I rented a tiny little Nissan once when my vehicle was needing a repair that took a day and a half. I took my wife to dinner that night and the car got a flat tire on the highway so I called the rental car place and they said "no problem we'll send someone over right away to fix it". So we sat there about 15 minutes and I called them back and asked approximately how long before the repair guy gets here, and they said "oh not much longer another 45 minutes or so". I said "forget it, I'm hungry I'll fix it myself" and had the tire changed in 10 minutes and was off to the restaurant. Where Tesla screwed the pooch was getting away from their original plan of having replaceable batteries. You pull in a service station or convenience store and the battery drops down out of the bottom of your car and machine takes it and puts in a new battery. Their prototypes worked great and the whole process takes under 60 seconds and your on your way and you could still charge your battery from your house or other location. I could see gasoline filling stations adding a battery swapping machine or two and electric cars becoming pretty widespread in 10 years or so if Tesla would have stuck to that plan.
WHILE SOME MAY APPLAUD THE TESLA'S MY OPINION IS NOW A BIT DIFFERENT!
- Thread starter chief38
- Start date
oddshooter
Member
This is an amazing thread. I had no idea how many people hated Tesla.
For me, it wasn't the electric part that convinced me; it was the future of full self driving (FSD) vehicles. FSD reacts to the environment 20 times faster than a human. Safety is many times better. ICE cars could have these features as well; but don't.
My Model Y on the freeway in "Autopilot" is one of the most amazing experiences of a lifetime. It was embarrassing and then humiliating to discover how much better a driver the Autopilot was than me. A 7 hour roadtrip from LA to Phoenix required a 20 minute lunch break at the River to recharge. I arrived the most relaxed and anxiety free of any trip ever at 71 years old. Before this, I had questions about taking any trips more than a few hours.
Elon Musk and Tesla automatically upgraded to the beta version FSD last Tuesday for the cars owned by what they call expert, safe drivers. I didn't qualify. Maybe in a few weeks I will get my free auto upgrade of the Y . My Model Y is already better than when I bought it and getting better for years to come.
I invest in the future: robot surgeries, bioscience, genetics, artificial intelligence, visual computing, chip design. The future seems quite clear to me whether I like it or not; and I don't like it.
However, standing in front of a Trend is like standing in front of a moving train.
I love wilderness camping above all other things. It requires self reliance and rewards you with solitude. Getting away from people and machines is just a great thing for me. I describe myself as a country boy; I'm a revolver and handloader nut.
FSD is a game changer for me.
Prescut
For me, it wasn't the electric part that convinced me; it was the future of full self driving (FSD) vehicles. FSD reacts to the environment 20 times faster than a human. Safety is many times better. ICE cars could have these features as well; but don't.
My Model Y on the freeway in "Autopilot" is one of the most amazing experiences of a lifetime. It was embarrassing and then humiliating to discover how much better a driver the Autopilot was than me. A 7 hour roadtrip from LA to Phoenix required a 20 minute lunch break at the River to recharge. I arrived the most relaxed and anxiety free of any trip ever at 71 years old. Before this, I had questions about taking any trips more than a few hours.
Elon Musk and Tesla automatically upgraded to the beta version FSD last Tuesday for the cars owned by what they call expert, safe drivers. I didn't qualify. Maybe in a few weeks I will get my free auto upgrade of the Y . My Model Y is already better than when I bought it and getting better for years to come.
I invest in the future: robot surgeries, bioscience, genetics, artificial intelligence, visual computing, chip design. The future seems quite clear to me whether I like it or not; and I don't like it.
However, standing in front of a Trend is like standing in front of a moving train.
I love wilderness camping above all other things. It requires self reliance and rewards you with solitude. Getting away from people and machines is just a great thing for me. I describe myself as a country boy; I'm a revolver and handloader nut.
FSD is a game changer for me.
Prescut
JJEH
Member
I don't hate it but I think it's overrated. But Musk is a smart guy, he'll do just fine.
This is not good and I won't ever support it. Another reason why I pulled out of the Fisker pre-order. He wants to go down the same path... AI and self driving features.
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DWalt
Member
It may take a leap of faith, patience, and considerable risk tolerance, but I think the best financial move for the future would be investing to the maximum in some of the many exchange traded funds specializing in technology, including electric vehicles, autonomous vehicles, batteries, computer technology, AI, the Cloud, software, data storage, etc. And don't forget electric utility stocks and power grid technology. All that electricity which will be necessary to power vehicles has to come from somewhere and be distributed to everywhere.
Don’t start a USPS, FEDEX, UPS, NFL, NBA, gun lube, or the sky is blue isn’t it? thread.
Ah, yes. Reminds me of the infamous Tesla "Cybertruck" test where Tesla's Chief Exec, Elon Musk, had a guy from the audience come up and test out Tesla's "Armor Glass" by throwing a metal ball at the windows. Supposed to be "unbreakable." Uh...yeah...sure.
