Be careful in Illinois

[sctman800]

Now that we have CCW in Illinois but burdened with 16 hours of required training there are problems. Two instructors have been found to give the required certificate without the required training hours. They were cutting the hours approx in half. I personally do not agree with the amount of training, something like the four hour Utah would be more reasonable. That is because the law is confusing and hard to understand because it was written by people that know little about firearms and didn't want the law any way.
The instructors have had their certifications revoked and the students they trained have been denied their permits. This has affected almost 100 students that now must hope for a refund and retake training from a certified instructor. Terrible situtation for the students.
If someone takes a CCW course from someone that does not teach the required subjects or shortcuts the hours ask for your money back now! Otherwise you are in danger of being denied or possibly revoked if the instructor is later de-certified. From what I have read the instructors did teach the required hours to some students but the ISP denied all. Be carefull when choosing an instructor. Jim.

 

[Rastoff]

This is a good update. Thanks for posting it. I'm sure there will be many politicians looking for anything they can grab onto to attempt to derail the CCW initiative in IL.

On the 16 hours thing.
Not long ago I started a thread asking about training. Every response I got said that 8 hours was not enough. Don't you think that 16 hours of training, assuming it's real training and not just time filler, would be a good thing?

This is a slippery slope. The second amendment assures our right to carry. In it's most basic form, I don't believe any training should be required. However, carrying a gun is a big responsibility and I think everyone who carries should seek quality training. That may sound contradictory, but it's not.

 

[Kaptainkoolz]

Is the training at least inexpensive? seems like a long expensive training session would reduce the amount of folks who apply. No training requirements here in WA but I did take a course for my utah CPL, IMHO didnt learn much from it

 

[Rastoff]

The CCW classes that I know of mostly cover the law. CA, for example requires that a CCW class cover the laws and gun safety as a minimum. Personally I think they should cover more gun handling.

 

[jcbrew]

Is the training at least inexpensive? seems like a long expensive training session would reduce the amount of folks who apply. No training requirements here in WA but I did take a course for my utah CPL, IMHO didnt learn much from it

The instructor sets the price, most I have seen run 100 to 150 per 8hrs, if you are prior military (must show DD-214) you only need the 8hrs. But I have already seen ads for "specials", probably due to the less than anticipated mass of applications. Total cost for residents can be over $500. class + 150 for application + 50 for digital prints, has stopped many people I know from applying

 

[Kaptainkoolz]

I thought the bleeding heart liberals wanted to help minorities? Minorities are poor, minorities need to protect themselves, minorities live in high crime areas, I say subsidize and price cap this training, would do a lot more good then harm.

 

[Rastoff]

I thought the bleeding heart liberals wanted to help minorities? Minorities are poor, minorities need to protect themselves, minorities live in high crime areas, I say subsidize and price cap this training, would do a lot more good then harm.

None from the demographic you're talking about would ever get a license to carry.

The politicians know this. That's why they're not worried about them. They know this kind of law only goes after those who aren't voting for them.

 

[badge]

You cannot have enough training. Trust me.

 

[sctman800]

I watched the floor debate the day the bill was passed. Origonaly the bill was written by Branden Phelps a southern Illinois pro gun Democrat with input from the NRA and other gun rights groups. Then as happens in Illinois the land of corruption and anti-gun Chicago the bill was gutted and replaced. The "new" bill was written by anti-gun polititions with little knowledge of guns and only doing it because they were forced by the federal court.
The bill ended up nothing like it had been written by Phelps and is not what anyone would call great. It is however a good start and a lot better than several of our other states have now. This final bill was presented by the most powerfull politition in Illinois, speaker of the house Mike Madigan a long time anti-gun politition. His speech at the time laid out his decision that "the courts have ordered the state to pass a law allowing CCW." "This will be the most expensive and restrictive in the US but will pass the mandate of the court."
So that is basicly how we came about to have our present CCW laws. Jim.

