Presses -'Short Term Gain. Long Term Pain'

[Skeet 028]

But who is ignoring cost?

How do I amortize the cost of a Dillon (what you advocate) over the cost of a further 11,000 across my expected lifetime?

You make assumptions that are not based on reality without first asking why my age, life expectancy or future firearms utilization might be.
You really are over thinking this stuff

As such, you pontificate about ignorance based on ignorance.



But, as previously indicated, I am not a "serious competition shooter", so the rest of your argument is mere sophistry.

As I clearly indicated in post #36, if I were interested in shooting commercial quantities of ammunition, I would own a progressive press, but that is not what I am attempting to achieve as a handloader.

So, if you consider my post - rather than your "Blue Kool Aid" response - what would your suggest as a practical alternative?

Good grief Amortizing costs etc etc ??? You could keel over in 5 minutes(please don't). Single stage turret progressive? The reason for the post 90% of competition shooters blah blah was just pointing out...they use them because they WORK... usually with little problems. Not a blue kool aid response. Heck if he were speaking of Hornady machines it would have been red kool aid. This is for people who may want a progressive. I had a Star but it was not the most practical for me as it was not easily convertible to other cals. I don't worry too much about the cost(within reason) of something as long as it does what I want it to. Note I said want not need. I load on all the types of presses as I don't need a progressive for...say 243. Don't load that many. I am down to progressives for handgun rounds and things like 223 and 308. Some handgun rounds(41,44,45 Colt) are loaded on a semi progressive(550 has to be manually turned) rather than a full progressive(650 or 1050) as I just don't shoot all that many of them. The reason I no longer use either Lee or Hornady was they just had too many little(or large) glitches that had to be fixed. Yep I still use single stage presses or load single stage on my T7s. It doesn't matter what kind of press you use or brand for that matter. If you reload to shoot or shoot to reload...spend as little time reloading as possible. Much more fun to shoot. Don't shoot enough to Need a progressive? Try one anyway. Red or Blue

 

[fredj338]

But who is ignoring cost?

How do I amortize the cost of a Dillon (what you advocate) over the cost of a further 11,000 across my expected lifetime?

You make assumptions that are not based on reality without first asking why my age, life expectancy or future firearms utilization might be.

As such, you pontificate about ignorance based on ignorance.

But, as previously indicated, I am not a "serious competition shooter", so the rest of your argument is mere sophistry.

As I clearly indicated in post #36, if I were interested in shooting commercial quantities of ammunition, I would own a progressive press, but that is not what I am attempting to achieve as a handloader.

So, if you consider my post - rather than your "Blue Kool Aid" response - what would your suggest as a practical alternative?

I am making no assumptions, just stating some facts. Talk about assumptions, just what is commercial "quantity of ammunition"? The rest of your response is incoherent. I quoted you because you seem confused about the workings of a good progressive because there are very few problems, much less a litany.
I only offer knowledge based on a lot of personal exp. BTW, 40 or 90, doesn't mean much if you just want to buy something. I personally look at any tool purchase by what it will do for me. Cost is secondary if the tool does what I want it to. No I am not rich just practical. It is never practical to buy things multiple times. Amortizing cost requires you actually shoot enough to make reloading even practical. For most I recommend once you cross 100rds a month, think about reloading. At 500 per month, think about a progressive. No time to reload, regardless of round count, got progressive.
BTW, there is no practical alternative to a progressive. Some say turret, but you do the same amount of work as a ss press, just a bit faster. Even a krap progressive can allow less work, if it is reliable, which many are not. So my aged friend, it is not about koolaid drinking but what is the best tool.

 

[fredj338]

Once again the Dillon lovefest is here and I am no 'Daisy'. I have been reloading since the late 60's. I have two Dillons. A 450 upgraded to a 550B at no charge by Dillon and a 550B I got just after They came out. Bought one of the new 550's at a gun show that had all the bells and whistles. Auto index, powder check, auto prime, ETC. Oh by the way You can get a Dillon with powder check and only 4 stations. Traded the new Dillon for a new 3 screw Ruger 41 mag. Still have My old CH inline progressive, but now retired. I use a RCBS Rock Chucker for most rifle and an old #2 for the big stuff. Bought a Hornaday LNL when they first came out and sold it in two months to a club member for $100 which I put toward a 550.

So i am confused you apparently like Dillon enough to buy one multiple times???

 

[Skeet 028]

2 1050S 2 650S 1 550B 1 550C Large and small primer for each . Admittedly I did not pay retail for any of them. Heck the first 1050 cost 300 bucks at an auction. Set up for 45 auto with my load...well close. The powder was set up a tenth of a grain less than I loaded. Used it one time and I found another in small primer set up for 38 Sp two weeks later. Paid 900 for it at another auction. It was new in the box and the fellow had paid 1550 for it All that said I also took a Hornady LnL on trade for a gun I sold. 100 bucks. So if you look around stuff can be found cheap!

 

[Peak53]

So, are we shooting 250 rounds per month or 1,000? Distinct difference.

 

[cds43016]

I replaced the primer seater plug assembly with another I got from Hornady. I also left the nickel I glued on the press body where the divot forms.

I loaded 200 357 Mag rounds and fired them without a light strike. Before I would have had several.

What’s different about the new primer seater assembly I don’t know, but it seems to be working.

Hopefully, this corrects the problem.

It’s been a long and painful journey. I just hope it’s over.