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqGf8pqCZi0"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqGf8pqCZi0[/ame]
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqGf8pqCZi0"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqGf8pqCZi0[/ame]
Seen a lot of them "Greener than thou" types that drive a Pious (no that isn't a typo or spell check error)
Nope, you're 100% correct. As I posted in this other thread (http://smith-wessonforum.com/lounge/622647-2022-fisker-ocean.html#post140885648), we currently generate 4.1 trillion kW of electricity and have brownouts because it isn't enough for current demand. Replacing gasoline and diesel as fuels with electricity would require another 7.1 trillion kW - basically we'd need to generate triple the amount of electricity we currently produce.
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Ματθιας;140951030 said:
Cause that little ole south Georgia small town dealer didn't have one.
Ματθιας said:
That salesman wished the same thing but the parts department guy had done left for the evening and Dad ain't leaving without the right spare or his money back. Orderin twern't an option!
Ματθιας said:
The only other two Crown Vics on the lot had the tiny spare too. Remember, this is a small town dealership in farm country. They don't stock too many cars.
Ματθιας said:
Yep! Don't know where the salesman got it. Maybe that junkyard!
Well my new Jeep Grand Cherokee has a spare and so does my 2017. 2017 GC came with a spare and just need to order the option on new ones. They also go over 500 miles highway on one tank and takes 5 minutes to fill, compared to 8 hours to charge every 300 miles on electric cars!! If you never take a driving vacation, fine, but living in rural area of the country, not one advantage to owning an all electric car. Good news is that I will be dead before the government requires that everybody has to own electric cars.
THE PILGRIM
Member
Hold on - this morning I saw a Tesla that I liked.
A Good Looking Lady was driving it!
A Good Looking Lady was driving it!
DWalt
Member
What anyone thinks about today's EVs is immaterial. The fact is, like any other technology, it is inevitable that the bugs (even those involving spare tires) will get worked out and EVs (not limited to passenger vehicles) will evolve into practical and economical means of transportation. I predict EVs having features well beyond anything available today will begin to dominate the roads sometime within the next 20 years if not sooner. It's already reached the critical mass necessary to support rapid development, as there are hundreds of companies all over the world now working 24/7 on EVs and related support technologies such as lighter and higher capacity batteries and autonomous driving capabilities. Drawing a computer analogy, EVs are in the stage of development today that personal computers were in the early 1980s, back when all we had were Timex and TRS-80 computers and no one had yet heard of Windows and LED displays.
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Nope. There's only so much energy density you can achieve with a battery. Absent a radical breakthrough in how store electrical energy, we'll only see modest and incremental improvements.
As is, EV is built on the backs of environmentally disastrous 3rd world Lithium mines and kids in the Congo hand digging Cobalt for motor magnets.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/business/batteries/congo-cobalt-mining-for-lithium-ion-battery/
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20150402-the-worst-place-on-earth
Yep, great stuff- until you look under the hood.
LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
Back to horse and buggy??
At least the by-product is organic and can make things grow instead of killing everything....
This response misses a central issue, which is the simple fact that the electrical power to charge the batteries must come from somewhere and be delivered to the point of use (charging station, residential outlet, whatever). The vast majority of electrical energy is generated using fossil fuels, converting that fossil fuel energy to electrical energy is nowhere near an even trade, and transmitting that electrical power from point of generation to point(s) of use is less than 100% efficient.
Short version, more fossil fuel energy must be consumed in order to create the electricity than the amount of fossil fuel required to operate a comparable vehicle with internal combustion energy, and the ratio is further steepened by the losses caused by delivery of that energy over the power grid.
Fossil fuel emissions are necessarily greater when using the electric vehicle, thus more of that stuff that you are worried about "killing everything" is the result.
The people operating electric vehicles as their way of saving the planet are actually causing greater harm than those operating comparable automobiles powered by fossil fuels.
The actual ratio involved will necessarily vary by power generation source and location, as well as the vehicle involved. The point to keep in mind is that 1 plus any other number will always equal more than 1.
Interesting technology, but neither economically or ecologically feasible at the present time. Those now using the electric vehicles are doing so largely via subsidies provided by every taxpayer, and everyone is being subjected to a greater amount of emissions as the result.
There is no reduction in emissions, there is an increase in emissions. The only difference is where the emissions take place; with electric vehicles the emissions occur at the power generation source (in proportionately greater quantities), while emissions from internal combustion engines go out the tail pipe (in proportionately lesser quantities).
Then, of course, there will be that little problem somewhere in the future when a large and ever-increasing number of worn out batteries must be disposed of, hopefully without further damage to the ecology. Regardless of specific types of batteries each will always have a finite number of charge-discharge cycles, and the contents (chemicals and heavy metals) are some of the more dangerous stuff to be dealt with. Some level of recycling may be possible, but that will require significant costs and additional energy consumption.
