Newbie Interested In Beginner Reloading

[fredj338]

If you can bake a cake, you can make ammo.



What? God, no. Couldn't be less relevant until you start splitting hairs on crimp.

Okay, yeah, sure, I sort my brass by headstamp for .38 Spl, but that's purely for aesthetics (I like my crimps really pretty).



It actually doesn't. Guns is pretty tough. If you double-charge a case and seat a few thou deeper than is wise, however, yeah, boom-boom time.

Oh, and a .3cc dipper will drop 2.8 grains of Bullseye all day, which is fine and reasonable to either stay with, or to use as a starting point.

As for .380, it's tough as hell to find a powder bulky-enough for that. I got a pound of AA#2, and the VMD was way fluffier than the Lee book says it should be, and a .3cc Auto-Disk dropped exactly the 2.6gr charge I wanted.

Seen more than one plastic frame pistol KB with a double charge of fast powder. A steel frame gun may just blow grips off but seen cracked frames there too. A doubke charge of BE is probably responsible for blown 38 tjan anything else. Though TG is rapidly taking apart guns a ross yhe country from double charges.

 

[MyDads38]

I made a portable reloading stand from a Harbor Freight grinder stand and a piece of 2x12x48" board. Since I installed a Lee Bench Plate Kit, I can mount any of my 7 presses and load inside or outside on my porch/deck.

As much as I enjoy using my Lee Classic Loaders, I have several; I would suggest getting a single stage press kit plus dies for the calibers you want to load. The Lee Challenger kit comes with everything you need except dies and can be found on sale or used on Ebay. I think you would be much happier starting this way, but that's just my opinion.

 

[johngalt]

I often see a lot of indecision over what to buy, based on the cost of the press. If you become a serious reloader, the cost of the press is insignificant compared to the cost of the components, and in the money saved over buying factory ammo.

I didn't keep close track on what I spent on components, but it approximately went like this:

Started out on a LEE Anniversary kit, with the O type Challenger single stage press. The entire kit was about $100.

I quickly started spending more money, after learning that a lot of pieces in the kit made the job very tedious and frustrating:

The balance beam scale and Perfect (NOT!) powder measure were replaced with a Chargemaster 1500 (about $400 at the time).

The press was replaced with a Hornady LNL AP (about $400). But it had a free 1000 bullet offer, worth about $200. So net price of the press was about $200.

The LEE dies work in both presses, but I eventually replaced them with Hornady dies, for about another $120 or so. Shell plates, about another $100. Misc parts (bushings, powder dies, springs, etc). Wild guess, say another $200.

It adds up, and sounds expensive. I estimate I made it all up compared to buying factory ammo in less than 2 years.

I don't reload rifle, but the savings are much significant there. Factory rifle ammo runs $1 to $2 per round for the good stuff.

 

[Jellybean]

Lee's reloading manual is about the worst there is, but it is very good to have if you are using Lee products, especially their powder handling gear. You should still learn pretty much everything you'd need for the type of loading you plan on.

I don't remember which dippers came with which die sets as they are pretty well all in the same box now. I had used them without a scale for a long time...after the first divorce, and when I did get another scale I checked them for accuracy. If you use them properly, (pull the dipper through the powder once, scrape level with a card and pour, no shaking or tapping), you can get pretty consistent charges, although slightly less than they claim. And you can dip more than once as long as you keep track of what you are doing and can do simple math, such as; .3cc+.3cc=.6cc, .3cc+.5cc=.8cc and etc.

 

[s1mp13m4n]

I am enjoying my reading and learning thus far. Sure the Lee book is a bit of an advertising plug for the company, but heck Mr. Lee wrote the book. LOL I like the idea of the dippers and how the powder is measured by volume and not weight.

 

[ken158]

My first reloading experience was with a Lee Loader and I became so frustrated that I threw it away and continued to buy factory ammo... later, I met an experience reloader at a gun club and was invited to see his shop. Once I saw it and watched him load some rifle rounds for me, I finally "got it". I now load for handgun and rifle and never buy factory for other then CCW. Been loading now over 40 years... Buy good equipment up front because you will end up buying it sooner or later... READ a good loading manual several times (Lyman) and proceed.

 

[bigggbbruce]

I don't reload rifle, but the savings are much significant there. Factory rifle ammo runs $1 to $2 per round for the good stuff.

In the early 80's I bought a TC Contender.. 7MM TCU..

If I wanted to shoot it I had to load my own(same today)..

Adding other calibers was easy and an instant savings already having a press.

 

[mikerjf]

You've got lots of opinions here more educated than mine, but I went thru the process just a couple years back, so...

Lee loader is cool, it does work, but I hated putting in primers with it and you will need ear protection. Once I ponied up for a press I immediately wished I'd started there instead.

I bought a Lee classic single stage O press and 38 special carbide dies. It's quiet, easy to do primers, and way way quicker than the Lee Loader. Scoops for powder, 1 loading block, and a cheap digital scale to check my scooping. I might clean cases every few uses in a wash like you mention.

