Thanks, but I’ll stick with my P&R’s.
S&W M19 Classic fails in Hickock.45 demo
- Thread starter Doug.38PR
- Start date
Thanks, but I’ll stick with my P&R’s.
Echo40
Member
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2017
- Messages
- 4,040
- Reaction score
- 7,868
Based on the original video and the follow up, I surmise that the issue was a result of the gun being too tight, so once the firearm heated up from use the metal expanded causing it to bind up.
This is one reason why I disagree with folks who act like a firearm locking up extremely tightly with very little clearance between the cylinder and frame is a good thing.
A firearm being too tight only serves to increase the margin for failure. I'll take a firearm with a looser fit that can be shoot all day without a hitch over a tight one that can't fire over 100 rounds without getting bound up and requiring a thorough cleaning to restore function.
This is one reason why I disagree with folks who act like a firearm locking up extremely tightly with very little clearance between the cylinder and frame is a good thing.
A firearm being too tight only serves to increase the margin for failure. I'll take a firearm with a looser fit that can be shoot all day without a hitch over a tight one that can't fire over 100 rounds without getting bound up and requiring a thorough cleaning to restore function.
t4terrific
Member
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2013
- Messages
- 182
- Reaction score
- 240
I just got a new model 19 last week. It’s a classic...made in 1968
The 68’s still had the silly pin in the barrel and the pointlessly countersunk cylinders.
No thanks.
I’ll stick to the newer, safer, more reliable S&W revolvers.
t4terrific
Member
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2013
- Messages
- 182
- Reaction score
- 240
Other Youtubers would have made multiple videos showing how bad S&W is based on one sample, and spend the next three months on Facebook bashing the brand relentlessly.
Just ask Sig Sauer.
What's "unsafe" about the pinned barrel and the countersunk cylinders? They may be unnecessary, but certainly don't cause a safety issue.
Genetically Swiss
US Veteran
“unnecessary features like pins and recessed cylinders gone”
Now that, is heresy!
GS
Now that, is heresy!
GS
Forester
Member
Forester
Member
lunger
Member
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2016
- Messages
- 281
- Reaction score
- 350
Any firearm old or new can fail. New ones without hand fitting are probably more likely . He was honest on his video . I enjoy older and new.The 19 "Classic" is on my buy list.
Having said that, I HATE THE NAME. As soon as someone mentions it we get dozens of "it is not a Classic" replies.And how good the old ones were. We know. We know. Everybody knows.
I wish the Mods would start a Post Lock Forum. Then every "I will never buy one" poster would not even have to read about these abominations .
Having said that, I HATE THE NAME. As soon as someone mentions it we get dozens of "it is not a Classic" replies.And how good the old ones were. We know. We know. Everybody knows.
I wish the Mods would start a Post Lock Forum. Then every "I will never buy one" poster would not even have to read about these abominations .
I think shocker and t4 are trolling us
Engine49guy
Member
Definitely some trolling going on there... lol.
Although though the older S&W's dont have the parts availability or lifetime warranty I prefer forged pre MIM/IL S&W's ...but to each his own.
The Combat Magnum (Pre 19) was designed in 1955 to handle the standard 158 grain .357 load of the day .
Years later lighter faster 110/125 grain loads are introduced and cracked K Magnum forcing cones begin to appear at the 6 O clock position on the forcing cone,
It took a while to diagnose what was cracking the forcing cone but IIRC the simple explanation was that the lighter loads "Jump" from cylinder to barrel a bit sooner with the hot gasses causing the problem.
S&W's solution was the L frame Magnum .
The newest K Magnum design eliminates the 6 O clock flat spot by using a two piece barrel and new frame.
If I was in the market for a new .357 would be looking for a 7 shot L frame Mountain gun which has one extra round and is lighter than the old Model 19/66 (dont know what new ones weigh).
Although though the older S&W's dont have the parts availability or lifetime warranty I prefer forged pre MIM/IL S&W's ...but to each his own.
The Combat Magnum (Pre 19) was designed in 1955 to handle the standard 158 grain .357 load of the day .
Years later lighter faster 110/125 grain loads are introduced and cracked K Magnum forcing cones begin to appear at the 6 O clock position on the forcing cone,
It took a while to diagnose what was cracking the forcing cone but IIRC the simple explanation was that the lighter loads "Jump" from cylinder to barrel a bit sooner with the hot gasses causing the problem.
S&W's solution was the L frame Magnum .
The newest K Magnum design eliminates the 6 O clock flat spot by using a two piece barrel and new frame.
If I was in the market for a new .357 would be looking for a 7 shot L frame Mountain gun which has one extra round and is lighter than the old Model 19/66 (dont know what new ones weigh).