 

[HankG]

By the time I was done with everything needed to get my training done, get an electronic ID from the state, electronically send my documentation over the computer, pay the ISP their $150.00 to process everything, my total cost was close to $500.00 in this state. We have the 2nd highest unemployment rate in the country. $500.00 is a lot of money to many people living here. You would hope the people doing the instructing are intelligent enough to do the job properly.

 

[ispcapt]

IL isn't the only state that had instructors lying about providing training. A couple of years ago OH had 2 or 3 instructors do the same thing. Those instructors were charged criminally and convicted.
Hope they do the same with the IL instructors.

 

[Rastoff]

We have several CCW instructors here that also dodge giving real training. They are in it for the $$ and couldn't care less about actually imparting any good knowledge. In fact, many of them give out wrong information.

Alas, there is little oversight. These disingenuous instructors give all of us a bad name.

 

[RBald]

$200 for 16 hours of training and range time, $150 to state for permit and $50 fingerprinting. Of course very few classes are Saturday and Sunday so you need a weekday off if you work you burn a vacation day or personal day if you can. Also my instructors required 130 rounds factory only ammo 100 for training and practice and 30 to qualify with. Not complaining though at least now if I feel the need I can carry my firearm legally, something I thought would never happen in Illinois.

 

[Kaptainkoolz]

Any reciprocity with other states?

 

[RBald]

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/illinois.pdf

 

[Marie13]

You also get previous credit for NRA Basic Pistol/Personal Protection Inside the Home/Personal Protection Outside the Home (8 hours) or for separate classes for FL, UT, MI, hunter safety (4 hours each).

My cost wasn't really that bad. I took Basic Pistol two years ago ($70), as I suspected it would give some sort of training credit if/when IL got CCW. My 2nd 8 hours was $150. Application fee $150 + $60 for prints.

I've had my CCL for three weeks now. Carry everywhere, including church. At work, I lock my Shield up in my car. I was told, in front of a bunch of coworkers when the big boss found out I had my CCL, "no guns in the building." Not a word about parking lot.

 

[Donn]

No offense Jim, but if you're familiar with Illinois/Chicago politics, you know they'll put up every roadblock possible in the way of your getting carry of any kind. Were these instructors guilty as charged? Maybe, maybe not. I lived in Chicago long enough to know the state and local pols are snakes and will do everything in their power to deny residents their 2A rights.

 

[sctman800]

No offense Jim, but if you're familiar with Illinois/Chicago politics, you know they'll put up every roadblock possible in the way of your getting carry of any kind. Were these instructors guilty as charged? Maybe, maybe not. I lived in Chicago long enough to know the state and local pols are snakes and will do everything in their power to deny residents their 2A rights.

It is my understanding they were origonaly turned in to the ISP by their students. The state, to the best of my knowledge, has agreed not to prosecute if they refund all the training fees and they are forever banned as instructors.
One thing I would like to correct is fingerprinting, it is NOT required but the ISP are given 30 extra days to process your application. As an instructor my prints were required which cost me $55. and a trip of 80 miles round trip. Jim.

One other important prior credit is having served in the military gives eight hours credit towards the 16 total.

 

[vito]

When I saw the title of this topic I assumed you were going to discuss the various places that concealed carry is not legal. Carrying in Illinois requires a lot of thought since so many areas are designated in the law as gun free zones. I have had my IL license now for about 3 weeks and have carried daily. Once or twice I have found myself in an awkward position when in the course of my day I had reason to go to a place that, by law, does not allow me to carry. I keep a small steel safe, secured with a steel cable in my car so that I can lock up the gun before going into a prohibited area.

Fortunately for me, living outside of Chicago, I have seen very, very few "no guns allowed" posted signs.

And since the IL license does not cover you in other states, I keep my Utah and my Pennsylvania concealed carry licenses in my wallet as well.

 

[RBald]

Look at the link in post 15, the Illinois permit is good in other states, not all but a few. No other states permits are good in Illinois although.