The press takes 3 bolts, if there's an old table you don't mind a few holes in you're there... or I've seen people make small platforms that attached to studs in a garage or basement.

Good luck and have fun!

 

[Biggfoot44]

The Whack a Mole works , and is your absolute minimal initial investment . 25-ish rounds per hour is the limiting factor . If absolute budget is your controling factor , then get one, and declare Victory . Beyond that, it's a slippery slope .

Next step up - Either new purchase Lee hand press , or whatever single stage press for cheap from yard sale, flea market, gun show, etc . Lee 3 die carbide pistol die set, which includes a dipper . Since you're starting from scratch , get a powder that is appropriate for your dipper . ( For 158gr lead .38spl , use .3 with WW 231 , .5 with Unique .) Get a Lee hand priming tool . The tactile control is far better than press mounted priming . At this point , jump in and start loading .

After a cpl sessions of carefully setting cases on flat table surface, and being very careful to not tip any over , you will eagerly $5ea or so for a cpl loading trays .

After hand cleaning a cpl thousand cases , you will eagerly purchase a case tumblet ( vibrator) , frequently on sale from one of the usual suspects online .

 

[fredj338]

I am enjoying my reading and learning thus far. Sure the Lee book is a bit of an advertising plug for the company, but heck Mr. Lee wrote the book. LOL I like the idea of the dippers and how the powder is measured by volume and not weight.

All volume measures are set by weight. The Elle book is the only data source using cc, everyone else uses grains. So the Lee book data is only valid wipth the powders in it, kinda limiting.
As noted, I dont get the idea of apsaving a few bucks loading with hand tools. Buy quality gear that minimizes your time imo. This doesnt mean everyone needs a profressive, but a ss press & powder measure make the work more enjoyable, probably better too. If uou only shoot 1000rds a year, better off buying factory ammo than reloading, unless you just want a hobby.

 

[muddocktor]

Hell, if you lived anywhere within 150 miles of my house I would give you a perfectly working Pacific 007 press, which is a predecessor to the Hornady Lock-N-Load Classic press. I upgraded to a Redding T-7 turret press and it's just sitting there under my bench gathering dust and waiting for a new reloader to gift it to. But shipping would probably be a bit much, so that's why I would rather give it to a local new reloader.

 

[Wise_A]

Seen more than one plastic frame pistol KB with a double charge of fast powder. A steel frame gun may just blow grips off but seen cracked frames there too. A doubke charge of BE is probably responsible for blown 38 tjan anything else. Though TG is rapidly taking apart guns a ross yhe country from double charges.

So we've migrated from "2.8 of BE in a .38Spl" to "fast powders in general". Mm'k. Couple fun things, cuz I'm such a fun guy.

*The "fast powders" thing is just so much boo-hoo and old hat. Don't like 'em? Fine. Let the rest of us live in peace, as they do a bunch of cool stuff.

*The NRA investigated back in the day and found the "double and a couple thou too deep" thing, which is where most of the whining originates from.

*Those "blown guns" commonly attributed to double charges are quite commonly caused by bullet setback. Same thing happens with cheap factory ammo pretty regularly.

*Don't tell the IPSC/IDPA/SC guys about TG "rapidly taking apart guns across the country".

*The hell does this have to do with anything?

 

[Imissedagain]

Setback

One would think that a beginner ...learning about loading ....would benefit with case trimming skills ...which might be ...never worked in a munitions factory ... a step in manufacturing quality ammo.

Later on they can wing it.
The only thing better than BE is more BE or ...N320 in 380 is sublime.

The OP should pour out some powders and ignite them just to see how they burn and the residue.

Three pounds of BE, Unique and 4198.... poured into three letters on our street... July 4th... decades ago.... gave my neighbors a smile. Next morning when a patrol car rolled by I pointed to my ATF neighbor and said.... he and his Cop buddies made me do it.
..But it was a lesson... Powder 101.

 

[roundgun]

I've been reloading for only 6 months and I love it. One thing you will notice is the reloading community is very generous with their knowledge and resources. Regardless what set up you choose to start with you will find assembling ammo very rewarding. I find my self staring less at a glowing screen in the evenings and more time with my kids as we build ammo. I recommend this activity to anyone who can respect the safety issues. You will become an asset to your family, neighbors, and community with your ability to provide knowledge and ammo from your labors. I suggest loading for your 357 first as it will be easier than the 380 due to physical size, read being able to view powder charge. Good luck and welcome to the reloading family.

 

[Imissedagain]

I've been reloading for only 6 months and I love it. One thing you will notice is the reloading community is very generous with their knowledge and resources. Regardless what set up you choose to start with you will find assembling ammo very rewarding. I find my self staring less at a glowing screen in the evenings and more time with my kids as we build ammo. I recommend this activity to anyone who can respect the safety issues. You will become an asset to your family, neighbors, and community with your ability to provide knowledge and ammo from your labors. I suggest loading for your 357 first as it will be easier than the 380 due to physical size, read being able to view powder charge. Good luck and welcome to the reloading family.