Well, at least if you crack the forcing cone you won’t need Ebay to find another.
cowboy4evr
Member
I don't mind the new ones . I have 2 , 29-10's , one 4" barrel and one 6" . The 6" misfired from day one . I sent it back to the factory with a note explaining the problem . It came back , still same problem . I installed a new main spring , no better . I finally figured it out . Using a depth gauge I found the primer impression was only about 1/2 as deep on the 6" as the 4" and it was more like a " needle dimple " not rounded in the bottom . I went to Brownells , bought a new firing pin , installed it myself ( an easy fix ) and problem solved . It has performed perfectly since . Things are just parts assembled to make a gun , car , truck or whatever and sometimes one part just isn't quite right . It happens so let's not get in an uproar . We get it fixed , or in my case I figured it out and fixed it myself . I'm not going to bash the factory or start a thread about customer service . I truly enjoy my " Classic " 29-10's and have no desire to replace them with older guns . I shoot the 4" the most because I find it easy to carry in a holster , very very accurate and easy to shoot from mild to wild . I'm glad S&W brought back " the classics " . Regards, Paul
And that's how it works today, or so I found out.
You may be the absolute perfect customer for today's Smith & Wesson.
Give them a couple of tries to get it right and then, when that fails, fix it yourself! 
Doesn't get better than that! 
scruffy
Member
I handled one at LGS a few weeks ago after looking at the video here. Fit and finish looked great although the blue does not match the deep blueing of the older ones. The big disappointment came after I asked if it was ok to dry fire it...immediately I felt a rough "crunch" through the trigger on take up in double action. Bad enough to make me shake my head in disbelief. I tried a few more times and same result. Gave it back to the salesman and walked away. Surprised because my newer 66-8 has one of the smoothest triggers I have felt on any S&W revolver. I'm sure it may just have been that example, however I would not buy one without trying the trigger out first.
SLT223
Member
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2009
- Messages
- 3,514
- Reaction score
- 5,534
Im not sure what exactly you mean by clunky, but I have about sixty older Smith’s whose production dates range from the early Fifties to early Nineties. The best factory actions in my safes are, hands down, my 620 and 629-6 5”. The only early guns that come close are a couple high mileage HP’s from the mid Sixties.
RGVshooter
Member
There's some people that would "bash" the newer Smiths and praise the older ones like they're the holy grail and then there guys like me who saw Hickok45 shoots said malfunctioning firearm one handed and still hits the gong...
On a side note I did send my 686-6 recently back to Smith for a similar problem. I still haven't heard from them yet. But since it's there I opted for them to do the master revolver pack on it as well.
On a side note I did send my 686-6 recently back to Smith for a similar problem. I still haven't heard from them yet. But since it's there I opted for them to do the master revolver pack on it as well.
Echo40
Member
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2017
- Messages
- 4,040
- Reaction score
- 7,868
My only issues with modern S&W Revolvers are purely aesthetic. The older S&Ws just plain looked nicer, but for all intents and purposes, modern iterations tend to be more durable.
However, the internet has created the illusion that older S&Ws are more reliable because obviously it was impossible before the days of the internet to hear about every last instance of a lemon, and obviously by now any problematic pistols in circulation have by and large long since been serviced/repaired, so when you buy a used one any past issues it may have had were most likely addressed by the previous owner.
Furthermore, while modern CNC machining may be extremely efficient and cost much less, the tight tolerances and subsequent minimal amount of clearance between parts tends to result in the dreaded "break in" period which those who either don't enjoy shooting or own a firearm that shoots an otherwise expensive cartridge cringe at the very sound of.
Unfortunately, modern CNC machining just doesn't result in an out-of-the-box smooth action/trigger. However, that's not necessarily a bad thing because it provides you with an excuse to take it out, fondle in, work the actions, and shoot it.
However, the internet has created the illusion that older S&Ws are more reliable because obviously it was impossible before the days of the internet to hear about every last instance of a lemon, and obviously by now any problematic pistols in circulation have by and large long since been serviced/repaired, so when you buy a used one any past issues it may have had were most likely addressed by the previous owner.
Furthermore, while modern CNC machining may be extremely efficient and cost much less, the tight tolerances and subsequent minimal amount of clearance between parts tends to result in the dreaded "break in" period which those who either don't enjoy shooting or own a firearm that shoots an otherwise expensive cartridge cringe at the very sound of.
Unfortunately, modern CNC machining just doesn't result in an out-of-the-box smooth action/trigger. However, that's not necessarily a bad thing because it provides you with an excuse to take it out, fondle in, work the actions, and shoot it.
