UPDATED: new info and serial# - 1942 Victory I may refinish…. need advice on bluing

[ChargerBill]

I'm looking at a Victory .38 S&W for a $200. The issue is that at some point it was stripped of it's finish. The gun has perfect lockup, the barrel is in great shape, and all the parts are there. It's a true Victory, not a converted one.

I am considering having it reblued but wanted to ask where you guys have found the best / most true to original bluing outfit and an estimate of pricing.

Thanks

 

[bigmtnman]

Have you considered parkerizing ?

 

[rct269]

Bluing-----------?? My knee-jerk reply is they were Parkerized, but having said that, maybe the early guns were blued. Whatever, there are a whole bunch of folks who are nuts for Victories, and have forgotten more than I know about them---and not many of them are so bashful they won't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Regardless of the final finish, I'd be inclined to have the surface prepared authentically---whatever that is----bead blasting/sand blasting.

Ralph Tremaine

 

[ChargerBill]

To be honest I really didn't know they were Parkerized. My intention is to have a nice looking useable gun that won't become botched in the process. Basically a functional restoration…even though I know the originality value is gone. I honestly don't care about that… I like shooting my guns and not having to worry about them rusting away. The historical value is really all I'm interested in with this particular gun.

Unless I can find a decent shooter grade with a fair amount of finish for less than $500…I'll just fix this one up.

 

[ChargerBill]

Ok, just looked up the parkerizing process and didn't realize it is the same as phosphating, which I have done to engine bay components on older car restorations.

Looks like I can refinish the gun myself. That's what is called a win win. Sweet!

 

[Muley Gil]

If you only want a shooter, just keep the stripped gun oiled or waxed.

I bought a stripped 1917 frame back around 2006. Between forum member tennexplorer and myself, we had enough parts to make a complete revolver. It is still in the white and hasn't rusted in all that time

 

[rct269]

Well, they were Parkerized---and blued (both Bright Blue and "sandblast blue")---and which depends on when. All these words of wisdom come to you from Charles W. Pate's 360 some-odd pages titled U.S.Handguns of World War II--- one of the many books I've owned for 20+ years without spending enough time with them.

So----you said 1942. They were "sandblast blue" until March (+/-), and sandblast "Black Magic" (parkerized) from then on to the end of the war. The folks at the SWHF (historical foundation) can tell you when your gun shipped. That information is part of what's provided in a so-called historical letter---and may be contained in this book, albeit perhaps less precisely.

"You pays your money, and you takes your pick."

Ralph Tremaine

And yes, Pate's book shows the number of guns shipped by month starting with October 1941, ending March 1945. Footnotes suggest that contracts for the .38-200 were completed in sequence----such lingo also suggests one could do the math and determine the month shipped for any particular serial number------assuming one knew which serial number was the first to go. (The limited time I've spent with this book suggests that information is also in there.)

 

[jeffrefrig]

ChargerBill, I kinda understand what you want to do, as I have (no comparison to yours) a Model 10-8 that is functionally in excellent condition but on close (within a few feet) examination it just begs for some love! It was 10 years old+/- when I got it 22 years ago. Kind of like a coroner, the worst I can do is bring it back to life! Every time I touch it I think re-blue. Lately it's been parkerizing it. Then I put it away until the next time. Whatever you do, I hope you let us know and maybe a picture or two; perhaps a $ sign followed by what you paid to make it look like it does. (If that makes any sense.) I'd like to have something cheap but good lookin'. And you guys know what I mean so keep your minds on guns!!!
Heck, a can of flat engine black could do!

 

[Absalom]

If the gun has a V prefix, the original finish was sandblast Black Magic and nothing else.

You can still get Black Magic from Hubbard-Hall:

https://www.hubbardhall.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Black-Magic.2.pdf

But appearance-wise the outcome isn't that different from parkerizing/phosphating, so if you can do the latter, and the gun's original finish is indeed stripped beyond salvage, I'd go for that.

 

[SS336]

If the gun has a V prefix, the original finish was sandblast Black Magic and nothing else.

You can still get Black Magic from Hubbard-Hall:

https://www.hubbardhall.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Black-Magic.2.pdf

But appearance-wise the outcome isn't that different from parkerizing/phosphating, so if you can do the latter, and the gun's original finish is indeed stripped beyond salvage, I'd go for that.

That was very interesting. Thanks for posting this.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

This is a Victory I did in my back yard with a portable sandblasting kit from Harbor Freight and an AGI Parkerizing kit from Brownell's. But, you don't need the Park kit if you can make your own solution or have some already.

 

[Igiveup]

Since acquiring some Victory revolvers, studying the history, etc., they have sort of become my favorite Smith revolver. I have a M10 2 1/2" snub I put together and the finish is not good. I have, so far, decided to get it CeraKoted (sp) by an outfit here in the county that does excellent work. I had a M1911A1 done a few years ago and it looks and works great. I have been waiting for their work load to subside some so they can do my revolver.

 

[ChargerBill]

I bought the gun today. He also had a second set / replacement hammer and trigger that still had nice case hardened color…the original ones were stripped also. He was trying to get $120 for the hammer and trigger as a set…I got everything plus 100 rounds of military ball ammo for $270. The gun has been purposefully stripped by someone prior to him owning it and it has minor surface rust.

My intention is to bead blast the whole thing (not the guts) and immediately store it in water displacing oil until I can get my home Parkerizing setup up and running.

The action is actually as nice as my Model 19 (which has had a trigger job and new mainspring and rebound spring) and the bore seems as though the gun was hardly fired…it is nicer than any of my 4 Smith revolvers.

I will update this post once my 10 days has passed and it is in my possession and then I will update the restoration process.

I do need a set of period correct grips…. if anyone out there has any leads.

I'm pretty excited to add this to my collection.

 

[ChargerBill]

That was very interesting. Thanks for posting this.

from what I recall he mentioned the "V" …so it must have been the Black Magic finish.

 

[serger]

Liberty Tree still has some that aren't trashed (at least mine weren't).
They are running about market price right now.

S&W Model 10 Victory Revolver Grips Used

 

[ChargerBill]

Thanks for the link

 

[glowe]

I'm looking at a Victory .38 S&W for a $200. The issue is that at some point it was stripped of it's finish. The gun has perfect lockup, the barrel is in great shape, and all the parts are there. It's a true Victory, not a converted one . . .

I believe all Victory revolvers were chambered in 38 Special, not 38 S&W. That is what the barrel stamping should say.

 

[Absalom]

I believe all Victory revolvers were chambered in 38 Special, not 38 S&W. That is what the barrel stamping should say.

Gary:

Within the approx. 800,000 guns of the V prefix, a very rough estimate puts about 350,000 US variants in .38 Special and 450,000 BSR variants in .38 S&W.

 

[glowe]

My point was that if it is chambered in 38 S&W it is not a Victory, but rather a BSR.

 

[Absalom]

My point was that if it is chambered in 38 S&W it is not a Victory, but rather a BSR.

Ah. It occurred to me later that you might be thinking along those lines. The Victory term is indeed used by some exclusively for the US variant.

However, it's important to keep in mind that the "Victory" term was not in common use during its active duty time. It appears in a few S&W advertisements for DSC revolvers during the war, but was used neither by the company nor by the military or any ofher users. If you'd asked a Navy pilot in 1944 about his "Victory model", you'd have gotten a blank stare.

The term did not become widespread until the post-war surplus trade. And since then it has been more common to apply it to all V-prefix revolvers, regardless of caliber. So just like BSR, it's an anachronistic collector term, and its acceptance isn't a matter of correctness, but consensus.