Same with the bugs and problems you might encounter in the new ones. They give you the opportunity and motivation to learn about the inner workings of your gun that you might otherwise never get to discover.
S&W M19 Classic fails in Hickock.45 demo
- Thread starter Doug.38PR
- Start date
Arquebus357
Member
I'll say it again:
It's terribly convenient that the worse the reputation for the newer S&W revolvers becomes, the more valuable the older ones become. Makes me suspicious.
This site is not billed as a site "By and For collectors" so I feel I can express that.
It's terribly convenient that the worse the reputation for the newer S&W revolvers becomes, the more valuable the older ones become. Makes me suspicious.
This site is not billed as a site "By and For collectors" so I feel I can express that.
Your theory depends entirely on whether those "collectors" are mainly buyers or mainly sellers.I'll say it again:
It's terribly convenient that the worse the reputation for the newer S&W revolvers becomes, the more valuable the older ones become. Makes me suspicious.
This site is not billed as a site "By and For collectors" so I feel I can express that.
As a mainly buyer, even at my advanced age, I normally encourage younger folks to go for brand new Smith & Wessons, mainly to keep the mothership in business and to leave more of the older collectibles for moi! 
However, for friends & family, I go in the opposite direction.
Can't have friends & family being mad at me. 
Well, obviously you have different experiences than I. Nothing wrong with that.
Mine consists of owning 3 different S&W revolvers made between 1971-1982. 4 Colt Double Action revolvers made from 1944-1980.
My father owns a like new M10-5 from 1971 with original box and schematics. Handling dozens of older revolvers at gunshows. Handling dozens of brand new S&W revolvers of different frame sizes from under the glass at various large and small gunstores over the years.
I've had friends that own new S&W revolvers, shoot them, and then pick up one of mine and say "wow! That is so much easier. So smooth"
Finally: comparing the new Colt Cobra to a modern S&W J frame from under the glass at several local stores. Colt got it right, I was impressed. Their action is as good as any older D frame.
This is true of all modern made revolvers of all companies. (Colt notwithstanding). Some suggest it is a matter of keeping children from being able to pull tge trigger to appease politicians. Whatever the case, I believe this is one reason a lot of people tend to steer away from revolvers today because of the complaint of difficulty of modern double actions. (Unless you want to pay extra to a gunsmith to ease things up on the action)
S&W company would do well to "lighten up" figuratively and literally.
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I'll say it again:
It's terribly convenient that the worse the reputation for the newer S&W revolvers becomes, the more valuable the older ones become. Makes me suspicious.
This site is not billed as a site "By and For collectors" so I feel I can express that.
To me: a gun is a gun is a gun. It's not a museum piece or a safe sitter unless it was carried by a famous lawman.
I'm hopeful that the classic series would draw more attention and make it's older brothers, of which were and are veru mainstream, would keep them going instead of making them "rare".
Ribwizzard
Member
One thing I hear quite often, is how someone went to a gun store and handed a new Smith & Wesson revolver out of the case and was disappointed in how it felt..
The thing to remember is that the gun in the case was put in there brand new out of the box, no tear down and lube applied to it. You got to think about how long it's been in that case, how many times a day it's been handled, dry fired, cowboy'ed, etc, every day , every week , for however long it's been in there.
Most of the ones I have looked at out of the case have had one issue or another due to the factors I've mentioned above.
But, having purchased 3 686's, 2 629's, 1 617, and 1 m60 in the last 2 years, I either ordered them in, or asked for them to bring a couple brand new ones in the box out for me to look at, and I thoroughly checked them out before signing paperwork.
All have had no issues, all shoot well, and have beautiful triggers. Only one with wood grips chewed up my hand, but that's another story.
I also bought a m&p10, two glocks,a colt 6920, colt 1911 competition, marlin 1894, remlin 870, Winchester 101 and a model 70 featherweight brand new , and becouse I didn't buy out of the case and thoroughly examined each one before purchase have had not one hiccup or complaint about any of them.
Guns I got rid of in the last two years , beretta 92 , used, 80's model that put brass in my face, h&r top break , used, that had light strikes, m27 hp trigger was much heavier than my 686's and like stainless better, browning. 22 Belgium that shaved lead like crazy. All of these guns looked to be like new condition.
So my experience with new guns has been 100% satisfactory and used ones is pot luck.
The thing to remember is that the gun in the case was put in there brand new out of the box, no tear down and lube applied to it. You got to think about how long it's been in that case, how many times a day it's been handled, dry fired, cowboy'ed, etc, every day , every week , for however long it's been in there.
Most of the ones I have looked at out of the case have had one issue or another due to the factors I've mentioned above.
But, having purchased 3 686's, 2 629's, 1 617, and 1 m60 in the last 2 years, I either ordered them in, or asked for them to bring a couple brand new ones in the box out for me to look at, and I thoroughly checked them out before signing paperwork.
All have had no issues, all shoot well, and have beautiful triggers. Only one with wood grips chewed up my hand, but that's another story.
I also bought a m&p10, two glocks,a colt 6920, colt 1911 competition, marlin 1894, remlin 870, Winchester 101 and a model 70 featherweight brand new , and becouse I didn't buy out of the case and thoroughly examined each one before purchase have had not one hiccup or complaint about any of them.