 

[rwsmith]

I shoot a few hundred rounds a month......

...and I'm looking to streamline my operation. My shoulders are giving me trouble and the handle pumping is getting rough. The girl on the Dillon page just pumps it back and forth.

Now I'm using a Rockchucker. I prime with a Lee hand primer. I don't think I can justify a progressive. I like my
RCBS powder measure, but the handle on that is like cranking a boat onto a trailer too.

I really liked the Hornady answer to 'use less powder'. What a gas. Big eye roll here.
And I definitely don't like the 'flush primers are all you get answer either."

This is a great thread. An actual IN DEPTH discussion of the pros and cons of each brand of progressive.

I wonder what the type of primer feed is used in ammo factories? Is there a simple way to emulate that???

 

[J. R. WEEMS]

PRESSES

I stand by all of RCBS's products, except one. I bought the 7 stage Pro Chucker and its been pure agony. Primers can get stuck sideways in the case leading to a huge headache to safely extract. Indexing was difficult and finally has gotten to the point I have to finish the indexing manually for every single load. Hate the thing, couple of times came close to being destroyed with a sledgehammer. Its such a junk pile that I wonder if RCBS even builds them or just brands them.

Too late to return it, and I never return things unless its completely broken anyways, I've just gotten used to it, although it has soured me on progressive reloading in general. Not going to spend a bunch of money for a blue machine because at some point I'll never make my money back buying a bunch of presses. Every time I think about mass loading handgun I get the feeling I should just skip it altogether. Only time I have fun anymore making ammunition is on the single stage, which is more fun anyways.

In my foray into the possibility of a new press I found out the latest RCBS stuff is made in China. This may be old news to those more in the loop than myself but it was news to me. That being the case, that possibility has been scratched. I agree about the Lee, which is how I started some 40 years ago and discarded. question might be, has the Lee improved in the last 35 years or so?? Just wondering.

 

[Kiwi cop]

In my foray into the possibility of a new press I found out the latest RCBS stuff is made in China. This may be old news to those more in the loop than myself but it was news to me. That being the case, that possibility has been scratched. I agree about the Lee, which is how I started some 40 years ago and discarded. question might be, has the Lee improved in the last 35 years or so?? Just wondering.

I have heard some good things about the Lee loadmasters, but have not tried one so will not say more than that. The Lee auto drum powder measure is, in my experience, more consistent than the auto disk was. Being fully enclosed there is almost no powder leak if the drum is tightened just short of not fully turning.

The weakest item with the pro 1000 is the priming system. I am repeating myself here but two turrets per calibre, one for sizing/depriming and the second for powder drop, seating and factory crimp dies. Prime by hand.

When I get in from the range, several times a week, my cases go into the tumbler for a few hours and then into a plastic container. When the container gets over half full, a spray with lube then through the press to resize and deprime. Reprime by hand and then into another sealed plastic container. When that container gets full, or I am running low in a caliber I am shooting, change turrets and reload.

I should add this system works for me as I have three Lee Pro 1000 presses set up for .45, 9mm and .38/357 and each has its own powder measure permanently installed. Also my reloading shed contains my exercise machines so after exercise I can sit down at the press for half hour or so and cool off.

I want to have a look at the Lee Safety Prime press though. It just might replace my Lee Turret press.

 

[hdwhit]

I undertook a similar analysis to what you presented in Post #1 at varous times in my history of reloading. Each time, I ended up coming down on the side of a staying with a single stage press. Within the last year, I went through it again in light of my impending retirement and decided to treat myself to an RCBS Rock Chucker.

There are single stage, turret and progressive presses out there to meet the needs of various segments of the marketplace. I am not interested in production volume; for me loading the cartridge is an end unto itself - moreso even than shooting it, so a single-stage is ideal for me. Those who want to speed up the process should look to other press types.

I think in time you will end up being happy with your Hornady; most people who have one seems to enjoy it once they get "married to it".

 

[Bkreutz]

I wonder what the type of primer feed is used in ammo factories? Is there a simple way to emulate that???

Here's a close approximation to a commercial loader, this is pretty much the ultimate for a home reloader. Camdex Automatic Loading Systems Pretty trick system if you have an extra $25,000 lying around (and you thought Dillon's were expensive)

 

[cds43016]

I think in time you will end up being happy with your Hornady; most people who have one seems to enjoy it once they get "married to it".

I hope so. It’s been a very difficult courtship.

 

[Engineer1911]

Make 10" long handle (plus thread length to mount on press) and you will triple the speed of a Rock Chucker. You don't need a ~16" long handle to bell the case mouth of a 38 Special case.

I use the original handle for resizing cases, and the short handle for belling case mouths, seating bullets or crimping. In a pinch I will use my upgraded Dillon 450 for small primers and Dillion 550 for large primers.

I don't load handgun or 223 ammo on a single stage.

 

[DRAINSMITH]

I replaced the primer seater plug assembly with another I got from Hornady. I also left the nickel I glued on the press body where the divot forms.

I loaded 200 357 Mag rounds and fired them without a light strike. Before I would have had several.

What’s different about the new primer seater assembly I don’t know, but it seems to be working.

Hopefully, this corrects the problem.

It’s been a long and painful journey. I just hope it’s over.

The old primer punch has a step down in the punch its self and the new one is solid.
I sent you a PM so I can help you get your press up an running 100%.