Target loads do not blow up guns. Ever. Stuck bullets and double and triple charges of powder blow up guns.
Why not Elmer Keith that 38 special
- Thread starter IAM Rand
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100 extra FPS loads won’t blow up the gun, they’ll just slowly batter the frame until you have excess end shake and excess head space issues.
Full case and bullseye should never be used in the same sentence.
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shil
Member
Ah, yes. Elmer the madman. No disrespect intended. Standard pressure loads with a commercial lead round nosed bullet suit my .38 revolvers and me just fine. Strictly recreational. If more power is craved................ .357 Magnum.
Please correct me Rosewood or anyone. But when I started getting too hot with my reloads, the first sign in .357 magnum was always slightly flattened primers. No load should ever cause that right? Always back off at the first sign right? Sometimes I got sticky cases. That is a sign too right?
Pardon my ignorance but I only ever use a Lee Loader, the hand loader with the hammer yaknow, and only to reload low pressure practice stuff in 357 and 44 spl.
Kind Regards!
BrianD
Pardon my ignorance but I only ever use a Lee Loader, the hand loader with the hammer yaknow, and only to reload low pressure practice stuff in 357 and 44 spl.
Kind Regards!
BrianD
I have owned 2 "blown up" guns The first was a S&W 1917. It was not blown up but had 4 45 cal 230 gr bullets in the bbl. The bbl was split on left side and bent left. Got it at a gun show for 50 bucks. I was going to put it in a shadow box..a fellow came by and offered me 200 bucks for it. Next gun show he had the gun at the show new bbl and according to him shot fine..I would say at least one squib. The 2nd is a 8 inch Nickle Python. I has no top strap...and only 1/2 a cylinder. If it had a topstrap...I could put a bew cyl in and guarantee it would be ok. I got one round out of the 1/2 cyl...pulled the reload apart. It had 10.6 gr of 296 and a 158 gr XTP in it. It actually looks as though it detonated as some said could happen. I was alwas skeptical of the statement. New gun...shot 1 round. The owner said the load was supposed to be a max load of 296...he missed it by about 50%...And as someone stated earlier I too have seen at leas 3 M=10 that had bww rechambered to accept 357s...and been shot fairly extensively. Also saw a Taurus 38 that would shoot 357s...but not by me
Not always, some primers are softer than others, but I can tell you, even factory 357 mag loads and 10mm loads may have flattened primers. That doesn't necessarily mean they are over pressure.
If you ever see flattened primers in a 38 special or 45 acp, you better stop shooting however.
Rosewood
K-22
Member
Flowback
When you see flattened primers, and flow back, it is time ro reexamine your priorities.
Best,
Gary
When you see flattened primers, and flow back, it is time ro reexamine your priorities.
Best,
Gary
Patrick L
Member
If you're shooting by yourself, maybe. If the guy 10 feet away at the range has a catastrophic failure, how do the flying pieces of topstrap know who loaded the ammo?
I was on a skeet squad with one of our club's "knowlegeable reloaders" (ie often questions published data) when he blew out the barrel of a really nice Caesar Guerini. As I understand it it was his third career blowup. We were on station 7, and the left side of his barrel blew out. Anyone who shoots skeet can visualize the situation. The entire rest of the squad was about 6-8 feet away, to the left... In over 40 years of shooting, I have encountered exactly two people I flat out refuse to shoot with. He is one of the two.
If it truly is your gun, your hand, your eyes etc. go for it. It just often ain't JUST yours...
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elgatodeacero
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.38 Special Plus P is rated around 18,500 PSI.
.357 Magnum is rated around 35,000 PSI.
It is foolish to think firearms rated to handle .38 Special (even Plus P) will be safe with pressures higher than rated, and it is foolish to suggest that they would be safe at pressures nearly double the manufacturers rating.
OP is not a serious person.
.357 Magnum is rated around 35,000 PSI.
It is foolish to think firearms rated to handle .38 Special (even Plus P) will be safe with pressures higher than rated, and it is foolish to suggest that they would be safe at pressures nearly double the manufacturers rating.