Guns I got rid of in the last two years , beretta 92 , used, 80's model that put brass in my face, h&r top break , used, that had light strikes, m27 hp trigger was much heavier than my 686's and like stainless better, browning. 22 Belgium that shaved lead like crazy. All of these guns looked to be like new condition.
So my experience with new guns has been 100% satisfactory and used ones is pot luck.
Sounds like you have a solid strategy and success record for acquiring brand new S&W revolvers that work without needing a return trip or two to the mothership. Most of my brand new handguns I order in via the 'net, which I know is a gamble. You get what you get... no "pick & choose" choice of this one or that one. In most cases, it had been worth the money I've saved. In the case of my one and only recent brand new S&W revolver purchase, it didn't work out so well.
The funny thing is that I could have taken your approach and avoided trouble... and, for the particular gun in question (or at least a close variant of it), the added cost to me would not have been all that significant.
The lesson here: If you can afford to buy your new S&W locally, buy locally! 
It's funny you say that, because one of the first things I noticed about the 19-9 that made me say "WOW" was the trigger. I'm sort of a Neanderthal when it comes to triggers. I know really good and really bad. Anything in between is "just a trigger." This one is REALLY good.
On the other hand not too long ago, I bought a Model 66-1 that had the absolutely worst trigger of any gun I've ever bought. BUT...It was a Virginia State Police 50 anniversary gun that had spent it's entire life in a presentation case. It was just as dry as could be. A couple of drops of oil here and there, a little working the action, and it smoothed right up.
I always buy locally. When I got my 19-9 I had them bring out a couple for me to inspect and I picked the one I liked best, but there wasn't really any difference. I just had to pick one.
cowboy4evr
Member
I purchased a 19-2 " snubby " several yrs ago . After a couple of cylinders of 38spl loads , it froze up . Just like the one in the video . While looking it over I held it up to the sun light to check the cylinder gap . Where is the gap , what gap ---hmmmmm . There was a little ring of crud on the face of the cylinder and now --- NO gap . I took it home , cleaned the face of the cylinder , got out my diamond stone and stoned the face of the forcing cone a few drags . Never a problem since .
I have a 38spl load using the Keith 173 gr swc and Unique powder that is a real winner in that snubby. People complain how dirty Unique is . I will tell you that when you load the proper amount , it shoots very clean . I am not using current load data . It's used in a 357 gentlemen , so no worries ! Regards, Paul
I have a 38spl load using the Keith 173 gr swc and Unique powder that is a real winner in that snubby. People complain how dirty Unique is . I will tell you that when you load the proper amount , it shoots very clean . I am not using current load data . It's used in a 357 gentlemen , so no worries ! Regards, Paul
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Ribwizzard
Member
Sometimes I just go by what s/n sounds better to me.
Any company can have a problem. When my department replaced our aging Model 15 w/the new stainless revolvers some of them had to be returned due to serious problems that our range guys could not fix. All in all I preferred the Model 15 but the stainless revolvers were easier to maintain for us uniformed cops.
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t4terrific
Member
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2013
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I'll say it again:
It's terribly convenient that the worse the reputation for the newer S&W revolvers becomes, the more valuable the older ones become. Makes me suspicious.
This site is not billed as a site "By and For collectors" so I feel I can express that.
I honestly believe that many people would be happy enough with a new Smith if it didn't have the frame lock. There are a lot of younger online bidders that want a Smith, but don't like the lock. Many of those people would gladly argue the benefits of the new Smiths if the eyesore frame lock weren't slapping them in the face every time they looked at their new revolver.
Reduce the number of bidders and eventually the prices would drop.
In store dealers always refer to online prices when they are trying to get top dollar for older guns.
michael1000
US Veteran
while i've not bought, shot or handled any of the new classics, i'm sure they are, or can be, as good as any of the good old ones.
which would you rather spend $40k on-a new camaro or a good 1st generation one? to me the originals are better looking and feeling, although not nearly as "perfect" as the newer models. a new ss will mop the floor with an older one, but a genuine big block sucking through a holley 4 barrel will have more soul than anything computer controlled.
same diffence.
which would you rather spend $40k on-a new camaro or a good 1st generation one? to me the originals are better looking and feeling, although not nearly as "perfect" as the newer models. a new ss will mop the floor with an older one, but a genuine big block sucking through a holley 4 barrel will have more soul than anything computer controlled.
same diffence.
New one, absolutely. Dealer has a loaded ZL/1 I could drive off for around 70. Snuggle into those Recaro seats, myLink infotainment with Bose sound system, magnetic ride control, 650 hp. Now we're talking.
In the Camaro analogy, the new one certainly has comfort and performance advantages that the old cannot match. What does the new "Classic" actually do better than an original 19?
Oh man, ain't that the truth.
It's so tiring. It's every single time almost. I always want to say back: "Then why not sell it on the web"?... but that just ticks them off. Yeah, the old car vs. new car analogy (to S&W revolvers) is not a good one.
No one is trying to convince anyone that new cars with old names are somehow the same cars as the originals. It's absurd.I see nothing wrong with what the mothership is doing... i.e, calling it a "Classic 19." No one is being fooled by the name. It's obviously a new design, new manufacture product that kinda sorta reminds us of the original. But guns last a whole lot longer than your typical car. So for guns, we have the option of buying the original if we want the original.
It's a beautiful thing. For one, shoot light (110-125 gr) bullets at full power with impunity.
Which I do with the stainless version. 125 bullets shoot like a laser out of it.