Roger that!
A Well Regulated family activity.... as is learning to tie your own tackle.... occasionally "load" development as well... in hindsight.

 

[Wise_A]

One would think that a beginner ...learning about loading ....would benefit with case trimming skills ...which might be ...never worked in a munitions factory ... a step in manufacturing quality ammo.

Later on they can wing it.

It's not going to teach anything besides turning a crank.

.38, .357, and .380 are not going to stretch very much(or shrink, depending on what you believe). Failing to trim cases for those cartridges will not impede function. It will not provide any better accuracy with mixed brass. You could do it entirely wrong, and nothing noticeable would happen.

All it will do is cause OP, who has already stated that budget is an issue, to drop $100 or more on a trimmer and deburr/chamfer tool.

 

[Imissedagain]

The current Lee #90685 is an aluminum frame.
Will load 25 458WinMags and 25 460S&W Mags ASAP.
Sized/deprimed two Hornady once fired cases with RCBS carbides.

Lee makes simple hand case trimmers .... check Brownells.

My boy's Marine Gunnery Sergeant buddy will not tech code for machining until they get the feel of operating manually.
The wives are skilled veterinary surgeons who, despite what cheapo doctors do, operating tools and areas are sterile.

Threads give people options, both technically correct and philosophically diverse..... they can decide how to Run.

Have fun
Stay safe

 

[s1mp13m4n]

I have finished reading the Lee reloading book, yet did not see an answer to this question. If you were to reload standard presure loads using the Lee data, dippers, etc, how long will the brass last? How many times on average can you reload it before it becomes unsafe?

 

[arjay]

Brass from low pressure pistol rounds lasts a very long time.The case mouth will eventually develop cracks and then you can just toss them.Bottleneck rifle brass does wear out sooner and you need to watch for a bright ring just above the webbing.Toss them when that shows up

 

[Wise_A]

I have finished reading the Lee reloading book, yet did not see an answer to this question. If you were to reload standard presure loads using the Lee data, dippers, etc, how long will the brass last? How many times on average can you reload it before it becomes unsafe?

You could shoot .38 Spl until the headstamp wears off. People actually have. The limiting factor wouldn't even be the pressure of the load, in most cases (a few cases are going to split prematurely, right down the side). What will actually can the brass is the amount of case mouth expansion and crimp you apply. The case mouth will work-harden and split. Ever straighten a paperclip, and then bent it repeatedly until it broke? That's work-hardening in action.

I believe Guns and Ammo did a test with .38 Spl brass once, starting with a batch of ammo and dies set up to work the brass as little as possible. That took too long, so they resorted to just firing and reloading the same case repeatedly. I can't remember precisely, but I believe they loaded that one case 120-130 times before it finally cracked at the mouth.

.45 ACP will last until the headstamp is illegible from ejector scars. Probably ditto with .380. I don't even bother to track that brass, I figure I lose enough to keep my brass "fresh".

Rifle is a different matter, as the pressure causes brass to flow from the base to the mouth. That's why brass needs to be trimmed (depending on a bunch of things, including cartridge design...some rifle cartridges rarely, if ever, need to be trimmed). After a given number of trims, enough metal has migrated out of the base that the case will fail.

 

[Engineer1911]

It is worth repeating ! !

Before I trimmed all my 357 mag and 44 mag brass, I frequently had to force a case out of the cylinder. Sometimes that case did not slide easily into the shell holder.

After I trimmed all my magnum brass, I never had another stuck case and crimps were all consistent. I did not deburr any of the case mouths, sizer die removed outside burr, flaring the case mouth removed inside burr.

I have also measured slow case growth on my 45-70 brass. I trimmed once with no more problems. I have posted this several times in the past regarding trimming straight wall cases. I have never trimmed 9 MM, 40 S&W, or 45 ACP brass.

QUOTE:

I had this set-up when I was a geo-bachelor for a while. I washed my brass in a bucket. I had my press bolted to a 2x4 that I clamped to the table. For basic, straight-wall stuff, it was completely adequate.
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QUOTE


NOBODY, I mean NOBODY can reload quality accurate ammo with a reloading set-up this simple. You gots to have more STUFF ! ! ! Equipment manufacturers will go out of business if you keep thins this simple.

 

[Wise_A]

How is trimming the brass going to help it get into the shell holder? For that matter, what could trimming fix that would cause extraction difficulty, but not attendant loading difficulty?

I suspect you either had a bullet issue, or more likely, an issue with seating depth. Shortening the case slightly "fixed" an issue while keeping the same OAL, but you probably could have gotten the same result out of turning a knob.

I know because I made a batch of .38 Spls exactly like that, so I stopped seating the bullets so deep and the problem went away.