OP is not a serious person.
smoothshooter
Member
So, while I was sitting on my throne reading the latest edition of my Shooting Illustrated I started pondering the 38 special. There is a review of the new Taurus Defender 856. You can put a red dot on it. Nothing that I was that wowed by. In looking at it, it appears to be a very sturdy 38 revolver. It is listed as a +p. That is what got me thinking.
With the better metallurgy in pistols today, why can't you do the Elmer Keith and load the 38 to 357 velocities I understand that you will want to keep these loads away from the older models but, in something like this Defender, I would imagine that you should be able to shoot some hot stuff out of it. Even if you didn't in a 38 Special revolver, why can't you reload some really hot rounds and use them in a 357.
All of this leads to the ultimate debate, why not just buy a 357 and then you can go either. Well, that is for another thread. If someone is willing to buy a good quality 38 Special, why can't you load it hot?
Just something I was pondering on my throne.
Why load it so hot?
.38 Special in standard and +P loadings is an excellent cartridge in it’s own right.
smoothshooter
Member
I quit shooting full-powered.357 handgun loads 40 years ago.
I got tired of the concussive muzzle blast and sharp recoil.
Switched to shooting .44 Special, .45 ACP, and low-end .44 Magnum and have lived happily ever-after. Same or better results on steel knock-downs and critters with less blast, and it matters not if the bullets expand.
Stayed at home last night rather than a room at the Holiday Inn. So ... what I think is qualified by a plebian past uninformed by any real education beyond the School of Hard Knocks. Once upon a time when my life was young, I ventured to handload some rootin tootin homeloads for my six inch 28-2. I took whatever powders/bullets I had and loaded them with some guidance from the reloading manuals. Unfortunately, I fiddled around and found out that routinely exceeding the loading levels of the manual had untoward consequences on my revolver. Suffice it to say there came a day when I found that no matter what I did, my revolver had problems. In ignorance, I believed what I was told, i.e., that the gun was badly worn ... that it would be expensive to repair. Revolver ended up traded off. Looking back, imagine the repairs would not have been quite so expensive. But, I learned a lesson. Still load for my rifles and pistols. Have lots of fun. One day I'll tell you all about matriculating in the course for post-graduate School of Hard Knocks. Course work was with a M-70 Winchester ... caliber .243. Sincerely. bruce.
So, while I was sitting on my throne reading the latest edition of my Shooting Illustrated I started pondering the 38 special. There is a review of the new Taurus Defender 856. You can put a red dot on it. Nothing that I was that wowed by. In looking at it, it appears to be a very sturdy 38 revolver. It is listed as a +p. That is what got me thinking.
With the better metallurgy in pistols today, why can't you do the Elmer Keith and load the 38 to 357 velocities I understand that you will want to keep these loads away from the older models but, in something like this Defender, I would imagine that you should be able to shoot some hot stuff out of it. Even if you didn't in a 38 Special revolver, why can't you reload some really hot rounds and use them in a 357.
All of this leads to the ultimate debate, why not just buy a 357 and then you can go either. Well, that is for another thread. If someone is willing to buy a good quality 38 Special, why can't you load it hot?
Just something I was pondering on my throne.
My 38/44 was bored to .357 when I got. So that's what I've shot in it for years.........On the 38 spl's made today you'd be better of with staying with what it's chambered for. Iffen you like your eyes and fingers.
I hope you aren't reloading. If you are, you shouldn't be.
No, that's not remotely what he said.
In a nutshell, he said higher pressures should be OK in a modern revolver. And he's probably right. Just because I, and evidently a lot of other people don't care to do it, doesn't make him wrong.
I don't understand why this has caused 4 pages of contentiousness.
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Perhaps because he said this, as in a direct quote.
"With the better metallurgy in pistols today, why can't you do the Elmer Keith and load the 38 to 357 velocities" He came to this question after looking at a picture of the revolver in a magazine.
Now lets see here. The only way to load a 38 special to 357 mag velocities with most bullets is to load a 38 special ABOVE 357 mag pressures.
Then later on he said this in reference to others.
"Oh well, like I said above, every man's gotta know their limitations. I know mine but, still like pushing the envelope a little every now and then."
Perhaps his posting style invites some contentiousness?
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