WWII .38 Revolvers how did they reload them?

[dmk0210]

I know that the 45ACP guns used half moon clips, but how did WWII soldiers reload their 38 caliber revolvers? How did they carry extra ammo?

I'm assuming ammo was reloaded singly and carried loose in pockets or pouches. Does anybody have any knowledge on this subject?

Does anyone know of any period youtube videos or pdf manuals on the subject?


To commemorate the 75th anniversary of D-Day, I'm planning a range session using guns of D-Day. I have a Garand, M1 Carbine, 1911A1, No4 Enfield, Kar98 and a S&W British Service Revolver chambered in 38/200 (38 S&W). I'm planning to use them authentically, loading the rifles from clips, shooting rifles from field positions, shooting handguns one handed, etc. (All this said just for context.)

 

[s&wchad]

The Navy had canvas ammo pouches that hung from a web pistol belt with the typical wireform hanger. These had a snap button and unfolded to expose six cartridge loops.

They weren't very popular and are hard to find today. I've read that they were discontinued late in the war and first aid pouches were recommended for extra ammo.

 

[THEmodelof1989]

So what a lot of people don't understand about the military is that not everyone carries a handgun. IN FACT, the only soldiers in the Army that carry handguns are military police and officers.

As someone that worked for a living and had to lug a worthless beretta M9 through the mountains of Afghanistan, I can personally attest to how worthless handguns are in war.

The bottom line is, how many rifle reloads am I not going to carry just so I can carry more handgun ammunition?

 

[Art Doc]

The revolver was such a very secondary weapon and used so seldomly it's possible that very little if any extra ammo was carried. When it was I suspect 6 or 12 rounds were simply thrown into one of those big pockets on the BDU jacket.

 

[Absalom]

There are plenty of photos of Navy aviators, a main group carrying revolvers in WW II, with Victorys in shoulder holsters and bandolier-type cartridge loops along the chest strap.

I have some pics on my desktop I’ll add to the post later.

PS: Here you go. Pic 1 is an unnamed Marine, pic 2 a Lt. Stubblebine USN, 1944.

 

[Thuer]

Like this for the Webley MK IV and the Smith and Wesson Victory model in .38/200.

 

[dmk0210]

So what a lot of people don't understand about the military is that not everyone carries a handgun. IN FACT, the only soldiers in the Army that carry handguns are military police and officers.

I understand that, but in WWII there were officers, NCOs, tank crew, and other folks who were not riflemen, were not issued carbines and were issued handguns. I've read memoirs of some servicemen who were given the choice between carbine or pistol. Some of those had 1911s and some had revolvers.

My question is about that small group that had revolvers. It was issued gear to some people. There must have been a military standard for that weapon, even if it was left over from WW I and earlier.


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[dmk0210]

Like this for the Webley MK IV and the Smith and Wesson Victory model in .38/200.

That is cool! Thanks Thuer.

There are plenty of photos of Navy aviators, a main group carrying revolvers in WW II, with Victorys in shoulder holsters and bandolier-type cartridge loops along the chest strap.

I have some pics on my desktop I’ll add to the post later.

PS: Here you go. Pic 1 is an unnamed Marine, pic 2 a Lt. Stubblebine USN, 1944.

Those are cool pics. I never noticed those ammo loops on pilots before. Thanks Absalom.

 

[cd228]

So what a lot of people don't understand about the military is that not everyone carries a handgun. IN FACT, the only soldiers in the Army that carry handguns are military police and officers.

I'd say that is a unit TTP. If you actually look at the unit MTOEs or the BOIP for the pistol, in addition to Os and SNCOs they are for armored vehicle crewmen, medics, gunners, CA, etc. I've seen enlisted folks carry pistols.

That said given the lack of pistol training I've observed in most units, I'd rather everyone carry an M4A1. The MP unit I was in did additional pistol training and qual and the 31 series troops were passable.

 

[Absalom]

On a side note, there were speed loaders around, although there is no evidence that the US military adopted any. But earlier, the British definitely did for the topbreak Webleys.

Below the Prideux device, called a "magazine", and an advertisement, undated, and an American speedloader for .38 from the 1930s, made by the Revolver Cartridge Clip Corp. of New York.

The latter are sometimes offered for sale as "Victory speed loaders". Don't take that literally

 

[dmk0210]

That is cool Absalom. I had no idea anybody was using speedloaders (other than clips) that early.

 

[murphydog]

1917 Army revolvers were in wide use with MPs and some front-line troops in WW II. Ask Brad Pitt, he was one of them (in a movie).

Regarding revolver reloading, I doubt it happened very much in combat. I recall reading that WW II British troops were issued a .38 Enfield (or Webley) and 12 rounds of ammo, so prolonged firing was likely not anticipated.

 

[dmk0210]

Here's a new one on me. US Army railroad crew. Here are two officers with revolvers carried in an interesting way. The left man appears to be using a 1911 mag pouch and a crossdraw cavalry holster.

 

[OFT II]

And the magazine pouch appears to be empty.

 

[Absalom]

The railroad officer pictures (there are more like this) have been much discussed. The guns are apparently 1917s. But the photo session seems to have occurred for PR purposes and the gun rigs were almost certainly just props. So drawing any conclusions as to actual daily carry is inadvisable.

 

[dmk0210]

And the magazine pouch appears to be empty.

Yeah, it's interesting that he has it on the belt. Maybe it's for some tools, carry his pencils, who knows?

 

[dmk0210]

The railroad officer pictures (there are more like this) have been much discussed. The guns are apparently 1917s. But the photo session seems to have occurred for PR purposes and the gun rigs were almost certainly just props. So drawing any conclusions as to actual daily carry is inadvisable.

Interesting. I never saw them before. I have noticed some other servicemen carrying handguns crossdraw like that though.

 

[Muley Gil]

Those are standard cavalry holsters. Traditionally, the right hand was used to draw the sword or saber and the left hand drew the revolver. When swords were discarded, the right hand did a reserve draw, turning the back of the hand towards the body. Later, during WW II, a standard right hand holster for the 1909 and 1917 revolvers of the same pattern (half flap) was adopted.

 

[dmk0210]

It's funny how remnants of the old way of doing things linger in training. I was just reading a story about a soldier who enlisted in 1936 and joined the horse cavalry. They were issued 1911s, but told to load only 5 rounds in the magazines. He said they never loaded 7 rounds in the 1911s. Only 5 rounds, just like the old SAA had.

Qualification was on horseback, 2 rounds on a target to the left, two to the target at the right, one at a target straight ahead. Then they rode up to the next station, reloading at a gallop and repeated the process.

 

[jimmyj]

U.S. Military:
.38 Revolver-canvas cartridge pouch or cartridge loops ( first aid pouches were used for cartridges in a pinch)


Model 1917 .45acp Revolvers- there was a canvas pouch that held three or four half moon clips. The pouch was folded and held closed with a snap. When un-snapped the pouch un-folded to reveal the half moon clips.