 1 7/8" barrel
A 1947 vintage I-frame, 3" barrel
An H&R solid frame swing out cylinder, 4" barrel

I developed three loads for use in all three revolvers before Speer started including 32 long data. I have tested these long-term and found no pressure signs from my revolvers (Primer abnormalities, sticky extraction, etc.) As a matter of fact, I stopped pouring in powder when I stopped getting black smudged cases (A low pressure sign). These loads are also used in two friends' model 30s. Please note the heavier load I've listed with the Gold Dots.
I use Starline new cases and Win SP primers. Velocities were measured 4 feet from the muzzles with a CD chronograph. All test charges were individually weighed. Cases were moderately crimped with a Lee crimp die.

Hornady 90gr LSWC- 2.3 gr. Win231- 679fps low, 695fps high

Hornady 90gr LSWC- 2.5gr. Bullseye- 836fps low, 859fps high

Speer 60gr JHP- 4.1gr. Win231- 1006fps low, 1053fps high

I know that the Speer load looks high, but I am not a hot rodder and it is a longtime working load in five revolvers. I would naturally approach the 4.1 gr. loading carefully. It appears that Speer may be overly cautious.



_______________________
Faint heart nor false heart e're won- anything of real value

 

[358156hp]

It's really interesting that this comes up today. Last Saturday, I walked into the LGS and was shown a large pile of bagged, cast bullets, RCBS 98 gr SWC, to be exact. I bought them all at $1.00/lb, a little over 35 lbs of them. I bought them to melt down, I don't currently have any 32s. I mentioned the bullets to a friend, and HE wants to sell me back the H&R 732 I sold him over 20 years ago, at a good price. I'm thinking it over, but for the life of me can't remember how well the H&R shoots. All told, I could have the revolver, bullets, brass & dies for under $200.00. This is way off topic, and I apologize for that, but it is a heck of a deal.