WHAT A BETTER ROUND?

[MY4GIRLSDADS&W4LIFE]

What's a better round for my .45 m&p with a 4.5 inch barrel ?The golden saber with 230gr or 185gr?I'm thinking the 185gr because of the extra speed compared to the 230gr as faster than 230 but heavy enough to produce hydroshock and a lot of kinetic energy.The reason I ask is I was watching some videos from brass fetcher and the 9mm saber I think 147 grain looked more damaging because of impact speed compared to the 230gr saber in .45 cal????

 

[Rastoff]

Bigger is always better when talking about defensive rounds.

 

[MY4GIRLSDADS&W4LIFE]

Bigger is always better when talking about defensive rounds.

Heavier or bigger diameter ?

 

[CaptRon956]

Heavier or bigger diameter ?

Probably both, but in my case I only own a 380 & 9mm so when I carry the 9, I use Winchester Defend which is a 147 gr. JHP.

 

[Fepa13]

In my opinion with the .45 acp, using the heavier 230 gr would be a better choice. The agencies that I know of that use the .45 tend to favor one of the several 230 +p jhp's that are available and seem to be happy with their performance.

 

[MY4GIRLSDADS&W4LIFE]

In my opinion with the .45 acp, using the heavier 230 gr would be a better choice. The agencies that I know of that use the .45 tend to favor one of the several 230 +p jhp's that are available and seem to be happy with their performance.

Makes sense but that 230gr round is NOT +P for that extra speed.

 

[Motorsporting]

IIRC, any .45 ACP under 4" barrel suffers a lot from loss of velocity. I think out of a 4.5" 230g should be fine, but I'm not an expert on the topic.

 

[Fepa13]

Makes sense but that 230gr round is NOT +P for that extra speed.

I was referring to what I know to be used by some agencies/dept's. I still believe the .45 does better with the 230 gr load even if it's not +p. Unless I'm mistaken, I think Remington golden saber loads are pretty warm in their standard pressure and come close to other manufacturer's +p loads...could be wrong, going on memory here. Either way, 230 gr for .45 is the way to go imho.

 

[Rastoff]

Heavier or bigger diameter ?

Yes, emphatically yes. Both bigger and heavier is better.

Striking someone in self-defense is all about transfer of energy. It doesn't matter if you're using a tool or your empty hands, the more force you can transfer to the recipient the better. Large flat surfaces do this really nicely.

This is why hollow points are so good at defensive shooting. By expanding, they are able to transfer more energy. Small pointy rounds, like the .223Rem, do not transfer as much energy because they penetrate really well. Of course there's more to it than that, but that is the basic premise.

Because the best reliability you can expect from a JHP is that it might expand, it's best to pick the heaviest one, with the largest diameter to start with. Remember, a 115gr 9mm JHP might expand, but a .45ACP won't get smaller.

 

[ATF]

This is a complicated subject and everyone has their own opinion. Basically you want the fastest heaviest round possible, but then you can run into problems with over-penetration. Do you really need a round that'll shoot through six water jugs instead of four? Or the one that goes the furthest through gelatin? Normal pressure .45 JHP is more than sufficient to do the job in any normal weight. Find the weight and brand that shoots right for you. If some perp pulls a gun on you, you double tap or keep shooting until he goes down and remember perps don't usually travel solo. That's why lots of people prefer 9mm because of the extra capacity, but that's another story.

 

[Fred Ward]

The Better 45

Truth is, it doesn't matter. Shot placement is far more important that bullet diameter, weight, or configuration. A .22LR in the left eye beats the hell out of a .44 Magnum miss. Spend less time worrying about what's effective and more time on what works in your handgun, is most accurate, and is most reliable.

 

[Doug M.]

Go here http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?4337-Service-Caliber-Handgun-Duty-and-Self-Defense-Ammo and look at what Doc Roberts has to say. Easily the leading expert in the field.

 

[supplier]

Makes sense but that 230gr round is NOT +P for that extra speed.

I'm in favor of heavier loads myself, but why do you case of extra speed of +P in defense full length barrel gun? I would understand in +P in sub 3.5" barrels to make sure HPJ works properly. +P means less control on follow up shot... my 2c

 

[Rastoff]

Do you really need a round that'll shoot through six water jugs instead of four? Or the one that goes the furthest through gelatin?

This is why 12" is the depth in gelatin that is considered necessary for self-defense rounds. More penetration is not the goal, a larger wound cavity is.

 

[wrhk33]

IN 45acp I'm of the old school, 230 grain. For me the whole point of the 45acp is the heavy bullet. In this caliber I really don't look for +P loads. I have not done research on this, I just like simple.

 

[PilotRights]

Force = Mass x Acceleration
At least, that's what I was taught...

 

[PilotRights]

This is why 12" is the depth in gelatin that is considered necessary for self-defense rounds. More penetration is not the goal, a larger wound cavity is.

I'd rather see a large wound cavity... Or two.. Or nine..


Evan

 

[hoc9sw]

In the process of breaking in a couple of new .45s I was without ammo (back during the drought). I scrounged 100 WWB 185g rounds (my mindset is .45 = 230g), and had issues with constant FTC & FTE (63 of 100). I finished them , went back to 230g, and all was good on the range.

I have no specs / tech details other than what worked. My rule is use what works.

 

[fdw]

Personally, I prefer the 185 grain Corbon DPX +P because I tend to shoot it better. And I've shot a lot of different defensive brands and weights...

I have no worries that it will get the job done.

 

[moxie]

This is why hollow points are so good at defensive shooting. By expanding, they are able to transfer more energy. Small pointy rounds, like the .223Rem, do not transfer as much energy because they penetrate really well. Of course there's more to it than that, but that is the basic premise.

An AR loaded with .223 Rem. would be my first choice over any handgun for self defense. Notwithstanding the bullets' smallness and pointyness.