Ματθιας;140950720 said:
Here’s my 50/50 Highway/City mix over last few tanks:
riverrat38
US Veteran
Shoot, I had this Lithium Battery thing all wrong. I have always assumed that Lithium referred to Dilithium crystals. I didn't know that they needed recharging. That doesn't make much sense. We have been led to believe that batteries make energy. Sounds like they just store it. Whoda thunk it!
The first law of thermodynamics says that we can't get ahead. The second says that we can't even break even.
Zero emissions means zero tailpipe emissions. It doesn't mean zero smokestack emissions.
"Partial zero emission vehicle". What does partial zero mean? I don't remember that from math class. It's not rocket science. It's not any kind of science. Just Bravo Sierra!
We are being conditioned for the future. I am not against electric vehicles, just junk science. I started engineering college in 1961. I remember making a list of things that I thought would be worthwhile to work on. One was to improve the efficiency of storage batteries to make electric vehicles practical. The rest of the technology is at least as old as gas engines.
Best,
Rick
One hundred grand and no spare???
...ok.
Most of us who learned to change a flat as part of the driving experience would be very surprised at how many new cars have no spare. Some very expensive machines have a can of sealant and a little air compressor in the trunk...
IIRC the US, and most of the "first world" nations, went into
negative population growth in late Seventies. Most of the
contemporary positive population growth occurs in (the
formerly) second & third world nations.
LVSteve
Member
Here’s my 50/50 Highway/City mix over last few tanks:
Try driving in lighter shoes. My Mercedes ML is getting about double that, but it is a diesel.
I don't hate Telsas, I think they are amazing. My point is that trying to replace all the combustion engines in this country in another 20 years is nearly impossible and totally impractical. Getting enough Lithium and enough electricity just isn't in the cards. But, all the greenies want to ignore those 2 facts.
Short term hydrocarbon free is stupid! We would be better of spending the money to make coal fired plants emission free and go to hybrids. To me hybrids make lots of sense. Range, the ability to convert braking back into power, efficiency of electric drive train. Less battery capacity and weight needed. When combustion engine kicks in it runs at optimum rpm for efficiency.
Trains have been electric drive train for years as have many ships. The average for trains works out to be 435.88 ton-miles per gallon of fuel. Semi trucks average under 200 ton miles per gallon. A diesel electric truck should display increased efficiency especial if coupled to a battery bank that could convert braking and down hill dynamics back into energy instead of engine hold back, even by Jake brakes and brake friction. The huge unit rigs used in mines are diesel electrics now. No transmission, no drive shaft, no 3rd member, Just an engine some wires and a electric motor with stubs out both sides for the drive axle. Reverse? Just switch polarity. Near 100% torque at 0 rpm. More speed? Just vary the cycles on to the motor. On boats an engine, wiring, a motor with a thrust bearing on the drive stub.
If I had more time and money it would be fun to take a small pickup, install a inverter type portable welder for a drive source and electric motor to the third member housing. Maybe later add some lithium batteries.
I wish I was rich and 30 years old. I would blow every dime on fast cars and wild women, just like I did before with my oil field money. But, if I was really rich they would be even faster cars and even wilder women. LMAO That way when I became an old fat fart again I could drift back and smile thinking about my "misspent" years even more.
Short term hydrocarbon free is stupid! We would be better of spending the money to make coal fired plants emission free and go to hybrids. To me hybrids make lots of sense. Range, the ability to convert braking back into power, efficiency of electric drive train. Less battery capacity and weight needed. When combustion engine kicks in it runs at optimum rpm for efficiency.
Trains have been electric drive train for years as have many ships. The average for trains works out to be 435.88 ton-miles per gallon of fuel. Semi trucks average under 200 ton miles per gallon. A diesel electric truck should display increased efficiency especial if coupled to a battery bank that could convert braking and down hill dynamics back into energy instead of engine hold back, even by Jake brakes and brake friction. The huge unit rigs used in mines are diesel electrics now. No transmission, no drive shaft, no 3rd member, Just an engine some wires and a electric motor with stubs out both sides for the drive axle. Reverse? Just switch polarity. Near 100% torque at 0 rpm. More speed? Just vary the cycles on to the motor. On boats an engine, wiring, a motor with a thrust bearing on the drive stub.
If I had more time and money it would be fun to take a small pickup, install a inverter type portable welder for a drive source and electric motor to the third member housing. Maybe later add some lithium batteries.
I wish I was rich and 30 years old. I would blow every dime on fast cars and wild women, just like I did before with my oil field money. But, if I was really rich they would be even faster cars and even wilder women. LMAO That way when I became an old fat fart again I could drift back and smile thinking about my "misspent" years even more.
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